 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2003-03-11 13:01
From all of my readings on this BB and advertisements in various catalogs, there appears to be 3 distinct categories of clarinets: 1) student; 2) intermediate; and 3) professional. In this posting, I would like to concentrate on #3, the professional clarinet.
Allow me to restate the original heading of this post. What "really" constitutes a "professional" clarinet?
(I sense that a lot of controversy will follow this posting and all I can ask is that we all remain civil and refrain from bashing anyone or any brand of clarinet. To me...that would be very "unprofessional". I also sense that Mark C. will be monitoring this one rather closely.)
Before I begin, you might be asking yourself, why is he posting this? That one is easy for me to answer....I simply want to know.
So let's get started:
1) Intonation. Just how important is intonation? From all of my readings, this one, IMO, appears to be at the top of the list. However, if this is true, then, again, from all of the post responses I have read in the past, the Buffet R13 would, unfortunately, have to be deleted. Why? Because I have read so many post responses about intonation problems with the R13. (Oh... I can already hear the howls of "FOUL!!"). Again, all I'm after here is some form of a standard definition (if that is possible) of what constitutes a "professional" clarinet. For example, if I have a Vito V40 that is "spot on" from bottom to top, does that mean it's in the "professional" category?
2) Sound quality. IMO, this would probably rank as #2 on the "professional" clarinet hit parade chart. However, sound quality, IMO, is so subjective in nature....what sounds great to one person may sound just auful to someone else. This is an element that one simply cannot whip out their "sound quality" meter and see where it registers. From my readings on this BB, IMO, the R13 is the undisputed champ in this category. So now what? Even with its intonation problems, do we bring it back into the "professional" category? How about all of the other instruments? Where do we draw the line? Or, can a line even be drawn? Another example: If I were to have a very inexpensive, plastic instrument made somewhere in a country whose name I might have difficulty in pronouncing, that had excellent intonation and happened to produce a "beautiful" tone to a specified percentage of listeners, would it fall into the "professional" category?
3) Construction quality. I think I might be correct in placing this one at the #3 spot. Allow me to phrase some questions...If I had a clarinet that was "spot on", produced a beautiful tone but had various fundamental construction problems, would you delete it from the "professional" series? Just how important is construction quality anyway? Where do you draw the line, if that is even possible? Just how important is the "feel" of the instrument?
I'm going to stop with just the above 3. I was going to add "appearance", but, decided intonation, sound and construction quality were enough.
IMO, I really don't expect us to come to any definitive definition. I'm not sure it's really possible.
What I'm hoping for is to receive some very informative responses simply so that I can increase my understanding of what is really important "in the real world" of the "play everyday" musician (professional or otherwise) and from people in the honorable profession of repairing this wonderful instrument.
I apologize for the long posting, but, hopefuly it will be a fruitful endeavor.
I thank you in advance for your responses.
Dan
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bradley
Date: 2003-03-11 13:24
I think it would have to be a combination of all three of the above- and also you might have to add features. The Opus and Concerto are essentially the same clarinet, but I would rate the Opus in an even different category higher than run-of-the-mill professional. It comes with the capped tenons, unstained wood, Eb lever, and so on that pushes it onto the same level as the Buffet Elite, Festival and so on (in my own opinion).
Getting on the the other 3.
Intonation is very big, because I have strayed away from the R13 because of the une-eveness, but that doesnt mean you cant find a great one with decent intonation , that is further augmented by having a mouthpiece, barrel and reed tht help the R13 become "spot on". Another thing is- just because you find a clarinet that's in tune doesnt mean it is necessarily a professional. I play on my Selmer 1400 in marching band and every time I set up it is spot on, but we all know it is light years away from being professional.
Sound or I guess Tone Quality is also a must, but it cant be alone.
You have to make sure a clarinet has the sound you want. It would be first on the list for me, because you can always fix intonation, but you cant change a clarinet's bore size and bore design to suit the sound you want as easily......
I would also like to disagree with the notion that the R13 is the undisputed champ. I am not going to tell you Leblanc is the best, even though I do think that. I know that many like the sound of a particular Selmer, or another Buffet- maybe the RC better than the "R13". Thats just in mass-produced clarinets. What about Eatons , Rossis, Patricolas and so on.
Construction Quality......
I am a Leblanc player, and I personally think that they are great clarinets, but I also know that they are not the most durable professional clarinets out there. This might not be because of poor quality, but design ( i.e. their keywork ) can give problems even though its not poor in quality. This doesnt mean I'm going to start play a Yamaha Custom Model for its construction.
The "feel" of the clarinet I think would have to be in a separate category under design. Leblanc's keywork is the best I've played on , and I'm sure other people feel the same way about other brands.
I think a professional clarinet has to be a decent combination of all of these things, and every1's standards are different. It depends on what you will compromise in a clarinet for something else it offers......
Bradley
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: D Dow
Date: 2003-03-11 13:28
Dear Dan:
I have had some time to digest the above and thought I would add my personal slant on this already difficult topic. It also hinges a great deal on what you intent on doing so top speak. I work as Principal Clarinet in an orchestra and found a number of things you said to be quite interesting. I will go towards them pint by point. For me an instrument needs to have good sound above all and excellent response. Tuning can be brought around by a fine repairman. For students this type of repair can be cost prohibitive!
Most pros tend to go with what suits there own individual playing chacteristics. Among a dozen or so R13s you will finds many that posess aspects that either one likes or dislikes. However, being practical if one gets too picky one will never actually settle and develop playing habits which correct the weak aspects of the way the clarinet actually plays. In fact a fine instrument will bring out both the streagnths and weakness' of a performer.
