 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Corey
Date: 2003-04-30 20:52
Hello, I've been playing the clarinet for six years now and Whenever I play in Band ( 1st class of the day) then go to a sectional after school my embochure is weak and doesn't last very long. My question is, why is my embochure tireing(sp?) so quickly? I can maybe play an hour or so at home and it will start to go weak on me.......Is there anything that can be done about this? thanks, Corey
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Author: funkymunky
Date: 2003-05-01 00:25
Play reeds way to stiff. Play till you get sore. Play till you cant blow. I tortured myself for 2 weeks playing 5's and now they play like 3's. I actually made a Vandoren 5 sound good. Start with 4's then move up. I used to barely sound good on a GCS 4 1/2. same reed 2 weeks later plays like a 2 1/2.
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Author: Corey
Date: 2003-05-01 00:38
Could it be that I bite a little too much which I've been trying to rid myself of latley? I don't think it's my reed strength that is the problem as I sound fine on my reeds. Thanks tho, Funkymunky. Any more advice?
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Author: Tom Piercy
Date: 2003-05-01 00:49
I hope the advice given above isn't serious.
There is no reason to play on reeds too stiff for you to build up your endurance.
There is certainly no reason to "play till you get sore. Play till you can't blow."
Doing the above can actually lessen your endurance and damage your muscles and cause other problems involving tension in your jaw, neck, throat, arms and hands.
To build up your endurance:
to start: play more each day, take frequent short breaks so as not to tire your muscles and so as not to be playing on tired muscles. Playing on tired muscles can do damage.
One reason you may be able to play more at home than in a rehearsal is that in a rehearsal you may be blowing too hard and loud; you may not be able to hear yourself as well in a group setting and you may start falling into bad habits.
The fact that your rehearsal is the first thing in the morning could be tiring you out soon because it is early in the morning and you may not be warmed up in any way at all.
Try warming up easily for a few minutes when you first start playing in the day. Check to see if you are playing too loud and blowing too hard in the rehearsals -- if you are, then don't.
Take it easy and good luck.
Tom Piercy
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Author: Mitch K.
Date: 2003-05-01 00:56
While putting students on stiff reeds is a valid, yet controversial, technique--in fact that's what my first private teacher did to me on my first lesson! However, there are other ways to achieve the same result, asuming that your intended goal is to strengthen your embouchure.
About a month before my very first recital, many, many, many years ago, I went running to my teacher's studio nearly in tears because I couldn't play through my entire recital without getting embouchure fatigue. Her adive: for the following week practice in 15-minute segments. Practice for 15 minutes, then rest for 15 minutes -- do that for a total of 2 1/2 hours of _practice_ time. The week after that was to be 20-25 minutes of practice, 10 minutes of rest. At my recital, I was able to get through almost all of my recital without getting fatigued (I got tired at the very end of the last piece, Beethoven's Trio for Clarinet, Cello, and Piano).
Also, the fatigue could be caused by too much embouchure pressure/tension. That can be caused by using reeds that are too stiff and trying to make them sound good. The embouchure that I teach, and that I was taught, is " 'O' with the lips, 'E' with the tongue."
Best of luck,
Mitch King
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Author: Ed
Date: 2003-05-01 00:57
I agree with Tom's advice. I also agree that playing on harder reeds than you need is a bad idea. I think that it will encourage many bad habits, including biting. Try some long tones, slurred intervals and scales on a regular basis and for warm up and it should help. Sometimes, as Tom suggests, overblowing may be an issue. Try to project by focussing your tone and don't try to compete with the brass. If you bear down too hard on your embouchure, the tension can cause more fatigue.
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Author: funkymunky
Date: 2003-05-01 02:52
I felt a big difference in what I did. May not work for everyone. I have only been playing 2 months and feel comfortable with 4 1/2 and 5's. They sound great without even scraping them.
>oh and i just found the secret to making soft reeds hard without cutting or scraping them. Just have to push the reed up to overlap the tip, the higher the reed, the harder it gets. I have have just tried it on my squeaky 3 1/2 and the squeaks went away, just by pushing the reed up to overlap the tip.
maybe im just blowing too hard from getting used to those harder reeds.
Post Edited (2003-05-01 04:02)
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2003-05-01 03:02
funkymunky wrote:
> I felt a big difference in what I did.
Are you getting professional guidance in what you're doing, or are you just trying this on your own? For someone who's only played 2 months I think you may be doing yourself a big disservice.
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Author: funkymunky
Date: 2003-05-01 03:04
well it has made it easier to play. I play alot more and sound better at it.
I guess it worked.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2003-05-01 03:07
funkymunky wrote:
> well it has made it easier to play. I play alot more and sound
> better at it.
> I guess it worked.
Didn't answer my question, though. You may not be doing as well as you think.
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-05-01 07:34
It's hard to advise on this subject, Corey, when we don't know what kind of setup you're playing. The harder reed advice (in moderation!) might be apt if you have a stock setup that you have clearly outgrown after 6 years. I don't know about going cold-turkey to 5's. Just try going up one or two half-strengths and see what happens. If you are still playing on your stock mouthpiece, this might be preparation for trying out a new one.
Could you be sharp and not adjusting? Even when in good shape, I have experienced tremendous fatigue when in a playing environment where I have to force myself to flatten my pitch significantly. I played a couple of pit gigs with a very flat piano that made me feel terrible all the time and cut my endurance sharply. At the time, I didn't realize how flat things were. I just knew it was killing me. Checking the piano with a tuner opened my eyes to the problem. (almost a quarter step down!) The altered embouchure that this situation forced was murder on muscles who were being used much differently than normal.
A variation on this might occur with a player to pulls out a quarter inch at the barrel and none between the upper and lower joints. I've seen some folks go through serious fits trying to get their long notes down to a pitch proportionate with the throat tones. It can even more excruciating if you are playing on a 'substantial' reed.
I don't know if this applies to you, but it's just a thought.
Allen Cole
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Author: Corey
Date: 2003-05-01 12:49
Well, as for my set-up, I play on a Walter Grabner Mouthpiece "Conservatorie", Walter Grabner Cocobolo Barrel, Vandoren #3.5's and an E11.
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2003-05-02 02:09
F. U. L. D> O. M. P. firmer upper lip down on mouthpiece....this goes a long way in helping by getting rid of the lower lip as the focal point for embouchure control!
Too soft of a reed is just as hard to control as a hard one... in some ways a soft reed can become the cause of biting as well because the tone is so wild and hard to control...this can lead to pinching from the lower jaw...
Think of playing with cool fast air and focus the air out in front of the two front top teeth when blowing...maintain active support of the diaphram which helps control the air column.
Get away from controlling the tone through jaw pressure....keep embouchure tucked and steady. Avoid changing the embouchure especially in larger intervallic leaps!!!
David Dow
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2003-05-02 02:12
Get some private lessons and don't play on a set up that is too hard or too soft...
Embouchure on wind instruments is a very tricky business.
No one gets a "hero badge"for playing on some impossibly hard set-up.
David Dow
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Author: PJ
Date: 2003-05-02 03:01
Cyber Pedegogy... Is this taught at any university, college or conservatory?
It is not possible to address this issue on the internet. Some very good points were mentioned here, but the best thing to do is to get a good teacher that can watch and hear you play. Only then can the problem be properly addressed. That, I feel, is the best advice.
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