 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: big fat lyre112
Date: 2003-06-26 16:05
This coming school yr. I want to join the school Jazz Ensemble on the clarinet. I love to listen to jazz clarinet and saxophone and there isn't a clarinet in jazz ensemble right now. I've played some jazz on my clarinet but not to a "jazz ensemble level".
Are there any techniques that I need to learn/master when I do jazz clarinet? I'm pretty good at rythums ((sp.)) but maybe there is something about jazz clarinet that I dont know about. Anything that might help me on my journey to experience jazz clarinet would be a BIG help! Thanks to all! : )
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Author: wjk
Date: 2003-06-26 16:20
There is an excellent book about jazz clarinet that you can obtain from one of the BB sponsors (Van Cott Information Svces---check out his website). The Artie Shaw technique books may also be helpful. I'd also check out "Mr. Clarinet" , a CD by Buddy DeFranco recently re-issued. To me, Buddy DeFranco defines the term "jazz clarinet."
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Author: William
Date: 2003-06-26 16:38
The best way to learn to play jazz is to listen to the recordings of jazz players and learn their solos by ear--no transcriptions. This will force the developement of your listening skills as well as your improv technique.
Also recommended, learn to play the saxophone. I suggest you start with the alto as it is easy to hold and produce a sound on. It would be good--after you learn the basic alto fingerings which are similar to the clarinet--to learn to play tunes by ear--again, no music. Good for your lisening skills.
Once you have mastered the basic alto sax skils, you may then proceed to play all of the other saxophones as they are all fingered exactly the same--except of the altissimo registers, but you can save that for when you "get good."
Key in playing jazz is to have basic good technique, know all your scale and arpeggio relationships--and then, "Just Do It!!"
Remember, there are no wrong notes in jazz--just "inappropriate" choices.
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2003-06-26 17:15
I'd suggest listening to a good selection of jazz clarinet players. In this way you can soak up various aspects of their style.
In my opinion one of the most creative and original clarinet players in jazz is John LaPorta. I'd highly recommend tracking down some of his older recordings from the 50's (such as with Charles Mingus, Sandole Brothers, and Lennie Tristano) as well as newer recordings. A recording of his composition "Theme and Variations" was recently reissued on CD. If memory serves, I think that it's on the Fantasy label. It features John on clarinet and alto sax. His playing BURNS! Another good recording is The Sandole Brothers. The final 4 tracks feature John on clarinet with piano and drums. John is now 82-years old and still playing up a storm.
Other well known players to check out are Eddie Daniels, Buddy DeFranco, Tony Scott, Jimmy Giuffre.... Certainly, Benny Goodman, Artie Shaw, and Woody Herman.
Very importantly (!!!), spend time listening to all of the clarinet guys who played with Duke Ellington -- in particular, Barnie Begard. This is what the jazz clarinet is about!
Phil Woods is best known as an alto sax player. However, he's also a fine clarinetist. I really enjoy listening to Phil on clarinet.
Another name that comes to mind is Danny Pollo. He was a superb clarinetist who is probably best known for his work with the Claude Thornhill band in the late 40's. Thornhill's chief arranger was Gil Evans. The way that he wrote for clarinets -- in particular, blending them with french horns -- is absolutely fantastic. The Thornhill band had a very distinctive sound....very different from the majority of the 40's big bands.
These are just some names off the top of my head. I'm sure that I've missed some players that I'll kick myself for. But, this should help to get you started.
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Author: mikeW
Date: 2003-06-26 21:33
On a potentially sour note, have you talked to the director? Clarinet is used as a double in most modern jazz ensembles, by which I mean big band. Consequently, the majority of the parts are written for 5 saxes. If the director is not willing to allow you to transpose some of the lead alto parts, or double one of the tenor or trumpet parts, you're not going to see a lot of playing time. I would second the advice to take up the sax.
Ken Peplowski is another good clarinetist to check out. He has done some recent stuff fronting a big band.
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Author: ned
Date: 2003-06-26 23:22
Yes - I'd agree wholeheartedly with William - you WON"T learn the jazz feel from reading the dots - learn by ear.
Don't know that I'd go along with the "no wrong notes in jazz" theory though. All pieces are written in definite keys and basic music theory still rules.
JK
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-26 23:41
Several important items:
1 - LISTEN TO WILLIAM AND MIKE W! - Clarinet is not a primary instrument of the big band. Ask your director if he's going to have an opening for one. The big bands have always been full of clarinet players--primarily playing saxophone. Prior to forming their own big bands, Benny Goodman and Artie Shaw made much of their income as section saxophonists in the New York studios.
