 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: wjk
Date: 2003-06-22 23:37
Can someone comment on how they use/apply pentatonic scales in blues and jazz? Any "tricks" on how to use them effectively?
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Author: diz
Date: 2003-06-23 00:30
Pentatonic (for example c# d# f# g# a#) if the intervals are changed then it is no longer pentatonic. As to its use in Jazz ... perfectly fine, really, Debussy and Ravel were very fond of it (though not Jazz composers). Perhaps one of our jazz experts can fill in the blanks?
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2003-06-23 01:50
As diz notes, the black keys of a piano describe a pentatonic scale. You might consider it to be a diatonic scale without the subdominant and leading tone.
The pentatonic scale will not necessarily have exclusive use in a composition. It may be supplemented by a diatonic scale, or for that matter, any other. For my favorite example of the use of a pentatonic scale in jazz, examine the melodic line of "In a Sentimental Mood." And while jazz usually makes broad use of seventh chords, also frequently used are chords consisting of a major triad with added sixth and ninth, which comprise the entire pentatonic scale.
Regards,
John
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-23 04:44
Pentatonic scales have supposedly been used by most ancient cultures, and we mostly think of them as part of oriental music (most often in major mode) and in American Indian music (most often in minor mode). I feel like I hear it in a lot of basic African music, and am sure that's one reason why it found its way into jazz.
Structure - The pentatonic scale is elements 1, 2, 3, 5 & 6 of the major scale. The most visible example I can think of is the signature lick in "My Girl" where the guitar plays 1-2-3-5-6-1, 4-5-6-1-2-4 over and over. He is using two major pentatonic scales based on chords I and IV respectively.
Using the piano black keys, a major pentatonic would run from F# to F#. A minor one would run from D# to D#. Add a flat 5 to a minor pentatonic and you have your blues scale.
Usefulness - The function of any scale is to organize notes so that you prioritize the most desirable ones. The major scale narrows the 12 pitches down to the 7 most likely. The pentatonic scale narrows it even further to the 5 most likely. All five tones sound good over a dominant seventh chord. Notes 4 and 7 of the major scale don't sound too good over a "I" dominant 7th chord. Using the pentatonic keeps them out of your vocabulary.
Another part of its emergence in jazz may be the fact that much early improvisation was arpeggio related and the pentatonic scale is essentially a major triad with the 6 and 9 added. These provide convenient upper neighbors for the 1 and 5. Also, the 6/9 is a popular chord of resolution.
Methods of use -
Best beginning method is to use a pentatonic scale based on the root note of the key you're playing in. In a major key, you are welcome to use both the major and the parallel minor pentatonic. (C-D-E-G-A, or C-Eb-F-G-Bb) Just think about rhythm and start moving up and down the scales. You can do very well on a simple blues with this. If your song modulates, as in Laura or How High the Moon, you will have to have a pentatonic scale for each key you modulate through.
Interesting experiment - If you think that C major pent. licks sound lame or hokey over a C blues, try playing the same licks using E-flat pentatonic and see what you think. (you'd really be using Cm pent., but it may be easier for you to think of Eb major pent.)
A more advanced use might be to follow a general framework of chord functions. A 12-bar blues, for example can be thought of as 3 sets of question and answer. (2 measures per chord)
I - I
IV - I
V - I
You can use pentatonics based on these very general chords to add a little more variety.
One of my students who was addicted to major pentatonic would allow himself to use either a natural 3 or a flat 3 depending on how things felt. This method works great once you're familiar with the scales and facilitates better voice leading. In a minor pentatonic, that flat 3 will actually be a flat 5, and will turn your minor pentatonic into a blues scale.
IF YOU MEMORIZE YOUR MAJOR PENTATONICS YOU CAN EXTRACT THE MINOR ONES & BLUES SCALE. Here's how:
Let's take your C major pent. (C-D-E-G-A-C)
To make it minor go to the major key in which C would be the relative minor. (key of Eb) Eb maj pent Eb-F-G-Bb-C-Eb rearranges to Cm pent C-Eb-F-G-Bb-C
For voice leading and blues, add your flat-3 option to C major pent. C-D-Eb-E-G-A-C. Take this up 1.5 steps to Eb and you get Eb-F-Gb-G-Bb-C-Eb. Run this from C to C and you get C-Eb-F-Gb-G-Bb-C...your C blues scale.
This is a lot of power in your fingers just for memorizing 12 major pentatonics. If you have a good ear, you can function pretty well even if you don't know the exact chord changes.
If you like, I have a worksheet for use with Jamey Aebersold Vol.1 (track 7) which will take you through these three approaches to using your pentatonics over the blues. If you send me your email address, I'll send you a .pdf of it.
WARNING - Pentatonics will really get you moving, but they're not the only technique of jazz soloing. I would venture to say that most jazz soloists use the pentatonic and blues scales to 'idle' their brain on while thinking up more creative licks for the next chorus.
Allen Cole
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Author: jim lande
Date: 2003-06-23 05:01
Allen
What a great post. Next time I practice, I'm going to try to work through the examples in your posting and see if I can hear what you are talking about.
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Author: clarinetgiggirl
Date: 2003-06-23 10:00
Allencole,
Thanks for the post - I can't wait to get home from work and try it out.
