 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: CheezBurgr
Date: 2024-11-02 23:57
I have been playing clarinet for about 3 months now, and can play both the chalumeau and clarion registers very consistently. Or at least I could until about a week ago, when the lower register (starting from the lowest C down) suddenly started sounding like the one above it. I can work down to these notes, but can almost never play them separately. I've worked on my embouchure, which didn't help, and there are no leaks I can find. I did notice a small crack, but it doesn't look like it's big or deep enough to be the cause. Does anyone have any suggestions?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2024-11-03 01:43
Slurring from lower register to upper register is easy, but slurring from the upper register down to the lower register is far more difficult and chances are it won't happen and you'll just remain in the upper register until you tongue the note again. Expect to have to rearticulate/tongue the lower note on any downward slurs across the registers so the lower note will speak.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-11-03 02:25
CheezBurgr wrote:
> the lower register (starting from the lowest C down) suddenly
> started sounding like the one above it. I can work down to
> these notes, but can almost never play them separately.
As I read this, I think you're saying that the notes below C4 (leger line below the staff) play in the wrong (upper) register when you attack them separately, but that you can slur down through them (I assume with some feeling of instability).
If that's the right reading, two thigs occur to me:
1. You *do* have a leak but lack the experience and technical knowledge to find it, or
2. The "small crack" you noticed isn't as small as you think. Attaching photos to posts here is not easy (despite the <Add Attachments> button at the bottom of the message window), but if you could manage to attach a picture of the "crack" it might be a help. It could be a surface "check" that doesn't go through to the bore, or it might be a crack, which, even if small, will let air escape, which is what a leak is.
3. Just as an afterthought - have you had this problem with a number of reeds, or are you using the same reed each time you try to solve the problem?
Karl
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2024-11-03 02:45
Sounds like a leak to me. A leak test is easy. Take the top joint by itself with the fingers and thumb over their respective holes. Then stop the bottom with the heel of your right hand. place your mouth at the top and suck the air out (you may have done something like this with a coke bottle). If it doesn't hold the seal for at least a slow count of three (roughly), then you have a leak. Also, you should get a nice popping sound when you remove your fingers from their holes.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: bmcgar ★2017
Date: 2024-11-03 03:25
Try this first. It's a problem that I see frequently.
Easy fix, if what I expect is your problem.
https://www.staccatosamurai.online/articles/magic-for-unplayable-clarinets
B.
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Author: CheezBurgr
Date: 2024-11-03 05:11
kdk wrote:
"Attaching photos to posts here is not easy (despite the <Add Attachments> button at the bottom of the message window), but if you could manage to attach a picture of the "crack" it might be a help."
For some reason the 'Add Attachments' button only refreshes the page for me (at least that's what it looks like), but if you would like I can email you an image.
Following Paul Aviles' instructions, I still do not think there is a leak. Also, loosening the Ab key sadly did not work. I will continue to check if the problem is me by working more on my voicing and embouchure.
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Author: Micke Isotalo ★2017
Date: 2024-11-03 11:28
To definitely rule out a leak, I would do as Paul suggested but blowing instead of sucking (sometimes a leaky pad can stop leaking while sucked towards its tonehole - but not when blowing, since that's the direction of the air also when playing). Grip the joint gently but blow as hard as you possibly can, and your feeling should be no less than as blowing into a bottle - i.e with no air whatsoever escaping.
If air is escaping, block the lower end with your thigh instead of your palm, and then with your r.h. fingers systematically press each key cup towards its tonehole. When the air stops escaping, you've located the leak. But if not (without even a reduction in flow), the source could be either a crack (sometimes barely visible), a post drilling or in rare cases even through the wooden structure itself (assuming a wooden clarinet). Locating such sources would probably need to be done by a qualified technician.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-11-03 19:08
You can send me an image. I may be able to get the attachment into a message, or I *might* be able to tell you from looking at it that it's a crack (which will almost certainly leak) or a surface check (which won't).
Karl (address is in my profile)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2024-11-03 20:53
Attachment: P5140001.JPG (683k)
Attachment: P5140002.JPG (649k)
If you've bent the linkage between the joints during assembly or mashed up the cork on the linkage so it's folded on itself, that will prevent the RH ring key vent pad from closing which will equate to a leak from C downwards.
Be sure you're holding the joints correctly during assembly/disassembly so nothing gets bent on either joint. ALWAYS hold the top joint in your left hand and lower joint in your right hand regardless if you're left or right handed as that aspect of being left or right handed is irrelevant as you inevitably use your left hand to control the top joint and the right hand controls the lower joint in 99.9999999999999999999% of clarinets - those statistics don't lie.
Attached is how I recommend you hold the joints to avoid bending anything during assembly/disassembly and always use high quality cork grease to make assembly easy (but don't overdo it).
When holding the top joint, hold down the ring keys to raise the linkage between the joints and get into the habit of holding the throat A touchpiece down as that will be important later on if you decide to play bass clarinet.
When holding the lower joint, holding the large pad cups closed with your thumb will ensure you're not bending anything. Do not touch the RH ring keys during assembly.
Then push and twist the joints together, making a WWWW motion instead of screwing the joints together in just the one direction which I've seen people doing like they're removing a bottle cap. That will mash up the keywork which is why a lot of used clarinets have scratched up or bent C#/G# and RH F/C tochpieces as people haven't taken any care during assembly/disassembly.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-11-03 21:06
Chris P wrote:
> If you've bent the linkage between the joints during assembly
> or mashed up the cork on the linkage so it's folded on itself,
> that will prevent the RH ring key vent pad from closing which
> will equate to a leak from C downwards.
>
A leak which, importantly, will not be detected by the leak tests described here.
Karl
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-11-04 03:36
I got your to photos. It looks like a crack to me - it goes through the top trill-key tonehole and continues down the side of the clarinet alongside the trill key. The key cup is also off-line, so the pad itself is probably not seating against the hole and letting air through.
I'm trying to attach your pics to this, but if I can't make it work, I'll start a new thread and post here to redirect you.
Karl
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2024-11-04 05:35
Cracks are repairable and if anything, it's better to repair the crack than replace the entire top joint on wooden clarinets (not as critical on plastic, ebonite, resin and other composites) if you chose a specific clarinet out of a lineup of others because you liked that particular instrument best.
That way, you'll still have the very instrument you originally chose, so you won't have to get used to how differently the new joint plays, you won't have to go through the whole playing-in process again (and this is the wrong time of year to be doing that with a new wooden top joint or entirely new wooden instrument) and it's far less costly to repair cracked joints than to replace them, even if they're under guarantee as someone somewhere will have to foot the bill for that.
I've got an early 1960s Buffet R16 3/4 (or a full Boehm R13 by another name) where the top joint has split right through to the bore on both sides, yet it's been glued up and repaired in the past by pinning, then I carbon fibre banded it for even more security and it plays like a dream.
Remember - cracks aren't the end of the world, they're just an inconvenience and in most cases they're repairable. And in many cases, they can often play and even resonate much better once they've cracked and have been properly repaired.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kdk
Date: 2024-11-04 06:16
Chris P wrote:
> Remember - cracks aren't the end of the world, they're just an
> inconvenience and in most cases they're repairable. And in many
> cases, they can often play and even resonate much better once
> they've cracked and have been properly repaired.
>
I strongly second that opinion - not to mention that the bent trill key can easily be put back where it belongs. I wonder if that was a result of gripping the clarinet across the trill pads during assembly. That wouldn't have caused the crack, but might now be exacerbating the air leakage.
Karl
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