 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Granto01
Date: 2019-09-07 23:23
From my last post about the barrel for my Full Boehm I'll quickly sum up whats going on.
I picked a 17/6 U99XX series 10 on Ebay for a decent if not great price.
Now with the 'B' barrel on my Full Boehm X6295, everything plays flat. The barrel is approx. 66.5mm. Even on the original instrument, it still plays slightly flat. (with HS star mouthpiece)
I wanted to ask if anyone has had success with Backun and a Series 10 instrument. I got in touch with Backun and they only told me that Series 10S works with their Selmer Paris fit which I'm not sure correlates to original Series 10.
HELP! Didn't realize buying what I thought to be a great instrument for my high school days turned into something as chaotic and money eating as this. :I
-Grant
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2019-09-08 01:38
Try ebay for a 65mm barrel. But avoid Buffet as the bores most likely will be a shade small.
Maybe a Bliss or a Fobes? Even a Yamaha might work. Needless to say a newer Selmer, but not the older models such as the 9 series or a CenterTone. Try to spend as little as possible in case the tuning is off. Hint - Often the sellers on Ebay will take less so send them an email and ask if they will take some amount less than the asking price. They may counter offer.
As for a Selmer HS* mouthpiece these are decent mouthpieces, however the tuning may be off a bit as the bore is tapered of course and can get a bit too small. This might be a really good time to find a really great mouthpiece as well. Most players will tell you to find a great mouthpiece and then work at tuning your clarinet. If you want a decent mouthpiece with a good bore consider the Selmer Concept. This will be consistent to the bore of your Selmer clarinet. These Concept mouthpieces sometimes need to be readjusted for a freer feel. If needed contact me later. I've made some people happy.
I feel you are fine with getting the correct barrel and if you enjoy the HS* mouthpiece stay with it. However, you might not want to do any tuning to your horn. Again the mouthpiece and the barrel can surely effect the tuning of your horn. This gets very complicated very fast. It amazes me sometimes how the bores of the mouthpieces, barrels, and the horns, can effect the tuning of your instrument as a whole unit. Even a soft reed can tune flat! It's nuts.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2019-09-08 01:44
I played a Selmer 10G in high school. The 10S came out later and I was told it was only a slightly modified version of the G (named so for Anthony Gigliotti of the Philadelphia Orchestra). I would think any barrel made for a Selmer 10 from the 70s should work.
................Paul Aviles
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2019-09-08 02:00
Paul I surely agree with you! Any Selmer 10 Series 65mm barrel will be just fine.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: kdk
Date: 2019-09-08 02:26
Bob Bernardo wrote:
> Paul I surely agree with you! Any Selmer 10 Series 65mm barrel
> will be just fine.
>
As far as I was ever aware, the 10G that Gigliotti helped design was a different instrument from the original 10. The 10G was based with modifications on Gigliotti's Moennig-adjusted R-13s, which I don't think had anything to do with the earlier Model 10, but I could be wrong. Maybe the original 10 *was* the first Selmer-Gigliotti collaboration and already had incorporated the basic Moennig changes. Bob, do you know anything about that?
Karl
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Author: kdk
Date: 2019-09-08 02:44
In any case, I think the recent discussions about barrels and compatibility have tended to mystify the issues too much. There are a number of design features that barrel designers have added to the basic clarinet barrel over the past few decades - some are now ringless, some have non-standard outer shapes (like Backun's "fatboy") that are intended to influence the resonance and, therefore, the sound. Barrels are now made of different materials from the old blackwood barrels that matched what the instruments were made of. But these changes have little to do, it seems to me, with what barrel will go with what instrument, or compatibility.
Going back to the main issue of "compatibility," you're really talking about the entry and exit bore sizes and the transition from one to the other inside the barrel. The two dimensions, to the extent that it actually matters, were designed by the OEM to complement (not match) the entry bore of the clarinet's upper joint and the exit bore of a "typical" mouthpiece. The inside shape (hourglass or a straight taper, which depends on how it is machined), and what the end dimensions are really define the extent to which a barrel is compatible with the instrument it was designed for.
But if the barrel is made of a material that can be tooled, any barrel that is smaller-bored than the original design can be hand reamed by a good technician to match the original spec. So, if you have an OEM barrel, go to a local repair shop and ask the repair person to pick a barrel out of his collection that's narrower-bored than the one you have. Then have him ream it to match your barrel's bore and cut it shorter by a millimeter.
Or, if there isn't a good shop near you, get in touch with one of the people who advertise barrels here (Segal, Grabner, Fobes, etc.). If you still have your old clarinet, temporarily use the barrel from that (if it fits the 10's tenon). Send the barrel maker your 66.5mm as a model and ask him to make a 65mm or 65.5mm barrel with the same entry and exit bore specs.
For my money, I'd ask to have a hard rubber lining inserted to ensure stability.
The alternative, I think, is to just start ordering barrels from all the manufacturers you can think of until you run into one that works. Sooner or later you'll score. With any luck it will be one of the first ones you try.
Karl
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Author: kdk
Date: 2019-09-08 02:46
Bob, I should ask - do you make barrels? I know you make excellent mouthpieces, but mouthpieces and barrels don't always go hand-in-hand.
Karl
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2019-09-08 04:03
Hi Karl, I'm just know getting into it!
They have a hard rubber insert so the wood, when wet, won't expand or warp. Thank you for your nice compliments!
Yes you are also correct about my late friend and genius, Hans Moennig, the 10G, and a new Buffet style R13 with Tony G. This is kind of when the great 1960's R13's officially went away and Buffet made the bores bigger. It is also when the really sweet Buffet S1 was developed, but was only around for maybe 2 or 3 years. Forgive me on the exact dates as this was a long time ago, pushing 50 years now.
B
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2019-09-08 04:20)
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2019-09-08 04:38
Also the reason I suggested Ebay is it's hard to find the correct barrel for older horns. As we know some of these wood horns warp inside, the bores also dry out of course, and we don't often know where the horns lived; meaning were the horns in a dry climate, wet humidity, was the horn taken good care of with routine repairs, or did it sit in a closet for 30 years? With these variables it difficult to determine a perfect barrel other than the length and the given bore size of the instrument. So I do know based on knowledge, a Buffet barrel will not work, so spend as little as possible and hope the person posting, Granto01 will have good luck!
As a Yamaha Artist I had trouble finding the correct barrel for the CSVR A clarinet, but I worked with the barrel maker at Yamaha and we nailed it. It was a reverse taper of 0.010" (per inch.) It's by far the best horn I've ever played on.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2019-09-08 04:41)
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