A lot of my friends play exlusively blues and I am struggling with improvising - this will help I am sure.
Can you also send me your worksheet?
CGG
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2003-06-23 10:26
A small theoretical dispute!
A pentatonic scale is a scale made up of 5 notes. Not necessary the diatonic major sounding version everybody has described. There is also a minor variant possible by flattening the 3rd. The scales described above are only one version of the pentatonic. They do have a jazz application. Beware of western musical imperialism.
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Author: wjk
Date: 2003-06-23 14:58
Thanks for the incredible responses! Pentatonic scales are very easily learned on guitar as they fall into very simple patterns. Many a rock guitarist with no knowlege of musical theory has used these "patterns" to shred their way to fame and fortune!
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2003-06-23 22:30
Mark: You are quite correct, as "pentatonic" means "having five tones." One can claim quite rightly that any collection of five tones is "a" pentatoinic scale. But that does not make such a grouping "the" pentatonic scale.
Surely, there are others, some more useful. Allen Cole mentioned, in his compactly exhaustive post, the parallel minor pentatonic. But it is the major pentatonic scale that gets the most action by far in jazz.
Mark, you are an accomplished jazz musician. I'm sure that you are not concerned with "western musical imperialism" when blowing a few hot licks in a trad jazz selection. But if you do try throwing a few Indian melodic lines into the midst of "When the Saints Go Marchin' In," please let me know how it goes. 
Regards,
John
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-24 05:49
I don't think I left your scale out, Mark.
If you read my post carefully, you will find that it contains the option of 1-2-flat3-5-6 as a variant of the major pentatonic. (the paragraph beginning with "one of my students") Alternation of this with the straight major pentatonic is what my worksheet called the "Voice Leading Approach" to blues improvisation.
However, I believe that what's known as a minor pentatonic is actually just a rearrangement of the notes in the major pentatonic. Where a major pentatonic would go from 1 to 1 on the major scale, the minor pentatonic would go from 6 to 6 on the major scale, using the exact same set of notes.
Just like you'd do either F# to F# on the piano black keys for major, or D# to D# for minor. To get a minor pentatonic based on the root of your major key, you simply rearrange the notes from the major pentatonic 3 semitones above. In the key of C, you would take the Eb penatonic Eb-F-G-Bb-C-Eb and make do it from 6 to 6 as C-Eb-F-G-Bb-C.
This is what has always been identified to me as minor pentatonic, and what I generally hear in oriental or American Indian music with a minor tonality.
If your alternative is something other than this, I would like to hear more about it.
Allen Cole
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-24 06:04
Regarding the worksheet - Anyone who wants it can have a copy, but I cannot post a file attachment to this BB so far as I know.
If you email me with a request for it, I will send you the .pdf by reply email. Unless you tell me otherwise, I'll assume that you want the version for B-flat instruments.
In the meantime. Those of you who have not used this before, go up to your room, pull out your instrument, and do the Lisa Simpson thing. Just play some melodies and some licks. Pentatonics are VERY user-friendly. Mark may agree with me that this is their beauty and also their danger.
Allen Cole
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2003-06-24 11:48
allencole wrote:
> Regarding the worksheet - Anyone who wants it can have a copy,
> but I cannot post a file attachment to this BB so far as I
> know.
Guess what the "Add Attachments" button does ![[grin]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie5.gif)
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-06-24 13:25
Attachment: blues_chords.pdf (19k)
That's good enough for me, Mark. Here goes...
Okay, everybody. This attachment outlines basic blues structure, and provides three different approaches to using pentatonic scales for improvisation. It's intended for B-flat instruments to use along with Track 7, of How to Play Jazz and Improvise by Jamey Aebersold. (Vol.1)
If you can memorize all 12 of your major pentatonics, this sheet shows how you can extract your minor pentatonics and blues scales from them.
I hope you find it helpful.
Allen Cole
Post Edited (2003-06-24 13:32)
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Author: ned
Date: 2003-06-26 06:52
As one who has been playing blues numbers with jazz bands for numerous years, I would say: learning scales and arpeggios and the like is necessary to obtain fluidity in your playing but this is only step 1 in becoming a blues player.
This music is traditional and is passed down the line, so to speak. You can go to clubs to listen, that's one way, you can listen to records, that's another - I DON'T think you can learn it from a book though. It's all gained from experience.
Someone posted a week or two back about his gig with the "geetar boys" - I'm not sure that this displays any understanding of the idea or concept of blues playing really. For me you know, I wouldn't dare to post something to the effect that I played with some "classical players" and expect anyone to take me seriously - I have similar thoughts about the "geetar boys" post.
JK
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Author: wjk
Date: 2003-06-26 13:08
The "geetar boys" are actually schooled, talented blues and jazz musicians. I used the term to inject a little "lightheartedness" to the post. Historically, the early blues musicians did not have Ph.D.s in music theory. They played with their heart and soul. I suspect most classical musicians, however schooled, also aspire to play with their hearts and souls. I suspect also, that most musicians, however talented or accomplished, do once in a while like to have "some fun" and play in styles and with musicians outside of their usual realm. Playing "outside the box" is also a good thing to do occasionally in other aspects of life. Just my 2 cents.
Post Edited (2003-06-26 13:21)
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