 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Erin
Date: 2004-05-09 23:32
Hi There,
Do any of you know where I can find and purchase a ReeDual Machine, used or new? Thanks,
Erin
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Author: mw
Date: 2004-05-09 23:47
Contact info from the Retail Page here. George Crossman is whom you will deal with. Usual backlog ( I think its really a "wait" ) is 5-7 months last I checked. Payment in advance around $600+ incl. shipping. Used models appear for sale now & then, but less often than many buyers would like. Buying a used one can be problematic, especiially if you don't know how to run the machine. Tom Ridenour had a ReeDual that he had modified - it worked much better than a regularly equipped model.
ReeDual
Rabco/G. Crossman
238 Corsair Ave
Lauderdale-by-the-sea
FL 33308 USA
Accessories
PS Making your own reeds is very time consuming & is way more "romantic" or "neat" than it is practical. I speak from personal experience. This is not to imply that people are not successful at making their own reeds - because many people ARE very successful at making their own reeds! However, it is time consuming & much more expensive in the short-to-mid run. I suppose it's somewhat like Wind Energy - the payback can take forever. Difference is that with reedmaking you really are NOT saving the environment. 
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Author: woodwind650
Date: 2004-05-12 07:57
let me tell you my thoughts.........
i just recently purchased a reedual from george....
1st: it DID NOT cost over $600 to get one.
2nd: the reedual DID NOT take 5-7 months to get either. i waited approximately 3-4 WEEKS for the unit to get to my house. george crossman is a very nice individual and can include any extra accessories if you need them [ie sandpaper, etc.]
3rd: Reedmaking IS NOT a waste of time, NOR is it time consuming to make reeds. you can save lots of time buy purchasing your own "blanks" and making them from those. but if you really want to make them from tubes [which i highly recommend!], then at the most you only spend about 20 minutes a day sanding your blanks once you've made them, and that's only if you're dealing with more than 15 at a time.
Making reeds is the best thing i've ever done for myself and my clarinet playing. you save money in the long run and you're making reeds that are a custom fit for your mouthpiece and embouchure. the sound is darker, more projecting, AND they last much longer that regular commercial reeds
THE KEY: you need to have someone reliable show you how to use the machine well, and someone who knows what they're doing when it comes to reedmaking. it's apparent that "MW", might not have had the benefit of someone to show him/her. i would disagree w/"MW" and say that reedmaking is VERY "PRACTICAL"and that i don't make reeds for the neat or romantic value of the process. why should this be exclusive for double reed players????
i've been making clarinet reeds now for over 6 months and they're phenomenal!!!! i'm happy to say that i'm also making bass clarinet reeds also on the reedual and they're just as amazing and i stress, THIS IS NOT TIME CONSUMING whatsoever!!!! i know "MW" isn't saying that there aren't succesful clarinet reed makers, i just want to stress that some of his/her info might be a little one-sided.
i hope this information was helpfull and here is George's Website link.
--Steve, San Francisco--
http://hometown.aol.com/georgeorrabco/myhomepage/business.html
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Author: woodwind650
Date: 2004-05-12 08:08
forgot to mention that george has made some modifications to the machine and i purchased his newest model. it runs great and is more accurate than his older machines. if you're going to get one, don't buy used unless it's his most current model.
--steve--
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Author: mw
Date: 2004-05-12 17:33
woodwind650 said:
"it's apparent that "MW", might not have had the benefit of someone to show him/her" ...
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How do you know this about me?
woodwind650 also said:
".... THIS IS NOT TIME CONSUMING whatsoever!!!!"
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Perhaps we don't value our time equally or measure time in the same manner. I measure (elapsed) time by the HOUR. 20 minutes a day quickly adds up - frankly, I think overall time involved with testing & modifying might require more time.
woodwind650 also said:
"... the sound is darker, more projecting, AND they last much longer that regular commercial reeds."
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What evidence do you have to support a different sound or longer life?
woodwind650 also said:
"i would disagree w/"MW" and say that reedmaking is VERY "PRACTICAL"
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I didn't say it was IMpractical. Rather, I compared it to romantic notions, which I still (very much) do. To get started, it's very expensive. Economic Payback is a long time - I am a CPA & I'll certify that statement! Many years to payback. See my BTW: @ bottom about "bad batches" of Tube Cane.