Last, I would certainly add that all instruments have individuality. Being something of a traditionalist I dislike plastic immensely. I find plastic clarinets or ABS resin just not very alive. I also have had no success with the Greenline models and find an unpleasant ping in the sound. Even with al of the technology of our day one must realize we just can't create something better that nature can produce. That being said some of my students sound great on their Greenline models.
An instrument should also be flexible in terms of its tuning as well. this means being able to move the "pitch" around as so to blend with other instruments. This is asking alot of a 32 inch piece of wood. But with patience you can certainly find the instrument of you dreams.
Sincerely,
D Dow
David Dow
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2003-03-11 13:46
Bright plating on the keys, so that the audience can see you when you move about during your 2 bar solo.
Beautifully figured wood, preferably obscured by dark stain - so that your section mates know you're serious.
A BIG logo, so your picture always shows the instrument you endorse.
A large case, so that you can fit in the grubby horn you've played with confidence for 30 years, for the challenging passages.
Given the amount of breaking in, setting up and hand-tuning that so many pros tolerate, it is really a wonder that more aren't playing hand-made custom horns...
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2003-03-11 15:20
If a "professional" actually plays it for a living. Like "the Duke" said, "If it sounds good, it is good." (that's all folks)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: larryb
Date: 2003-03-11 19:07
William:
slight correction - it's simply "Duke" not "the Duke" (you wouldn't refer to "the Prez/Pres," but simply "Prez/Pres")
plus, for the sake of completeness, it was Porky Pig who said "that's all folks"
Finally, to support your overall argument, Bird (not "the Bird") played some beautiful music on a plastic alto sax, and he got paid for it.
This Bulletin Board is obviously obsessed with equipment (why not - it's fun consumerism). Probably would have a greater impact on people's clarinet playing to focus more on the physical mechanics: embouchure, breath support, etc. etc.
But go ahead, post ad nauseum about clarinet brands, mouthpieces, reeds, set ups, pad cups, ligatures, cork grease, reed holders, swabs, cases, case covers, stands, thumb protectors, pocket protectors, sand stone, soap stone, rolling paper, lubricants, weapons inspectors, metronomes, tuning forks, forklift operators, springs, felt, rubber, plastic, grenadilla, rosewood, packwood, etc
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Todd W.
Date: 2003-03-11 20:15
larryb --
Of course Porky was only a "virtual" actor--it was really Mel Blanc who said, "Th-th-that's all, folks!"
Favorite forklift operator. Would that be in the supporting role category?
Todd W.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: chuck
Date: 2003-03-11 22:24
Just the first two points: intonation and sound quality. It ain't the horn, it's the guy holding it. Chuck
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bradley
Date: 2003-03-11 22:49
Synonymous Botch - I disagree with the BIG logo comment. All the logo has to be is distinctive. Often times, a big logo will look out of place and just plain ugly.
D Dow- Tuning can be fixed easily with a new barrel, or other methods. However- if the clarinet is uneven its not as easy to fix......
You have to make sure the clarinet doesnt change pitch too much from the top to bottom of its range. I agree with you on the response thing though- I forgot to add that.
Bradley
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2003-03-11 23:01
Bradley wrote:
> Synonymous Botch - I disagree with the BIG logo comment. All
> the logo has to be is distinctive. Often times, a big logo will
> look out of place and just plain ugly.
I think you missed the sarcasm ...
> D Dow- Tuning can be fixed easily with a new barrel, or other
> methods. However- if the clarinet is uneven its not as easy to
> fix......
I think David knows more about correcting tuning problems than you might at this point in your career ... if tuning were so easy to fix you can be assured that a working professional would know how to do it.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bradley
Date: 2003-03-12 02:46
No they arent
and Mark- I give up on this topic. There is officially no point to it anymore as far as me replying goes........
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Dan Shusta
Date: 2003-03-12 03:30
To Bradley: thank you very much for your in-depth analysis. It is much appreciated and I have learned much from your response.
To D Dow: thank you also for adding perspectives that I had not thought of.
To Chuck: I believe your perspective is probably shared by many. Thanks.
To larryb: I know that you are a professional musician. As such, I think your background could have yielded much insight which could have enlightened many of us wanna be's. As I understand your response, all that is necessary is correct embouchure, breath support, etc for any clarinet to be classified as a "professional" playing instrument. Hmmmm...I'm beginning to feel better all the time about my plastic V40. Thank you for your response. Perhaps you are correct. Any instrument, plastic or otherwise, becomes a "professional" instrument in the hands of a professional.
Again, my thanks to all.
Dan
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Sylvain
Date: 2003-03-12 04:37
There is no denying that there are different qualities of instruments.
A "professional" clarinet is probably not the best term to use but there is such a thing as an amazing instrument, mouthpiece, reed, etc...
Although I am not a pro I have been playing long enough to ahve an opinion on the matter.
A great setup, is one that allows me some flexibility in the sound I want for a particular piece with maximum comfort.
That includes a good intonation, the right amount of resistance across the entire range, a certain character to the sound, a nice comfortable key action including a fancy thumbrest, keys that don't slip, etc...
-S
--
Sylvain Bouix <sbouix@gmail.com>
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Vick
Date: 2003-03-12 05:34
Is it really "professional" or just what is "popular" in the professional world of clarinet playing?
Just a thought........
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bradley
Date: 2003-03-15 04:43
Vick- that makes me think.....
I think that if you can have a good sound on any particular clarinet, and you like it ( as long as another clarinet would'nt help your sound) that's the "professional" instrument for you.
If you can get away with saving all that money, then go for it.......
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
