 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ldmagain
Date: 2020-08-22 18:26
I am the fortunate owner of a rare Charles Mahillon Db Albert system clarinet circa 1870s. It is stamped Medal D'Or from the Paris world Exposition of 1878. Is there anyone out there that can tell me about these instruments or point me to someone who is knowledgeable? I have had it completely restored and it's beautiful. Now I need to find some music or start transposing!!
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-08-22 20:35
It'll be perfect for military band transcriptions where stuff usually gets shunted up a semitone to favour the Bb and Eb instruments, but is a pain for Concert Pitch instruments especially when they're used to playing the original orchestral versions in the original keys.
That's alright for clarinet solos that were originally scored for A clarinet and the same untransposed part is played on a Bb in the band version (only sounding a semitone higher than the original) without having to learn the solo in a different key (especially if it's one you can run off from memory).
Some band parts include Db flute and piccolo parts, but the oboe parts would also benefit being played on a Db instrument and there aren't many old Db oboes about (Triebert, etc.). Who wants to play in six or seven flats when you can run off a famous orchestral solo in the original key of one or two flats or in original orchestral keys of G or D instead of brass band keys of Ab or Eb?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2020-08-23 01:30)
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Author: donald
Date: 2020-08-23 01:15
C clarinet at high pitch? Or have you some documentation showing that company produced Db clarinets?
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2020-08-23 01:58
I’d put my money on C at high pitch. A = 466 was not uncommon in parts of Europe even in the 19th century. In fact I once had one of these “Db” clarinets that was really a C clarinet tuned to this pitch. As far as I know there is no documentation of a Db clarinet having ever been made, nor is there any compelling reason to make one.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: Philip Caron
Date: 2020-08-23 02:26
Several years ago I spent time listing different pitched clarinets, drawing on the internet and several books I had access to. I didn't find Db anywhere (nor Gb.) That doesn't mean there isn't one, but some of the better-known authorities and collections don't include it.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-08-23 03:48
There was a set of five Buffet soprano clarinets pitched in A, Bb, B (natural), C and I think Db as well for sale a fair while back. I thought the one built in the key of B (natural) was an oddity.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2020-08-23 06:20
Chris P wrote:
> There was a set of five Buffet soprano clarinets pitched in A,
> Bb, B (natural), C and I think Db as well for sale a fair while
> back. I thought the one built in the key of B (natural) was an
> oddity.
>
I think this is another case of high pitched clarinets being misidentified. It makes far more sense that Buffet would make a HP Bb clarinet(almost B natural) and a HP C clarinet (almost Db) . Back before international pitch standards it would make sense to carry around clarinets in both HP and LP. I cannot see why anyone would ever need both a B natural and a Db clarinet on the other hand.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-08-23 16:51
There was talk on here of clarinets built in B (natural) for outdoor playing in winter so they'd play flat enough in those conditions to become in tune Bb clarinets.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: el gitano
Date: 2020-08-23 17:06
Hi Chris,
and what´s happend with the other instruments, all to low?
Claus
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2020-08-23 17:08
The flutes would be fine as they're normally sharp anyway!
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Enatural
Date: 2020-08-24 20:10
Hi 1dMadain,
Have you a photo of your Mahillon Db Clarinet, it would be interesting to see it. I would be interested in knowing the bore size and length with and without the mouthpiece.
In my post about my D metal clarinet, A. Rice suggested that Charles Mahillon could be the maker. So I would be interested to see the features of your clarinet.
On Mimo, musical instruments on line, there are three clarinets with nominal pitch of B so your Charles Mahillon, did make odd sized clarinets.
Roy
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2020-08-25 16:58
Isn’t a B natural Basset clarinet required for a Mozart opera? Not sure how extensive it’s use is in that piece.
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Author: smokindok
Date: 2020-08-25 20:32
JTJC wrote:
> Isn’t a B natural Basset clarinet required for a Mozart
> opera? Not sure how extensive it’s use is in that piece.
The Parto, Parto aria from Tito calls for Bb basset clarinet. Can be confusing because in German, what we call Bb (in the USA) is called B and B is called H.
(Edited for spelling and punctuation.)
Post Edited (2020-08-25 20:38)
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Author: Simon Aldrich
Date: 2020-08-25 21:31
JTCT, you might be thinking of the two instances where Mozart wrote for clarinet in B natural in his operas, Idomeneo and Cosi. Evidence of this is in the autograph of those operas and in an explanation in the forward of the Neue Mozart Ausgabe of why, in all editions (including the NMA), the parts for clarinet in B natural are transposed for clarinet in A.
In Idomeneo, B clarinets are used in No. 15 (chorus) and No. 19 (aria).
Simon
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Author: JTJC
Date: 2020-08-25 23:59
Thanks to Smokindok and Simon. Simon’s answer is the one I was thinking of.
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