 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: chicagoclar
Date: 2003-07-17 08:23
For those of you who have participated in these ensembles, do you find them worth the time and effort put into them? I currently have just over 15 students, many who play well, and I also know a few people around me who would like to participate. I'm wondering if it would be worthwhile to start an ensemble up and if it would be a good educational setting. I have played with one clarinet quartet with very limited rehearsals for a recital and have played with a woodwind quintet, but my experience is limited. If it is a good idea, anyone have any pointers as how to get it going?
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Author: Brenda
Date: 2003-07-17 12:35
Definitely it's a good idea. Ours started about three years ago with the encouragement of a teacher who served as our coach a few times. There were four original members that quickly grew to about 6 or 7. We had a limited amount of clarinet choir music and began with that. This experience gave us an opportunity to play as an ensemble, to learn to listen to each other and so on.
We looked for opportunities to play, unpaid of course, in various settings. The first setting was in the lobby of a concert hall before the regularly scheduled concert and then we branched out from there. All of us are working people who can't put too much time into this. We try to have rehearsals each second weekend except for the summer or holidays. We don't expect too much from ourselves or each other because of not being professionals. However we've improved our skills quite a bit over time. Of course some of us are still taking lessons in spite of working a day job, and others are semi-professionals. We've even had a 4-movement piece written just for us! We're so proud of our composer, who is a regular on this bulletin board.
Some of our members play better than others so the parts are distributed according to our abilities. As the need arises we sometimes have to fill in on another part. Some members understand the importance of "playing without a reed" during our gigs, knowing that for a particular piece they don't have the ability yet to play the part sufficiently, yet they can continue to contribute to our group. One of us serves as a librarian, another as an organizer to send out e-mails or to phone people to schedule rehearsals, others contribute their homes or offices as rehearsal sites as the need arises, others provide refreshments.
Our group now numbers 10. However six others have been with us at various times. The membership changes from time to time but there's a core that's pretty reliable.
A caution going into this that applies wherever people come together - personalities. Each one going into this needs to understand the need to be flexible. Some will give comments and suggestions but may not be taken seriously and leave rehearsal with a wounded sense of pride, but we can't allow ourselves to be offended and start the gossip mill. One or two may excel at teaching and directing, but even they need to acknowledge the possibility that the others may have good suggestions. Each one has to come into this with the attitude of give and take and to be willing to use a good solid sense of humour and professionalism. With these things in mind the group can get along and actually make good music and have a lot of enjoyment from it.
It'll be interesting to hear experiences from others who have formed clarinet choirs over the years.
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Author: William
Date: 2003-07-17 14:34
One of the major benefits of combining private lesson students into ensembles is for the experiance of playing with each other and mutually solving the many "ensemble" problems--rthythmic, phrasing, intonation, etc--that are "real musicians life" performance issues. Private instruction does not adequately address these problems that all musicians encounter--unless they intend to have a strictly solo career. Ensemble experiance will only be a plus for your students future musical developement.
My own personal experiance is, that as a college clarinet major, I was required to play woodwind quintet music and, consequently, discovered my favorite small ensemble. In fact, over the years, I have accumulated a fairly large WWQ library and have played many paid engagements such as art fairs, social gatherings and the usual wedding ceremonies and receptions.
But, the "bottom line" is that the woodwind quintet made me a better musician/clarinetist, a little bit richer and became an enduring source of pure enjoyment for many years. Ensembles are truely a case of "more being better."
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2003-07-17 15:19
Some of the best musical memories in my life are from playing in our high school clarinet choir (we had quite a good one), and I'm currently having a great time playing in a good amateur/semi-pro clarinet choir --- so I'd say YES, there's a lot of benefit for a clarinetist to play in a chamber group. It helps improve every aspect of playing, I think.
