 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2003-07-31 13:26
hi, from all the clarinets i've tried buffets and leblancs are my favorites (i don't like selmers). how should i compare the 2 brands' models?
for example, leblanc's best model is symphonie. buffet's is the prestige R-13 and RC (i prefer the prestige R-13). i noticed leblanc symphonie is more expensive though. als i saw many people mention the leblanc opus and the leblanc concerto. these 2 models are a lot cheaper than buffet R-13 (not the prestige).
also bass clarinets. i noticed that leblanc's best model is more expensive that buffet's best model (low C 1193, it's the one i have).
so, what compares with what? who compares with who?
thank.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2003-07-31 17:05
I general, I think that most Leblanc horns are more expensive. I didn't think the Opus and concerto were LESS than the R-13. Perhaps you wrote that wrong? Or you could be looking at the "older" stock of opus and concerto since now there's the Opus II and Concerto II. BTW, the first ones were still great instruments. Don't count them out.
If you have the money for all of them, simply go based on sound. If they both feel comfortable enough that you can adjust to each model's slightly different ergonomics, simply play them next to each (with the exact same setup as far as MP, lig, reed go) and think which one gives you the best tone flexibility (as far as sounding "dark" and "bright"), flexibility in dynamics and any other factors you can think of.
Also, let someone else hear you play as well. What you may hear may not be what the audience hears. And ultimately, it's the audience that you want to please during a performance.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: William
Date: 2003-07-31 17:30
As a Buffet/LeBlanc player, I consider the LeBlanc Opus models to equal the Prestige R13 and RC models of Buffet. The LeBlanc Concerto is comparable to the Buffet R13 models. For buffets, the key word is "Prestige" which gives you the extra LH Eb/Ab key. RC refers to a special bore configuration of Buffets which I believe is available on both the R13's and Prestige models. The bore specifications for the LeBlanc Opus and Concerto models (as well as their Sonata models) are identical. The Opus clarinets have the extra Eb/Ab key and the Concertos and Sonatas do not. I play sets of vintage R13's and Concertos.
One further recomendation, when auditioning the different clarinets, is that you play the same etude, excerpt or scale passage on all to best determine which clarinet suites your playing style and needs. Also, if possible, take the instruments(s) that you think play best to an actual live playing situation (rehearsal, gig, etc) and explore how they perform "on the job." Often, clarinets that sound great in the music shoppe will sound totally differnent out in the "real world" of performance. Having a friend listen (objectivly) is also a plus. Clarinets sound differently (and often better) to the listener than they do to the performer. The more input, the better--but ultimately, you must be satisfied. Good luck and enjoy the search!!
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Author: The White
Date: 2003-08-01 00:50
One difference between LeBlanc and Buffet that I notice is the upper register - from G to high C (thumb), there is generally less resistance than on Buffet. To me, this makes intervals easier, but many players prefer the resistance of a Buffet. I also personally believe that LeBlanc has a more even scale throughout.
Next time you try them out, see if you notice this too. If you do, then decide which suits you best. If you don't notice it, then it's one less factor to take into account when making your decision.
Of course, don't make your decision based on this one factor though.
Good luck!
(I personally hope you end up with a LeBlanc... LOL)
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Author: Benni
Date: 2003-08-01 02:17
I know Tom Ridenour increases the left-hand resistance on LeBlancs (without adding the stuffiness that is prevalent on many Buffets) by putting a "spike" on the register pad that goes down the register tube, then hollowing out a section on the inside of the bell to compensate in the right hand.
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Author: Bradley
Date: 2003-08-01 02:35
The Symphonie VII you refer to is not the best model Leblanc offers. The best model is the Opus II. The Symphonie is an Opus in rosewood, and that's why it's more expensive. Also because there is less demand and therefore less discounts on it.
Bradley
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Author: Rick Williams
Date: 2003-08-01 07:13
Also something to keep in mind is that Leblancs upper clarinet line is changing. The Concerto has been replaced by the Concerto II, the Opus by the Opus II.
