 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Bluesparkle
Date: 2009-05-26 20:37
In a community band with 8-9 regular clarinet players (if we all show up). Can play most of the repertoire with weekly practices, but struggle with some technical passages in several tunes. Have little/no individual practice time due to two jobs and family. Need more practice to lessen the guilty feeling that I'm the weak link 2nd clarinet. Many performances on holiday weekends, which kinda bums me out.
Question is...do I contribute to the group because I can play most things, or take away from it because I can't play everything? No practice time equals not playing at my potential. That in itself is personally disappointing, but by continuing to play, am I actually holding back the ensemble?
I'm starting to feel like I did in college band...like it's something I am committed to do, and therefore should follow through with my commitment, even if I know I am not able to contribute my highest and best.
Throw in the towel or wash my hands of the guilt and keep going?
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2009-05-26 20:44
Talk to your section mates and ask for their honest input. Do the same with the director. Explain that you don't have the time for much (or any) practice, but that you enjoy making what contributions you can. See what happens. Be honest with your section partners and they will probably be quite supportive and understanding. If/when you get time to practice, make the best use of the time that you can.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
Post Edited (2009-05-26 20:44)
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Author: Bluesparkle
Date: 2009-05-27 00:32
Got moved up from last chair 3rd clarinet (where they start the newest band members) to 2nd because one of the other 2nds is leaving town for a few months. None of the other 3rd clarinets wanted to go up. I'm the "new" girl, so all of a sudden I found myself being handed the 2nd clarinet folder.
I just find that it's not 100% enjoyable when I'm fighting through several passages in multiple songs, regardless of whether it's 2nd or 3rd part. I'm somewhat of a perfectionist, and get frustrated with myself, but alas, there's just not enough practice time.
Instructors of my past say I'm one of the more "musical" players they have heard, but I was never "technically" gifted. Put 16th notes and runs in front of me and make me tongue quickly, or complicated fingering passages, and I'm toast. Give me a slow ballad where I can put dynamics and tone to the test and I can nail it.
The other thing that is putting me off is the community band's schedule. Many of the performances are on holiday weekends, and I just don't know that I want to spend multiple holidays having to report somewhere in concert black. How committed to a community group do you think I need to be? Is skipping performances unheard of?
I have been invited to join our church orchestra, which has been in existence just a couple of years. There are a few adult brass players mixed in with the middle and high schoolers, but there are no adult woodwind players. Part of me thinks I might make a greater, positive difference in this ensemble, which, quite honestly, could use a little help...although they are improving.
Post Edited (2009-05-27 00:34)
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2009-05-27 00:38
You probably would feel more satisfied with your Church group as you would maybe feel like you were contributing more. The music would probably be easier too.
I wouldn't turn down the Church Orch. and you need to decide to stay with the other group or not. Maybe they would even have conflicting performance/practices on occasion.
Your community group maybe has a set of rules on attendance and performances.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: GeorgeL ★2017
Date: 2009-05-27 01:54
Only you can decide if the time the band rehearsals and performances take from your family is the real problem. But if you can overcome that hurdle, an ideal solution might be to stay in the band and also play with the church group. I assume the church orchestra rehearses once a week, and plays once a week. If you join them, it gives you two more periods/week of playing, at the cost of only one more period/week out of your life (because you would be attending church anyway). The more you play, the better you should get.
If only a few fast or technical passages are the problem, focus on them. Take the few measures that are a problem and practice them. Play them very slowly until you make a mistake, then start over. When you can play the entire passage mistake-free slowly, speed it up a bit. Even if you spend no more than 10 minutes a day on these difficult passages, your fingers will eventually learn what to do.
As for tonguing fast passages, try tongue-two, slur-two. At performances, if other players are nailing these passages, play them very softly until you can play the passages at least as well as the other players.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2009-05-27 02:05
Not that I know anything about your lifestyle, but there are a few things that we all do that take our time.
The most common killers is TV.
If you watch TV you might want to have your clarinet in your hands instead.