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2003-07-17 20:31
Hi,
I tried to organize a woodwind quintet this past year with several very good players in the CB I play in every Tuesday evening. However, attendance at rehearsals (we would pratice a bit after rehearsals some times) was spotty among the players. But the real axe was when I asked "hey, maybe we should set up a practice sometime..." and the horn player gave a resounding NO! So.....
All the players were excellent and the quintet sounded great but if we could not arranage to practice at sometime where attention could be placed on details, we were dead. I quickly realized this.
HRL
PS I bought some music for the group and hope someday to realize a quintet.
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Author: lyn
Date: 2003-07-17 21:14
I have had one for about 3-4 years now, mostly made up of my students, and I also have some professionals and amateurs as members. (You can hear us at www.chesco.com/~thomas/cambiare.htm and also at the rehearsals link.) Part of my teaching philosophy is that if you have enjoyed music enough to study all these years, you should always want to be involved in music, and this is really an ideal option. Never waste talent or love for music.
It's most definitely been worth it. We've been awarded grants, played at colleges, local concerts, and other venues, and also this year we were one of 25 groups chosen to play at the PMEA Convention (out of over 160 who applied)! It was great. Next year will be a rebuilding year, as I lost four good seniors! :( However.....since we have adults playing with us, one of the graduated seniors who is staying locally will probably continue to play with us.
The biggest hassle is finding time when everyone can make it. It usually ends up being Friday nights or Sunday afternoons. We have practice space available to us at the local high school (free if it's during the week) and also a local church, where one of my students' parents works.
Realize that it will take time to build - we had 6-8 regulars for the first couple of years, then Boom! 12 - 14 - 16. That's when you can do the really good stuff (like the Gordon Jacob Introduction & Rondo) with more than just 4-5-6 parts.
And you can adapt the clarinet quartet repertoire to the choir, too. Adding a couple of clarinets on bass clarinet parts is not a bad thing.
Lynn
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-07-18 04:49
I strongly agree that students need a group experience, but have generally rejected clarinet choirs as the vehicle for several reasons:
1. As a large group with a conductor, it pretty much mimics the school band experience.
2. The bigger a group you're looking for, the greater the need for harmony clarinets. Very expensive unless you have institutional backing...
3. It's hard to keep a large group going. Most kids I know will try it for a while, but only pretty serious musicians are going to stick with something like that.
4. The greatest source of frustration for student musicians is a mismatch in ability levels. Weak players feel pressured, and strong players are annoyed. I think that you're better off having small groups with better matched players.
If you really want to educate the kids, put them in groups of three or four. There is plenty of good music at cheap prices, and you can keep from having too many different ability levels clash like they would in a big group.
I have had a chamber music program for clarinets and saxophones over the last four summers, and have managed to make it both educational and operationally bulletproof. Using myself as the universal substitute, I can operate groups with anywhere from two to four students in attendance.
Allen Cole
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Author: diz
Date: 2003-07-18 05:27
Brenda ... your choir is VERY good, but then again I'm biased!
:-)
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-07-18 14:46
Lyn, I went to your website, but couldn't find the music. Is there a link, or is it supposed to load automatically with the web page?
I'm also curious about some of the practical matters in keeping the group going--and thus a few questions:
1 - How many students? Are any of them middle schoolers?
2 - How many adults?
3 - How many harmony clarinets, and are there any other than bass clarinet?
4 - How often do you rehearse?
Allen Cole
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Author: Brenda
Date: 2003-07-18 15:51
I can't tell you about students - they seem to be a bigger challenge. Our group is made up of adults from the late 30s to the 70s. We're just incorrigible, our families have given up on us and just let us attend our rehearsals.
About harmony instruments - These are a BIG plus in an ensemble! The bass clarinet parts can be substituted for with a Bb, but how do you replace an Eb alto or a Contra-Bass clarinet? What an amazing sound when you get those going! Some professional players would probably jump at the chance to accompany a student group with their bass clarinets. They wouldn't have to attend every rehearsal, just come in occasionally and then attend the performance because they're experienced enough to do that. This would undoubtedly boost the students' morale to have pro players sit in with them. After all, how much call is there for contra bass? The owners of these magnificent pieces of piping are usually eager to play with any group. Being pro, they could offer some really helpful suggestions as well.