If your band director doesn't want to take on a clarinet, spare both him and us the arguments. Offer to play baritone sax. It's a great way to learn on the job, a logical double for a clarinetist, and the school probably has one that it can lend you free of charge. Perhaps he would let you borrow it for the summer.
BTW, the bari sax's greatest exponent, Harry Carney, actually auditioned for Duke Ellington in the 1920's as a clarinetist. If you want to get in a group, don't go in trying to adapt it to yourself. Adapt yourself to fit the needs of the group. Bari Saxist "Doc" Kupka (Tower of Power) was originally an oboist. Eddie Daniels got his big break while working as a tenor saxophonist for Thad Jones. Don't whine--adapt!
2 - Solo improvising isn't your primary concern as a big band musician. Reading well in all keys and SWINGING is a primary concern. I suggest that you order the book Easy Jazz Conception by Jim Snidero. Be sure to specify that you want it for clarinet. (www.jimsnidero.com). It's also available via Jamey Aebersold. (www.jajazz.com) The book has a play-along CD and a very good clarinetist doing the demo tracks. You will learn much from using this book.
I've seen much good advice here, particularly regarding listening. However, you don't need to know that much about jazz improvisation to get in your school group. Learn to swing by listening, and by working with the Snidero book. Also, make sure you know all your major scales, and your chromatic inside out. Next, learn your pentatonic scales. They'll bail you out in a soloing emergency.
Good luck, and let us know how it goes.
Allen Cole
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-27 05:22
Remember the goals stated by the original poster. One was to get into school jazz band, and the other was to enhance his jazz clarinet playing.
In light of that, I think that it's important not to get sidetracked by a lot of advanced stuff, when the basics have not yet been learned.
The most productive practice is to learn scale and arpeggios (major ones, to start), and to play songs by ear in various keys. If this is not yet accomplished, learning church modes, altered scales, etc. will be of little use. Given the fact that Big Fat Lyre wants to participate in a big band, transfering these skills to the saxophone is also a greater priority.
To avoid books is not good advice when the stated goal is to play in a big band. Following in the footsteps of Eric Dolphy comes much, much later. Getting used to playing and reading swing rhythms is the prime factor for a capable young player who wants to be in such a group. It seems to me that a book with play-along CD, written by an experienced and well-known lead alto player would serve this purpose very well.
Allen Cole
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Author: William
Date: 2003-06-27 15:29
JK wrote, "Don't know that I'd go along with the "no wrong notes in jazz" theory though"
I was only speaking "tongue in cheek" so to say, as that is what many cats say after a particularly poignant performance of "inappropriate choice" (wrong, bad, etc) notes. Sometimes, I just call it "aritstic license" or shrug it off as another "senior moment" of my musical artistry. In any case, a few "clinkers" should not prevent one from continuing to try new ideas or refining old ones.
But really, in free-form jazz style, it oftens seems there truely are "no wrong notes" as there is often no set rhytmn base nor distinguishable tonality between players, just pure emotion of the moment. But even then, to the trained ear, there are "inappropriate choices" as ones musical offering may not coincide with the emotion of anothers. As our musical ears grow more experianced, like the old tune says, "Anything Goes." Well, almost anything...........
But to the original poster, I was merely trying to encourage developing listening skills, giving jazz a try and advise learning to play the sax.
"That's All, Folk's" (Porky Pig)
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Author: William Hughes ★2017
Date: 2003-06-27 17:35
On a recent trip to Berlin, we were treated to an evening at the "A Trane" jazz club with the Alexander von Schlippenbach Quintett: piano, bass, trumpet, drums and featuring, on bass clarinet, Rudi Mahall. It was an amazing performance with sounds from Mahall's bass clarinet that would make any sax player jealous. I wish I knew more about this artist, but he certainly showed me more than I could have imagined about the jazz potential of the clarinet family.
[I just found a website indicating that this group toured across the U.S. in April and May. Anybody see them?]
Post Edited (2003-06-27 21:09)
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-28 01:33
A very interesting performer on bass, contrabass, contra-alto and E-flat clarinet is Lenny Pickett, former tenor soloist with Tower of Power and current leader of the Saturday Night Live band.
I don't know if he started as a clarinetist, but I saw his avant-garde group some years ago at the Virginia Museum of Fine Arts. I'd say that over half the performance was done on harmony clarinets. (but no B-flat clarinet in sight) In all my years of listening to Tower of Power, I never would've dreamed that this guy had 3 doctorates in music, or was such an able clarinetist.
Allen Cole
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