 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Jeroen
Date: 2003-01-24 12:13
Recently I tried a set of Selmer Centered Tones.
The Bb played recently well in tune but the A had a problem in the altissimo: far too sharp.
I was wondering if a different mpc/barrel could solve this problem.
Is there anyone out there who has experience with this?
Thanks,
Jeroen
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Author: William
Date: 2003-01-24 14:37
My experiance with the Selmer CT was while I was still in high school and relatively inexperianced (although I was studying privately). My clarinet played quite sharp, particularily in the upper register, but generally, throughoutit's entire range. In an attempt to correct my clarinets extreme tuning characteristics, I returned the clarinet to the music store where it was purchased and they sent it back to the Selmer factory in Elkhart, In. The factory "experts" added about four centimeters of length to the lower tendon of the upper joint--a very skillful job asthetically, but one which did very little to address the issue of extreme sharpeness throughout, except in the "long tube" notes. It fact, as many of you can guess, it made tuning matters even worse. I still cannot believe, to this day, what the people at Selmer were thinking. Anyhow, water through the bore, so to speak. But my point is, Selmer CT's, even those of my friends, always seemed to play sharp and needed extreme adjustment, either to the clarinet itself--long tuning barrel, pulled joints, etc--or in extreme embouchure adjustment for certain registers and notes. They could be played in tune, if the clarinetist was "good" enough (as Hat likes to say), but at best, were difficult to play at A=440. My final solution was to trade my CT in for a Selmer 9* which I picked out at the Selmer factory--a much finer instrument, I might add.
Sorry, but my final analysis of CT's is: 1) great sound for general playing venue, but, 2) general tuning problems that I would choose not to deal with.
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Author: William
Date: 2003-01-24 15:19
Opps--I stand (or sit, actually) corrected. Thankyouverymuchhhhh..
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Author: Eddie
Date: 2003-01-24 16:14
I played on a Selmer A made around 1950 (possibly centered tone or the model preceeding it) for several years and the top-of-staff C# and D were very, very sharp. I remember there were other tuning issues, but those notes especially were way out of line. Its Bb sister didn't have the same kind of problems. Those horns have a neat sound, and the German silver feels nice, but the tuning problems on the A are too bad to use it seriously, imo.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-01-24 16:42
Having 2 Bb C T's, I'm interested in all comments like those above. My experience on the later-serialed one, P 97xx, while limited, is very satisfactory for what sop. playing I do. I had the feeling that the earlier P 2xxx may have suffered somewhat from a crack repair, but it is still reasonably well in tune, and both are quite compatible with later Selmers.. Luck, Don
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2003-01-24 19:32
My Selmer BT A played a little sharp. I just drapped a small string down the bore (double reed thread) and forgot about it.
jbutler
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Author: Henry
Date: 2003-01-24 20:22
JB...Are you putting us on or are you serious? What do you mean exactly? I'm new at this, although I put a wine cork in the bell of my alto sax to improve the response of the lowest notes (C, B and Bb)! But I've never heard of your trick with the string.
Henry
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-01-24 21:03
I'll sure also be interested in JB's "string" technique, please discuss. Henry, your wine cork method might help me play my alto sax low notes more softly, so will try! Would a French wine cork be the best, just loose in the bottom?, red or white?? Don
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2003-01-24 21:08
Dropping a string is a method to reduce the internal bore diameter, and is inconsistent, at best. The twine should be some nylon derivative and pretty large to make any change.
*Don't leave it in after swabbing*
Both the CT and BT models are larger bore designs, and share the same sort of difficulties playing high as did the 1010 design.
Do you have a large bore, short length mouthpiece or a modern medium bore, medium length mouthpiece in use?
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Author: Henry
Date: 2003-01-24 21:14
Don...Yes, just a loose cork in the bottom of the bell. It DOES help for me! (As I prefer reds, that's what usually ends up there.) Make sure you have a few extras in your case, as they get easily lost when you invert the horn (say, for "drainage").
Good luck and let us know whether it works for you.
Henry
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2003-01-24 21:50
Putting the string down the bore will decrease the size of the bore and lower the pitch slightly. It's not a perfect system, but it will lower the pitch. I used to have some college buddies that would put a sting down the bore with a sizable knot at the end to produce a very out of tune A clarinet out of their Bb.
jbutler
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Author: jbutler
Date: 2003-01-24 23:09
Oh, BTW, I had my tongue firmly planted in my cheek in the first post. Some days I just feel a little devilish. However, it is sort of fun to "play around" dropping the string down the bore when you get bored. The best solution is to find a clarinet that plays with good intonation. I would suggest finding a barrel and mouthpiece combination that <i>might</i> work a bit better. Sometimes the search can take a long time and more money than you would care to spend.
jbutler
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Author: DougR
Date: 2003-01-25 02:29
Dropping a string down the bore used to be a standard prescription for getting high-pitch instruments into the a-440 ballpark.
Also, apropos of the wine cork business, my Selmer alto (Mk 6, 87,000 series) won't play worth a damn without one. Apparently, Selmer altos were manufactured with bottom crooks of random lengths. Mine is a "short crook" version (measured by how much of the crook is showing, north of the c# pad).
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-01-25 19:17
Velly interesting, Doug R/Henry, I'll save corks, will several be better for the low B and Bb?? My Mark 6 alto, ser. M 898xx measures about 27 mm from top of C# pad to top of "crook ring". I made other measurements but that [I believe] corresponds to your measurement., Comments. please. Always enjoy word-play humor. Don
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Author: Henry
Date: 2003-01-25 19:41
Don.. Have you tried the cork trick and does it work for you? I don't know if, in this case, the more the merrier. That's an area for experimentation. By the way, I don't have a Mark VI. I have a mid-50s Dolnet that I bought new in the Netherlands at the time. Except for two small ones, it still has all its original (red!) pads!! Great horn!
Henry
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-01-25 20:46
Doggone it Henry, I'm afraid my sax-playing needs much practice, [mainly bass cl lately], my dance band buddy has told me to get-with my Eb playing, he wants me on bari for some old combo charts! I couldn't find any diff. with combinations of Zabaco, Stone Bluff and/or Glen Ellen corks, but attribute that to my present poor emb/tech, will try further!! I thot they might rattle, but my volume must have been too great to hear! Don
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