 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: rmr25
Date: 2004-02-18 23:11
I have a Boosey & Hawkes Edgware with a broken sliver key, the one on the lower joint betwen the bottom and next-above tone hole. My local repairman/technician says: "Bad. It's made of pot metal and can't be soldered. It'll just melt. LOL!" Has anyone solved this problem?
Hope someone can help.
Bob
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-02-18 23:21
Something like this could probably just be made. It's not connected to any other keys and stands on it's own post (if I'm thinking of the same key you are describing). It can probably just be replaced. I don't think it'd be something major. Wonder how some of the techs that post here would handle it . . .
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
Post Edited (2004-02-18 23:22)
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2004-02-19 10:21
Replacement with a cannibalised key assembly is the only way unless you know somebody that can do minute TIG welding. It is not cost effective for instrument repairers to set up for this sort of thing. I don't know about the pot metal melting, more than likely the solder, whatever sort, will just run off without penetration. Arc welding will not work either becaue of the aluminium content.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-02-19 11:22
There is no solder on the keys of the cheaper B&H instruments (Regent & /Edgware, and others). They were cast made from potmetal, otherwise known as 'muckmetal', a copper/lead alloy with a particularly low melting point. This metal will not solder. Heat it enough and it will pour out from the plating! It can be bent once, but is most likely to break when bent back. I understand that it was used because copper was reserved for making shells during the war years.
Replacement keys are now difficult to obtain, most having been already used as replacements.
A key from another instrument could be modified to fit by a go0od technician, but this often requires a LOT of modification, so don't expect it to be cheap!
And MAKING a key will cost more still.
Because of the potential problems with this metal on other keys, it is somewhat questionable whether repair is justified.
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Author: magritte
Date: 2004-02-19 14:30
B & H Edgwares are plentiful on ebay. Keep looking on ebay until you find a cheap one in bad shape. Buy it and use the key. I sold a good Edgware recently for $25 and it only needed pads.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2004-02-19 14:37
Gordon -
Might it be possible to bore a hole up the inside of the key stem, insert some sort of reinforcement (say, a straightened out paperclip) and epoxy it? I've done this with a large wood tuning ring (for my greatbass recorder), but, of course, metal is another animal, and the drilling process may weaken the potmetal so much that it's not worth it.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-02-19 15:25
"I sold a good Edgware recently for $25 and it only needed pads..."
The last keys I bought from Boosey and Hawkes, about 20 years ago, cost about than that per key. The worm turns!
I was foolish enough to order stocks of keys which seldom break. i still have them here. The A/D bridge key broke most often, so I got a mold made so that replacements could be cast in sterling silver. This provided this particular key for me at less than 1/2 the cost of buying them, and of far superior quality.
Ken, some people HAVE repaired these keys with an unsightly, large build-up of lead solder, attached to the plating on the key, bridging the break. It is still rather unacceptably weak for a key, where the much greater strength of 'silver-soldering' is the norm.
I have successfully inserted a pin (pins?) across the break as you suggest, together with low temp solder (the stronger 95/5 tin/silver?) on the outside. The pin was stainless steel spring wire, a lot more rigid than paper clip wire. The problem is that these keys break at the weakest point, which typically has a very small cross-section. I used wire only about 0.4 mm thick, and from memory, two wires to provide strength against twisting. In order to have much structural strength, the pins need to be a firm fit in their holes, and the pins need to be inserted quite deep. This, plus the problems of achieving suitable alignment of the two parts of the key, makes this job quite challenging, beyond what most people can do at home, and far from what most technicians would be bothered with.
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2004-02-19 15:43
This type of cheap metal work is indicative of the way many companies went because of the war cause in order to make cheap instruments.....
David Dow
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-02-19 16:03
Is this your main instrument?
Maybe before you get it fixed, you should plug that hole with something temporary and check the intonation and playability of the entire clarinet. All that key is, is an alternate fingering so you should be able to check all the notes on the clarinet. If you feel afterwards that it's worth saving, then you have some suggestions above and you know it'll cost some money. But (if you really haven't tried it out yet) if you see that it's badly out of tune, maybe your best bet is to start anew with another clarinet.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2004-02-19 17:28
I probably have a junker Edgware with the key you need -- please contact me offline at dspieg@boblight.net and I'll just mail you the darn thing. You can install it thineself.
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Author: rmr25
Date: 2004-02-19 19:56
Guys:
Some times it just pays to be lucky! Soon after studying your helpful suggestions I had to visit the local repairman, who'd declared my case hopeless. He offered to let me root around in his old parts bin. Would you believe that I found a lower joint sliver key that almost matches the B & H item? And in silver, no less! I don't know whose brand it is. But its tube length is 21 mm compared with 23mm for the B & H. I can make up that slack with some shims. I also have to file down the top shoulder slightly to give complete clearance underneath the tube of the 3-ring bridge key. But it'll work fine.
Thanks again for all your help.
Bob
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-02-19 23:14
It sounds as if it could be a key off a higher spec B&H. You sure struck it lucky. Most times I do a rummage search I simply waste a lot of time.
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