I agree with William on what compares to what, but with the changes in the Leblanc line you will see seriously discounted Opus's and Concertos while the new and current Opus/Concerto II prices are not discounted as low. As far as the differences, on the Concerto II they have redesigned the keys, changed the mechanical linkages include an Eddie Daniels MP and a more expensive backpack case. On the Opus II I'm not sure of any changes beyond the linkages. As far as that goes, I've been told, but cannot say for myself that the new system is similar to what you find on Buffets which is supposed to be a bit more durable and somewhat less prone to getting out of whack. The source on that was the Brannens.
Good luck
Rick
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2003-08-01 07:20
thanks a lot everyone.
bradley, thanks for clearing that symphonie model thing.
willian, you said the opus II is like the beffet prestige and the concerto is like the R-13. from what i read the ONLY difference between opus and concerto is that Eb/Ab key on the left side. it's also the difference between the buffet r-13 and the prestige. i have both a buffet r-13 and a buffet perstige r-13, and i've tried many of these models in the store, and they have a different sound and feel. the Ab/Eb key is certainly not the only difference. is it really the only differnce between the opus and the concerto? (actually it doesn't matter to me since i never use the Ab/Eb key on the left side).
about the prices (all from woodwind & brasswind).
buffet prestige R13 - 3,300$
buffet R13 - 1,700$
leblanc concerto II - 1,700$
leblanc opus II - 1,950$
you can see the concerto and the R13 are the same price, but the prestige is MUCH more expenisve than the opus II. is the opus really so much better than the concerto like the prestige is so much better than the regular R13?
also i noticed buffet has the elite model. what can you tell me about this model?
basically i'm thinking about getting another clarinet and all 3 clarinets i have are buffet so i thought maybe a leblanc would be a good idea.
thanks again.
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Author: jack
Date: 2003-08-01 08:18
Of the "big four", my experience is that a new Yamaha plays better than the others do straight from the factory. I tried a couple of new Concerto II's at the July Fest and found them to be pratically unplayable, they were so badly regulated from the factory. The rep allowed that Eddie Daniel's personal horns are specially tweaked. Tried the new Buffet Tosca, (for demo, not for sale), and found that it played very well, but of course you would expect a special demo to play well. In any case, the horn that just runs rings around the others in terms of the impeccable quality of construction, the ease and suppleness of the action and, of course the perfect adjustment straight from the factory is the Rossi. I guess that Rossi must "Rossi-ize" them. Just my opinion. If you can find a nice R-13 and have it adjusted by a master technician, you will have a horn that is also very enjoyable to play and probably capable of a wider range of dynamics (tempered changes in volume?) than any other. (Except for a Conn 444n).
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Author: William
Date: 2003-08-01 15:12
Clarnibass--as far as I have lerned from conversations with the clarinets' designer, Tom Ridenour, the main difference (aside from special pad cups, etc) between the Concerto and Opus models is the extra Eb/Ab key. Accousitically, they are the same instrument. In fact, Tom say's that they (all of LeBlanc's wood clarinets) "all come from the same woodpile."
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2003-08-01 17:00
I recommend Kohlert, Couesnon, or Marigaux clarinets...........DOH! I forgot, they don't make those any more! Sorry about that.
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2003-08-01 17:43
David:
My fantasy: walking into an antique shop and finding that Eugène Albert 1870 Clarinet owned by a family of cigar fanciers who kept it in a humidor for the last 130 years. Of course, it will bear a price tag of $25.
Other than that I'm in pretty good shape.
Regards,
John
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Author: pgporto
Date: 2003-08-01 21:44
Jack -
What does it mean when you say that the Concerto II is unplayable? It doesn't make a sound at all? Also, what can be tweaked in those clarinets?
Thanks
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Author: CPW
Date: 2003-08-02 02:30
I tried several, felt that the Opus was ok..but not spectacular. Tried a Selmer 10IIS (feh!)
I tried a Selmer 10G (ok, but disappointing for a number of personal reasons) and then a Recital (oh yeah!!!!) I gots the hots for the Recital....please buy me one.
CPW....usually on an R13
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