 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: laughhearty
Date: 2004-03-02 19:47
Hello,
Pretty frustrated today. Tried to practice for hour and a half, but can't seem to get through the upper register without squeaking or rather squealing. (Background: haven't played clarinet in 20 years and just started in earnest a week ago.) My embouchure's pretty weak but I want to make sure there isn't any other reason for this. I think I'm using chinsy reeds: Rico Royal 1 1/2. I need some names of good reeds for a beginner-again, cause I don't know diddley. Even when I played in highschool I'd use shoddy reeds. And it never even occurred to me to break them in. So, obviously, I'm not doing that now.
I have a Stowasser by Amati-Denak, should I get a new ligature or new mouthpiece. Is it necessary at this time, or should I wait to build up my embouchure?
I'm also curious to know how long it takes to build up a decent emboucher so that I can alleviate some of my frustration. Yes, I know, I've only been at it for a week so I probably have a while to go. But I would like some ballpark figures. Do you remember how long it took for you?
Thanks
Alicia
"I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but it is my
chief duty to accomplish small tasks as if they were great
and noble."
- Helen Keller, Author and Inspiration
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Author: justwannaplay
Date: 2004-03-02 20:34
Hi Alicia,
You could try a synthetic reed. Like you I hadn't picked up the clarinet for a very long time - someone on this board recommended I start out on a Legere reed - it is very easy to get a decent tone quickly. Mine was a 2. Click on the reeds link on the side that you should find the Legere site. If you can't get a hold of one, try Mitchell Lurie cane reeds — a 2 I have played nicely straight-away. A Vandoren 1.5 is still giving me trouble even after break-in.
I'm still working on my embouchure (since October), it has gotten to where I remember it, but breathing is still more of a problem. I started out just playing long tones forever. It does help to get an instructor for a least a few lessons. Right now I'm having lessons with an undergraduate music major and I have found her advice quite helpful.
Also, try adjusting the reed on the mpc — I found it made all the difference with the Vandoren.
Happy Tootin',
Elizabeth
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Author: cujo
Date: 2004-03-02 21:02
Before going synthetic I suggest moving reed on mouthpiece and/or getting reed wetter. I suggest at least a 2 1/2 strength. I find La Voz, Rico GCS easier to play more consistent and sound nice.
Soak reed in water around 5-10 minutes.
Put reed on MP as usual and press very gently on tip so it touches tip of MP. You can see through the wet reed to see where they touch. Line up the lines. It is a very precise fit.
Experiment with different positions.
I found that reed slighty over the MP tip makes it stronger/harder to play. Pushed down slighty makes it easier to play and sound better.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2004-03-02 23:05
An adult beginner probably should use a reed of about 2.5 in strength (unless it's a Vandoren then drop down to a 2).
Make sure your embouchure is correct. If you need to take some lessons, do so.
Finally what kind of mouthpiece are you using now. You've mentioned the clarinet but haven't said what you have for a mouthpiece.
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Author: laughhearty
Date: 2004-03-03 03:55
Hi Dee,
I have the factory mouthpiece that came with my clarinet. So I'm wondering if I can improve on it this early in the game. Is it necessary?
Alicia
"I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but it is my
chief duty to accomplish small tasks as if they were great
and noble."
- Helen Keller, Author and Inspiration
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-03-03 04:17
Not necessary, but it certainly helps a big deal. A few good student mouthpieces would be the Fobes Debut (I recommend. My little sister got one so I playtested it and it's good), Hite Premier, Gigliotti Advantage (I think that's the student model), Pyne Polycrystal, and probably one or two more that I've forgotten to mention.
Like I said above, I recommend the Fobes Debut. But only cause I'm an ignorant fool who hasn't even gotten the chance to test the other ones. But I know the Fobes Debut works well so I don't see a need to test other ones.
A student MP will probably run you about $30 - $40. Small price to pay for something that'll make learning much easier over the course of a few years.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-03-03 04:25
BTW, I also agree that a 1.5 reed is too soft to begin with. A 2.0 or 2.5 would be better. Your lip will be a little sore from your teeth at first I'm sure, but a callous will build up over time.
You may be getting into it at a good time as we're apparently going to get an influx of Gonzalez Regular Cut reeds (which judging by the sound of it a box of size 2.0 or maybe by that time 2.5 would be a VG choice for you to look at when they hit the market).
Also, just FYI, please keep your reeds in good condition. I don't recomment keeping one on the mouthpiece, but rather buying a four reed holder (only a few bucks), and using up to four reeds (or more if you want), all the while rotating through them. This will keep warpage down a bit, extend playing life a bit, and make reeds less of a problem for you.
And don't think that a reed with a small 'chip' or 'split' in it is still good to play. It's not, and it'll just make it THAT much harder for you. it's a common mistake (one that I made for MANY years until I got to HS and our instructor told us it was wrong).
Just trying to outline some things that would help you as a beginner, but nothing that's beyond your capability as a beginner to do. Simple tasks, that will help you from letting a bad reed keep you down!