Just an idea...
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Author: kdk
Date: 2009-05-27 02:46
There seem to be two issues here for you.
It's unlikely (though I guess not impossible) that you're the only player in the band who has trouble finding time to practice (it goes along with being a self-supporting adult, especially one with a family) or who sometimes feels defeated by technical passages (often you don't hear others' problems when you're busy trying to solve your own). If you really feel less adequate than the other clarinet players, you might ask the conductor whether he feels you're causing a problem in the band, but most likely he'll tell you to just relax and do your best.
The problem of scheduling is another matter. Most community bands, I think, play for holiday celebrations. At the very least, someone who is influential in the band feels that holidays are good opportunities for the band to perform. If the rest of the band is OK with that, it may be a deal breaker for you - if you don't want generally to commit to the band's schedule, you may need to leave. But if you decide to quit over the schedule, let the director know in as friendly a way as possible that frequent holiday concerts are what are driving you away. He may offer to have you play only the concerts you want to do, or he may accept your leaving the band but ask if he can call you to sub if needed, which might be a way to have your cake and eat it, too.
Karl
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Author: leonardA
Date: 2009-05-27 02:49
I joined a community band last fall and was pretty much in your position. 3rd clarinet. I could play most things but occasionally I just had to lay out on a difficult pasage. It was fine, and my playing has improved. I feel that I am contributing, but most of all it is improving my playing. I will say that I do practice the music during the week. The number of times that I lay out has lessened. So I wouldn't worry about what you can't play. Whatever you can play will contribute. With such a small number they need you.
Leonard
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Author: D
Date: 2009-05-27 05:40
Is it actually playing the techy bits or reading them at speed which gets you? On occasion I have found that learning a chunk by heart or identifying which scale it is , or even targeting certain bars within a bad part and just working on playing those, are a way into a previously inaccessible area of the music. Might not be able to play it all but if you play all the accented beats then you start to fill in the others as you go through more rehearsals. Fast tonguing on high notes or just around the break can be a total pain but identifying scale patterns within a fast passage maybe more useful to prioritise as it allows you to stop reading and start playing.
I know finding time to play can be hard, but 10 minutes planning what you are going to concentrate on while you wait for the bus/sit in traffic, followed by five minutes with the instrument when you get in can be more useful than an hour of unfocused warbling.
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Author: xeys_00
Date: 2009-05-27 12:14
Are 4th clarinet parts generally easier, as far as demands on a new player?
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2009-05-27 12:43
Blue,
You have said only negative things about this situation (holiday gigs, two jobs, family, weak link 2nd...). I don't read anything positive about what you get from band membership.
It sounds to me like you have already put things in priority order and practice is pretty low.
Throw in the towel. Maybe later band will be higher on the list.
HRL
Post Edited (2009-05-27 14:50)
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Author: Tony Beck
Date: 2009-05-27 13:47
I too am in your position. Luckily, our community band is supportive of players with “other lives”, and is generally a sociable group, which makes Tuesday evenings enjoyable even when I’m not having a good session.
I had been practicing an hour a night, but last year my daughter started high school and my work travel schedule increased. Now I’m lucky to get in a couple hours a week, and that’s often interrupted. I moved back to 3rd, where we have a very strong lead (former Navy bandsman). I also play some Eb, and practice those parts the most. They are fun, challenging and often exposed.
Most of my work travel has been to the same place, so I contacted the community band in that area. They have been very welcoming, even with the understanding that I’d be an intermittent participant and wouldn’t be there for performances. This band has made travel more enjoyable.
D above has some good comments on effective practice. I will often mark “Work Here” on my music and go right to those sections. Also, a good warmup really helps with effective practice, and with playing the first piece at a concert well.
Most of the music we play doesn’t have 4th parts, but when we have them, they are generally the same as 3rd, with just a few divisi passages.
Church performance can be enjoyable, especially if you have an A clarinet. A lot of church music fits very well on an A. The music is generally slow, steady and melodic, plus a good clarinet sounds great in a church.
