 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Debbie
Date: 2000-03-03 23:37
Someone gave me an old Carl Fischer clarinet. I don't know too much about it. Anyone know anything about that brand? It just says Carl Fischer New York Artist Brand. Its not in very good shape and probably isn't worth fixing, but I am curious it.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-03-03 23:58
This clarinet might very well be worth fixing up. The Carl Fischer company did not actually make instruments, they contracted with several clarinet makers over the years to stencil them with the Carl Fischer name. Some of them were very good horns indeed. Depending on the details of the business arrangement, the makers name was sometimes on the instruments and sometimes it was not. They contracted with Pruefer (one of the better US makers who is no longer in business) and they are known to have contracte with Buffet.
So I would suggest having an independent repair technician look it over before deciding whether it is worth repairing. Don't ask a music store salesman though. They aren't knowledgeable on older instruments and may not know how to assess the quality of brands they aren't familiar with. Plus they may have a vested interest in trying to sell you a new one.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2000-03-04 03:04
I quite agree with Dee, in that the maker could be one of a number. While "Artist" in itself is not definitive, it is the name of one of several models put out by Penzel-Mueller of New York, about 1940-60's. See the P-M thread below. My Artist has little to distinguish itself from its contempories. Don
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-03-04 03:08
Don Berger wrote:
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I quite agree with Dee, in that the maker could be one of a number. While "Artist" in itself is not definitive, it is the name of one of several models put out by Penzel-Mueller of New York, about 1940-60's. See the P-M thread below. My Artist has little to distinguish itself from its contempories. Don
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And my G. Pruefer distributed by Carl Fischer is also an Artist model! This seems to have been a popular choice of names. In the case of my Pruefer, the construction (I've had it apart a couple of times) would indicate that it is at least an intermediate model, perhaps even higher but there is no way to tell for sure.
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Author: Debbie
Date: 2000-03-04 20:08
Thanks for info on my Carl Fischer clarinet. I looked at it again in more detail and saw that the ligature said Buffet-Crampton (France) but that on the clarinet itself I found the words "made in Germany" and the number 4058. So I'm going to do a little more digging to see what I come up with. I'll let you know and thanks for the advice.
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Author: jim lande
Date: 2000-03-05 05:12
Buffet made some clarinets in Germany, but I think they used different looking serial numbers. So, now we know that it is not a Buffet, Penzel-Mueller or Pruefer. Dee's advice is excellent.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-03-05 16:02
jim lande wrote:
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Buffet made some clarinets in Germany, but I think they used different looking serial numbers. So, now we know that it is not a Buffet, Penzel-Mueller or Pruefer. Dee's advice is excellent.
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Actually we don't know any of that for sure. If the clarinet itself (not mouthpiece or ligature) is marked "Made in Germany" then it probably wasn't made by Penzel-Mueller or Pruefer but could have been made for Buffet. If so, it might be an intermediate model. Still this is just speculation.
The best bet would be to find some one who is intimately familiar with the details of the appearance of the keywork of various brands and models. For example the touchpiece on the C#/G# key has different shapes. Sometimes the difference is slight and others it is quite noticeable once you really look at it.
In any case, my opinion is that it is worth fixing up as it is probably a decent instrument.
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Author: Dave Spiegelthal
Date: 2000-03-06 15:09
To further muddy the waters: If the clarinet said "Made in Germany", it may have been made by Shreiber, who also made some of the Evette-Schaefer clarinets for Buffet, and also made and still makes clarinets, bassoons, etc. (and their current ESM line of mouthpieces)under their own name.
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Author: steve
Date: 2000-03-06 18:51
You can find gems...I have a double stamped Carl Fisher/ Buffet Crampon A that is pre R-13 days...maybe 20's or 30's....it has a wrap around octave key, but no other oddities like doughnut/articulated C#G#, low Eb, etc....after some restoration, undercutting and tweaking, it was a great horn...
s.
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Author: Fred McKenzie
Date: 2000-03-06 20:37
Debbie wrote:
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Someone gave me an old Carl Fischer clarinet. I don't know too much about it. Anyone know anything about that brand? It just says Carl Fischer New York Artist Brand. Its not in very good shape and probably isn't worth fixing, but I am curious it.
Debbie-
I have a Carl Fischer "Artist Model", purchased used back in the early 50s. It is my opinion it is of good quality. It certainly held up well after the beating I gave it!