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: coasten1
Date: 2004-03-03 20:58
You might want to have someone who is seasoned play your clarinet to make sure there are no clarinet issues (leaky pads, corks, alignments). Get those reparied then you know you can just focus on reeds and emboucher.
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Author: mags
Date: 2004-03-03 21:08
I've mentioned this before...but I think I am the only adult in the world that seems to have started on a size 1 reed..I am now a size 1 1/2...but I still cannot play a size 1 vandoren. My A and B....generally squeak...and the noise goes right through me. I have been playing every day since last November....so I don't know what you make of that!. Also, I have started on the Alto sax...and I have started on the 1 1/2 van doren for that. ...My teacher says....just play what is right for you. Margaretx
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Author: laughhearty
Date: 2004-04-21 05:26
Hello,
Just wanted to check in and let you all know I'm having a great time with the Clarinet. I'm using a 2 1/2 Legere reed on a Vandoren B45 mouthpiece.
That has made such a difference. The Legere reed enables me to concentrate on tone and not wonder if it's me or the reed messing things up.
Also, when I get down to breaking in my new reeds or I'll know how they should perform.
Thanks for all the advice.
Alicia
"I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but it is my
chief duty to accomplish small tasks as if they were great
and noble."
- Helen Keller, Author and Inspiration
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2004-04-21 05:42
If you don't mind spending a bit extra, you might go for the Vandoren 56 Rue Lepic. While they've gotten a bit of flak on the board, they might be just right for your situation. They tend to run a bit soft, but still have a good tone in my experience. While they don't seem to last as long as the V12s, I've found that they break in much easier across the board.
Once you decide to go cane and get comfortable with the feel, I'd recommend getting a book on reed maintenance (Larry Guy wrote a nice one, do a Search on the board and his name will be close to some other good books too). Whether to go cane or synthetic in the long run has, of course, been discussed ad nauseum on the board.
If possible, I'd also highly recommend that you get lessons if you haven't already. Bad habits formed when self-teaching can take years to break (I know from experience, unfortunately). Weekly lessons would be best, but even monthly would do good.
Also, I'd recommend getting a new ligature. Again, the board has discussed this a bunch. My personal preference is a Rovner, the Eddie Daniels model, but ideally you'd try out a few and pick what works best.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Rick Williams
Date: 2004-04-21 08:30
Hi Alicia:
Welcome back to playing!
Here's a short list of squeak causes, but first, I ditto the idea of moving up to a 2.5 reed. I'd also strongly suggest finding a local teacher that can get you through the first set of hurdles. Well worth the modest amount of money it will cost! I started back a year and a half ago, and my teacher was a sanity saver.
Improper Fingering: If you aren't covering the holes correctly, that can cause squeaks. If you brush the wrong key on the way to covering a hole, that can also cause a squeak.
Clarinet out of adjustment: If everything isn't closing, sealing up and opening as it should on the clarinet, that can cause squeaks.
Reed positioned wrong. A reed that is off axis can squeak.
Warped Reed: If the underside (flat) part of the reed isn't flat, that certainly can cause squeaks. There is a huge volume of material on the board about reed prepping, so try a search on sandpaper or sanding.
Warped Mouthpiece: It may be rare, but it happens.
One advantage with Legere reeds for someone in your position is that it takes one of the variables out of the equation. If you put a Legere on and you still get squeaks, then most likely your problem isn't reed associated.
Again though, you can spend weeks chasing your tail and getting discouraged with this or spend 30-45 minutes with a teacher and get things solved or on the way to being solved.
Best
Rick
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Author: Tim P
Date: 2004-04-21 12:48
I have been playing for a just over one year, after a 30 year break. I went through this phase, also.
this is my recollection of:
Reeds: I quickly abandoned the 1-1/2 and went to a 2-1/2. Mitchell laurie and La Voz seemed best. After my embrochure built up a little I tried FOF gonzonlaz. Do yourself a favor and search this board for information on how to break in a reed. (especially FOF). Look for GBK's cooments. He is kinda like the resident expert on everything. I have dozens of various reeds left over from my experiements. I have pretty much settled on FOF for now.
Mouthpiece: I started with V-45, which served the purpose well. As my reed got harder and my embrochure stablized, then I went on a look for a new mouthpiece. I did not see any need to do so sooner. I am now using a Walter Grabner with his "closer" tip. I used his medium tip for awhile, too.
Ligiture: I bought a Rovner early on and am still using it. I have played around with others but frankly jsut dont't see any difference. Maybe as I get better and more consistent with my playing, then I will see a difference and invest in something else.
Clarinet: make sure that it is working right. Even after my came back from the shop with new pads it still had problems. It took me a awhile to realize them since my first instinct was to blame me.(most of the time it was me). But make sure the all the pads are fully closing and not leaks. ( a b-board search will help her too.)
regrets: should have bought Pino's book earlier. Relax, support, Relax Support, Relax, relax.
Have fun. I have really enjoyed it. And you will find all kinds of help at this website. Really nice people.
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