Back in school, a professor had a sign in his office that proclaimed “90% of everything is just showing up!” Don’t throw in the towel.
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Author: bbarner
Date: 2009-05-27 14:41
You could skip the hard parts.
Bill Barner
http://www.billbarner.com
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Author: Bluesparkle
Date: 2009-05-27 16:23
I guess I feel negative about the whole thing because I neither excel in the group, nor do I particularly look forward to the performances, holidays or not (because I don't excel). I like to be good at what I do, and I don't think that's uncommon.
The band members are enjoyable, and many of them are people with whom I went to college. Many members are area band/music directors. Our group takes itself pretty seriously, though. Much of our folder is filled with grade 6 music, and some time before I joined they played at Carnegie Hall, have played in London a few years back, etc. One of my 3rd clarinet friends says she plays in two area groups, and feels like she's just barely holding on with this group, so I know I'm not alone.
As far as TV watching sucking up my time...I watch Grey's Anatomy and 24. That's about it, and now that the season is over, I doubt I'll watch much of anything. Funny thing...I don't know many working moms who sit down to relax while at home. There's always something to do that didn't get done during the day (or was un-done during the day). If I have a time-waster, it's probably clicking around on the internet just looking at stuff, checking in, posting on boards, etc.
Since posting this, I have decided that I am going to establish a 20-minute practice time for my whole family, at least 3 days a week. My oldest plays bagpipes, my youngest plays drums, my husband plays piano, and I'll work on the hard parts of the music. Maybe a little practice will push me to the point where I don't feel like I'm just a prop in the band.
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Author: Carol Dutcher
Date: 2009-05-27 17:46
This really hit home with me. I am a clarinet player but last fall was asked if I would play alto saxophone in a big band that meets once a month for a luncheon. Their alto sax player had left town. I have played alto sax in the past but it is definitely not my first instrument. Their charts are HARD, believe me, and playing second alto really threw me for a loop. I'd forgotten all the moves. The director said that I would be allowed to take the music home to work on, since he knows me. Practice was even hard because it is second alto, very little melody. I asked the one other gal (trombone) in the band if I should drop out - she said, oh no, just have fun, and look at all this as sight reading lessons! I "skip the hard parts." Now I'm going to take a tape recorder along, and just put it under my chair to get the feeling of the big band sound and the rhythms. I do actually know all the songs, they are swing with a few latin thrown in. There are over 150 songs to learn. Seems mostly are in ###. EGAD. Well, I'm going to keep at it, and try to remember once I was a real sax player, long ago! So, my advice is, Keep trying. Don't leave until the conductor asks you to!
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Author: oliver sudden
Date: 2009-05-27 17:49
Bluesparkle, I was actually just going to suggest something like what you mention in your last paragraph - I think that if you can get your family to help you establish practice time it's a great thing. A musician friend of mine in Munich has a musician partner and a daughter - a certain amount of time is set aside every day for practice and it's part of the family routine. When the agreed hour comes around it's "right, time for you to work - we're off to the park!".
And it's great to have someone else to motivate you...
> If I have a
> time-waster, it's probably clicking around on the internet just
> looking at stuff, checking in, posting on boards, etc.
Really? I've NEVER HEARD of such a thing. I don't believe it's possible.
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Author: Lee
Date: 2009-05-27 19:14
I believe that you should do as Jeff suggested. I am in our church orchestra but am probably the poorest musician in it, We are about 45 members several of which are professionals. Since I retired I have started working with a teacher and practicing. When we get a new director I go to him and ask that if I'm not contributing to let me know and I'll quit. So far none of them have. BTW The church music may not be easer. (A recient number started in F and half way through changed to Db.)
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Author: Claire Annette
Date: 2009-05-30 20:18
I agree with Bill Barner. Even with practice, if you're not getting certain passages or are out of tune on certain notes, lay out.