Now, is it "VERY PRACTICAL" ---- sorry, I don't see it that way. IF ... it were "very practical" many, many more people would be doing this - that is, making reeds with the ReeDual. Everyone/anyone who teaches Reedmaking will stress the time involved. Check Klarinet Archives for the discussions & opinions of some fine clarinetists who have related their ReeDual experiences.
My experiences with the ReeDual were, for the most part, positive. However, I did try & point out all the pro's & con's of owning one. I would agree that Geerge Crossman was great to deal with. The ReeDual price I quoted was with shipping & handling & insurance. 2 years ago in late Summer - arrived around Xmas. George can confirm this. No doubt that order time varies at times based upon demand & time of year.
Very high quality Norton-brand Sandpaper is available for much lower prices via Home Depot, etc. - check the web.
Finally, high quality Blanks have gotten pretty expensive, IMO. I like the FOF Blanks ... Tom Ridenour really liked the Marca blanks (at least at his last master class I attended), etc. etc. Good quality French Cane (like Glotin) has become very expensive because of the increased shipping costs, fall in value of $ against other currencies & cane price increases. One pound of Glotin Tube Cane costs $69.00 plus shipping at Weiner Music. How many reeds can be made from one pound of cane?
BTW IMPORTANT NOTE : Speaking of overall costs - let's talk about what happens when you get a bad batch of Cane. That is, Tube Cane which is lousy. WASTE OF MONEY. IME: I have tried cheap Tube Canes & was able to produce terrible reeds. I can give you references, too - other Reedmakers who agree (probably more emphatically) with my statement.
Post Edited (2004-05-12 20:32)
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Author: donald
Date: 2004-05-12 20:16
hmmmm
i was lucky to get my reedual for 50 pounds from Howarth Music
"oh, that's a piece of junk, it doesn't work properly" (from the salesman) translated into "there's nothing wrong with it except that no one knows how to use it properly"
meanwhile
if you don't want to make your own reeds, the "dual" is still very useful- for adjusting/balancing reeds it can save a lot of time.
as an example, i reccently spent 15 minutes (while talking with a friend) adjusting about 7 or 8 Gonzalez reeds that i had been unable to use, all of those became usable reeds (although none of them are quite concert reeds- a result of haste rather than anything else i'd say).
donald
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Author: mw
Date: 2004-05-12 20:30
Donald, I agree 100% & you came by your ReeDual quite reasonably.
Ridenour's new tools & video are getting equal reed adjustment results - at least according to many player's around the world.
Charles Bay recently came out with his "improved idea" of a ReeDual, complete with diamond bit. Price: $1500US + shipping. Bay says that the diamond bit works much better than sandpaper.
AND, if we are talking about elapsed time to finished product - Robert Dilutis' Reed Machine can make a reed from tube cane (scratch) in about 2-4 minutes with all adjustments. I have seen Robert do it many times now.
What would the clarinet world do without it's Gizmo's ? lol
Post Edited (2004-05-12 20:30)
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Author: mw
Date: 2004-05-12 20:45
Sorry, now that I think about it - we have omitted some TOOLS that you might need or want to use with the ReeDual & other make-your-own reed systems.
For Tube Cane - 4-way Cane Splitter - quarters the cane.
Tools are available from 3 purveyors that I know: Biker Bil (Jackson) @ Speedreeds in CO, Robert Dilutis @ Reed Machine & Weiner Music who carries SpeedReed and Reed Machine products. I bought my splitter from Bill & it was around $100. You can split on your own but Bil's cane Splitter makes it easy. I see that RDG has one too - but no photos.
You might also consider a Reed Profiler, Base, etc. Here are links :
http://www.speedreed.com
http://www.frontiernet.net/~reedmach
http://www.weinermusic.com/CLARINET%20ACCESSORIES/REED%20MACHINE.html
Post Edited (2004-05-12 20:57)
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Author: kenni
Date: 2004-05-14 22:36
mw. you could buy all the bad cane in the world and spend a lot of money. but of course you know that you could write it all off. ack... you're a cpa... you know that already.
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Author: mw
Date: 2004-05-14 23:50
Yes, for a professional all the costs of reeds - whether buying or making - are fully tax-deductible in the U.S.
However, whether you use a ReeDual, Reed Machine, or simply Make Them By Hand ala Opperman, John Mohler, etc., there is one thing that all Reedmakers have in common - absolute disgust for over-aged, pithy-dusty, lousy-cell-structure Cane.
If it's green it will age (given time ...) .
If it's just plain lousy - it's the pits !
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