And as for a conductor, forget it. The ensemble experience has you listening to each other. We have the first player of any piece set the speed, and we mark our parts to know who to look at to begin the piece.
Post Edited (2003-07-18 15:53)
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Author: Brenda
Date: 2003-07-18 15:54
Diz - You're a sweetheart! There's some bias there for sure.
Post Edited (2003-07-18 16:20)
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Author: diz
Date: 2003-07-27 22:17
Brenda - I've misplaced your email address - at least I'm at work and it's not in my work address book, can you contact me about the Upper Canada Clarinet Choir ... I've got something "new" to email you.
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Author: Brenda
Date: 2003-07-28 00:37
Diz - I got your message, please check your e-mail.
Did you notice that Lyn's choir (July 14 post) played Gordon Jacob's Introduction and Rondo? Have you ever heard that? It's pretty neat to play. The "Dance of the Buffoons" by Rimsky-Korsakov is another great piece to play, but only if you have a good bass section. But then I also like the arrangement for Kirmit's "Rainbow Connection"; somehow it's not a favourite with the other choir members. Ah, there's just so much music out there for clarinet choir, and then there are the original compositions and world premieres.
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Author: Eileen
Date: 2003-07-28 16:49
I noticed that the posting is titled "chicagoclar." If you are looking for a clarinet ensemble in Chicago, the Old Town School of Folk Music in Chicago has one. For myself, I have not pursued that because I'd rather play with different instruments than just clarinets. But I know 2 people who have played in the Old Town clarinet ensemble and they really enjoyed it. Perhaps that would be an option for some of your students.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-07-28 17:14
I played alto cl in a cl choir , driving to Tulsa for reh. and a few concerts, in addition to bass cl in two, at times, comm. bands. Was busy! Our "CAT" [Clarinet Association of Tulsa] had some 15 pro and teaching clists, so I learned how to play alto in great company!! Recommend it. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: chicagoclar
Date: 2003-07-29 08:32
Actually, it's not supposed to be chicago clar it's more chica go clar. My friend made it up, and it's kind of confusing, sorry. I actually live in southern california. Although I would love to play with a great clarinet choir, most of the kids who will be in this choir would not be ready for it. Just to fill you all in, we are starting the choir in the fall. We will meet once a week (Sundays 5-7 PM) and members will include some of my higher level students as well as some of the University Students. I may ask some graduates to fill in when needed (I am a recent graduate myself). I'm really excited about the group and so are the students (even if my old clarinet teacher thinks it's a waste of time-he thinks if you are going to do chamber music, it may as well be in a woodwind quintet, which I also have running). This seems to be my best option to really teach these kids about ensemble playing, since a large number of them do not have a band in their schools (most go to small private schools) or don't have time for band in their schedules. Since I teach in a Community School of Music and the Arts, I have access to rooms and performance halls and such. The group is going to be run a little different than what I originally thought of. We are going to do some large pieces with everyone playing (the choir) and some smaller pieces: trios, quartet, quintets, ect. that are grouped more by ability levels. Well, thanks for the suggestions, if anyone would like to suggest and specific music, just shout out!!! Or email me. :-)
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Author: Tom A
Date: 2003-07-29 12:40
Chica, I think from your descriptions of your students' abilities that some of these might be right for them. Your more experienced students may want serious clarinet choir repertoire, but these are transcriptions which are good fun and may be OK as shorter pieces or encores. They are mostly four B-flat parts plus bass.
http://www.cia.com.au/awmp/catalogue.htm
Click on "clarinet ensemble" to see the list. The pieces are, slightly confusingly, described as Level A for elementary players up to Level D for more advanced. Check out the level C and D pieces for your kids, and you can also look at the first page of each score. Hope it helps.
Cheers
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