 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Gary
Date: 2003-02-22 01:14
I recently purchased a Buffet Greenline clarinet and I know its made of compressed grenadilla wood powder and resin, so does it need to oiled like anyother wood clarinet. The inside of the bore is so glossy and smoothe it looks like plastic!
Thanks.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2003-02-22 01:54
It behaves like plastic. The grenadilla particles are sealed within the polymer, and can be likened to the way the stone is sealed within concrete.
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Author: Joel Clifton
Date: 2003-02-22 01:57
Isn't a greenline clarinet a waste of nice wood that could be used for an actual wooden clarinet? Do greenlines sound better than plastic ones? If so why?
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Author: Karel
Date: 2003-02-22 02:00
I believe Buffet uses only offcuts and wood that would previously have been thrown out, for grinding up for their Greenlines.
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Author: Karel
Date: 2003-02-22 02:07
I believe Buffet uses only offcuts and wood that would previously have been thrown out, for grinding up for their Greenlines. Greenlines are supposedly made to the same specifications as their professional wood models, with the benefit of not developing cracks. They should sound as good, but not necessarily better. Whether the resin will last as long as solid wood is,
I think, a question that will not be definitively answered for 5 or 6 decades at least.
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2003-02-22 02:22
Two indefinite arguements diverge concerning this material...
Grenadilla of suitable grain quality (even grain pattern, long enough billets free of checking or knots) is increasingly rare and not held in large quantity by any major maker.
(Apocryphal notions about Yamaha cornering the market notwithstanding... if you can't prove it, it's just another legend.)
Professional, first quality oboes (which are hideously expensive) have been made for and used by top orchestral players nearly 30 years now... Francois Kloc came from Loreee, where they made this sort of instrument and 'greenlighted' the 'GreenLine' program.
The stability of the material and precision to which a tonehole may be cut allow for top staff to make a tremendous instrument.
Go ahead... do the 10 foot test on these, too.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2003-02-22 12:23
No you don't oil a Greenline.
The difference between a Greenline and student grade instruments is that the Greenline is made to professional standards while the student instruments are not. You can find the same differences between student grade woods and pro grade woods.
If you want to see how bad a wooden horn can be, get your hands on an old Pan American model.
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Author: Bob
Date: 2003-02-22 13:15
All I know about "Greenline" horns is what I read but I have technical experience with plastics. Sawdust has been used as a filler in various plastic articles for many years. Anyone using plastics for almost anything would consider using fillers since they can modify the inherent properties of the plastic. Fillers such as sawdust may inprove impact resistance per se but, on the other hand.......
I certainly don't mean to imply that using the waste wood generated making wood horns is anything like my grandmother's using breadcrumbs and oatmeal in her meatloaf but I find the marketing hype associated with the Greenline horns interesting. One wonders if "grenadilla dust" has been used all along with their regular plastic horn line. The innovation should be applauded....
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Author: brenda siewert
Date: 2003-02-22 15:04
As Dee said, to answer your question--no, you don't oil a greenline. They don't crack and are treated like plastic. But, the tone is quite a bit better than plastic. I've owned one and wish I'd never sold it. It was a really, really nice one.
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Author: madvax
Date: 2003-02-22 15:31
According to the Buffet web site, they don't recommend oiling "any" of their clarinets, including the wooden ones.
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Author: Gary
Date: 2003-02-23 02:10
Thanks for the information guys.
I was pretty sure the Greenline would not need oiling but you guys seem well informed so thats why I asked.
The Greenline certainly does'nt sound, play or feel like plastic. Not quite as dark toned as my '69 R13.
Thanks again.
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2003-02-23 02:43
Greenlines simply don't need oil (none will be absorbed).
However, regarding Buffet's recommendation not to oil *any* of their Clarinets, it has long been my belief that the phrase "Lubricated for Life" is a self-fulfilling forecast.
Regards,
John
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Author: cyso_clarinetist
Date: 2003-06-17 02:49
Joel -
In my own opinion it isn't a waste of grenadilla wood if these clarinets can play just as well and you don't have to worry about warping, cracking, oiling and whatever else.
- James
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Author: Dawne
Date: 2003-06-17 08:23
I just can't get used to the "idea" of the Greenlines. What comes to my mind is particle board....LOL
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Author: Fred
Date: 2003-06-17 11:10
If Greenlines make you think of particle board, how does the mental image of your prized "real wood" clarinet being put back together with safety pins strike you? 
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2003-06-17 12:38
What reatains its critical shape best: particle board with a water-sealed surface (such as a kitchen bench) or a slab of grained timber?
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2003-06-17 12:48
Hmm...
If particle board were made of 2mm long fibers, soaked in a catalytic resin, pressed under several metric tonnes of pressure in a sealed container with an inert polymer and extruded into sheets...
******
Anybody that thinks plastic isn't a durable, tough material has never laced up a set of Hockey skates or put on ski boots.
It's a remarkable range of materials that can be shaped or cast into many useful things.
This business of what works better as an instrument ignores accoustic physical principles in favor of an aesthetic sense...
and does a disservice to young buyers looking for an informed opinion.
GREENLININE and other composite plastic instrument bodies DO NOT disintigrate or crack from use while playing.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2003-06-17 12:55
.......but there have already been cracked tenon problems so don't perpetrate the hype that they won't crack.......
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Author: BobD
Date: 2003-06-17 13:05
I would suspect that there are some oils that can degrade epoxy
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Author: Dawne
Date: 2003-06-17 13:24
I KNOW they don't crack....and I got a nice warm tone out of my little bundy deluxe for a number of years. Plastic is very practical, and can produce a satisfying tone. But I now want aesthetics, too. I want a horn that not only sounds beautiful, but is also beautiful to look at. There is nothing wrong with that. A clarinet is a work of art.... To each his own.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2003-06-17 15:17
They may not split along the length, but they DO crack and break in half. Breaks at the centre tenon have been reported in a (this, I think) forum. I don't recall whether this was an acknowledged bad batch, or whether it is something every owner needs to be careful with. Perhaps Buffet could incorporate some more carbon fibre in the weak centre tenon area.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2003-06-17 17:04
"I KNOW they don't crack".......duh!and then Oops!
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Author: cyso_clarinetist
Date: 2003-06-17 20:56
The clarinet looks beautiful as well. Infact you can't even tell its a green line excerpt for the little logo on it.
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Author: Dawne
Date: 2003-06-18 00:38
I was referring to the "cracking" we all dread that is an inherent quality of wood. But you already knew that, didn't ya Bob....dah
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Author: BobD
Date: 2003-06-18 14:57
Not all wood clarinets crack, so I wouldn't call it inherent. What you actually "meant" didn't dawne on me.
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2003-06-19 00:20
The bell tenons also break off laterally too Gordon. Pain in the bum because you wait forever for a replacement piece sans keys or spend a fortune on tenon graft reamers to fix them. I can't find much good to say about the greenline material. It is a pity that other makers haven't done much about making a pro level plastic or rubber clarinet body for years. There is a market for good quality instrument for outdoor/extreme climate playing. Fox make a pro composite bassoon that doesn't fall to pieces.
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