Community band can be very therapeutic. If it's something you enjoy doing, stick with it but always strive to be better.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2009-05-30 21:06
Carol Dutcher wrote:
> The director said that I would be allowed to take the music home to work
> on, since he knows me.
How on earth would one practice that stuff if not with the sheets at home? Rehearsals should be for practicing-on-how-to-play-together or honing the tone and such, but certainly not for practicing fingerings and stuff. ![[huh]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie11.gif)
@xeyes_00: Never have seen a 4th clarinet part. I'm playing second since day one (they had only one 2nd player, and the 3rds refused to move up) but sit next to the 3rds. In 90% of all pieces we play the same licks, me usually a fifth higher than them, but both parts are equally difficult or easy.
If you think 3rd voice is too hard, play whole notes or half notes, replace eights with a quarter etc. You'll soon do better.
(There are always parts where I cheat and play only the one important note, eg the last one of an upward chromatic slur with crescendo etc. Better skip such parts and keep the exact timing)
--
Ben
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Author: Bluesparkle
Date: 2009-05-30 22:21
Okay. New info. The person who was leaving the band for a couple of months is not going. He's coming back in to play 2nd, so I'll be on 3rd again, starting this Tuesday. I do feel like I can hide my deficiencies back there a little better, especially since I sit right in front of the first trumpet, who drowns me out most of the time.
And just last week, my youngest son declared that he was going to play clarinet in the middle school band. Found him a used Ridenour that seems to be a pretty decent horn based on the comments here, and playing it myself once it arrived. So that makes both of my boys who have chosen clarinet. That has made me decide that, in the interest of keeping them interested, that I should continue to play in the community band.
As far as our church orchestra...it's really mostly kids with a few "I haven't played in 20 years" people. They play once a month or so in church. They do have a couple of good high school clarinetists who are holding their own. I was kinda hoping I might be useful in helping out the one flute we have, and that would be an excuse for me to get the C clarinet I've been wanting.
New dilemma. Help out in some way with the fledgling church orchestra or direct the adult handbell choir that meets at the same time?
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Author: weberfan
Date: 2009-05-31 02:33
Bluesparkle,
I have been lurking on this thread for a while, wanting to contribute but really not having any experience I could lend to support you. As a late returnee to an instrument I love, I am without band or orchestra experience. I am hoping, in the next two years, to join an ensemble of some sort.
I sense in your posts something that would certainly be paramount for me: holding my own and not dragging down the rest of the group.
You're right. You don't want to be a drag or FEEL as if you're a drag. But it's a fact--and I am willing to make an educated guess here---that you are better than you think you are and more musical than many and easier to work with than most. You are probably a conductor's dream.
Are you the rival of (name famous clarinetist here). No,probably not. But it seems clear from your postings that you care about the instrument and the music and that you want to be a valued, contributing member of the ensemble.
I think you already are. I also think that you are someone who too often defaults to this position: I'm not as good as I ought to be/could be/should be... Therefore, I probably ought to bow out quietly.
You're engaged in a musical endeavor I have yet to embark on ---and I'm older!!! But I am determined to learn to play productively with a group and to overcome my shyness, for lack of a better word. I was afraid to squeak when I first took lessons at age 9. Now, when I squeak, I know why and I can fix it. I work on the 16th note runs and the 32nd note runs and even the 64th note runs till they sound the way they are supposed to sound. It takes a lot of time.
I love playing. Clearly, you do, too. Yet, what your messages seem to say is: "I'm not worthy enough."
Balderdash. You've come up with all sorts of excuses not to stay with it.
If you want to play, then play. And don't worry about everyone else. They probably admire you...except for one or two who aren't worth the price of a cheap reed.
Just play. Life's too short not to.
allbest,
Chuck
Post Edited (2009-05-31 02:36)
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Author: GeorgeL ★2017
Date: 2009-05-31 14:59
Bluesparkle
If you are sitting in front of a loud trumpet section, use earplugs now to avoid hearing aids later. A search for 'earplugs' on this board will provide a lot of information about them.
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