Unfortunately, mine seems to have been made for a higher pitch than A=440 Hz. It is impossible to tune it for all notes. Before investing a lot to overhaul yours, I suggest you determine its pitch. If it plays at all, try tuning for low G, and see how far off open G is. If it doesn't play, compare its length to the length of a known-good instrument.
If yours plays in tune, then it is probably worth repairing.
Fred
<A HREF="http://www.dreamnetstudios.com/music/mmb/index.htm">MMB</A>
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Author: Yvonne Barnes
Date: 2001-11-09 02:06
I have a Carl Fischer Artist Model that I have had for about 8 years and have never been able to find much information on. It is made in New York. However, the upper and lower serial numbers do no match. One is H 5899 and the other is H 5894. The parts obviously match but any information I could get on this clarinet would be greatly appreciated.
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Author: PrincessJ
Date: 2011-01-25 01:28
Anyone know anything about the Italian ones? I've seen several, in very predictable places. They look marvelous.
-Jenn
Circa 1940s Zebra Pan Am
1972 Noblet Paris 27
Leblanc Bliss 210
1928 Selmer Full Boehm in A
Amateur tech, amateur clarinetist, looking to learn!
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2011-01-25 14:35
Wow, another old thread dredged up from the Mesozoic era....
Since at the time there were really only two Italian mass-market clarinet manufacturers (Rampone and Orsi), it is very likely that the Italian-made Carl Fischer clarinets were produced by either of those companies.
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Author: wswann
Date: 2012-07-03 15:50
Attachment: $T2eC16JHJF0E9nmFQgm5BP5Lfni1y!~~60_58.JPG (53k)
I just bought a Carl Fisher off of that auction site. I have very little idea what to expect, when the package comes. There's one picture (attached), but the seller obviously knew very little about clarinets.
It does appear to have the pretty, silver-plated keys. But it looks too new to be one of the 1910s to 1930s or 1941 to 1950 made-by-Buffet models referenced here:
http://www.clarinetperfection.com/clsnbuffet.htm#CarlFischer
So, obviously, I'm curious! We'll see. I can post better pictures when it arrives.
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Author: wcarey
Date: 2014-02-13 03:31
Just to add my own info for the sake of research and posterity - I have a rubber Carl Fischer Artist Model, made in Germany with a serial number in the 5000's. Has a very short barrel that must be pulled way out to play in tune, and one tenon bore is fully lined with metal. I think it likely to have been manufactured in the late 50's or early 60's, maybe by Kohlert but I think more likely Schreiber. I have seen a wood Schreiber clarinet on "the auction site" with an almost identical case and array of accessories, and with the same particularly thin metal ring on the bell where the bell connects to the lower tenon. Obviously that is no proof, and I don't have any particular expertise to say much else except that its playing characteristics seem just as described for rubber clarinets on this forum and others - fast response, even stength and intonation in all registers, dark, woody, very different than my main horn (1980's Buffet C-13). I like it so much, I find myself tempted to pick up another one or two rubber instruments to explore and compare to this one. It is amazing that they sell so cheap!
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Author: Wes
Date: 2014-02-13 12:00
Yes, I bought and restored a great Carl Fischer A clarinet with a donut key and wrap around register key that was surely a Buffet. My granddaughters like it a lot. The density and quality of the wood was very fine.
Later, the seller came to my house and gave me two suitcases full of woodwind tools, pads, and parts from his late father!
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Author: cyclopathic
Date: 2014-02-13 19:35
@wcarey
Just to add my own info for the sake of research and posterity - I have a rubber Carl Fischer Artist Model, made in Germany with a serial number in the 5000's. Has a very short barrel that must be pulled way out to play in tune, and one tenon bore is fully lined with metal.
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do you have pics? does it say made in Germany?
If top joint is lined with nickel silver it is probably Pruefer "Silver Throat". Pruefer was the biggest clarinet stencil maker in 50-60s and many Pruefers were sold via Carl Fischer. As I recall Gustav Pruefer's son (Will?) was married to Carl Fischer's daughter. Or maybe other way around?
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Author: chris moffatt
Date: 2014-02-14 04:17
Just to further muddy the waters, depending on how old a Carl Fischer clarinet made in Germany is it could possibly be made by Mollenhauer, Heckel, Oskar Adler or Kruspe.......
Wes: that clarinet may be a Couesnon rather than a Buffet. Of that vintage they are very very similar. Stiil a great horn though.
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