 The Oboe BBoard
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2017-03-06 06:13
Do you reckon you could survive without a third octave key? (I am enrolled in doing ABRSM grade 8 in may/june)
I have never had to... but there are some decent oboes around if i could sacrifice this luxury!
What do you reckon?
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Author: heckelmaniac
Date: 2017-03-06 07:32
I agree with Tom Hiniker (though all of the oboes he makes in fact come with a 3rd octave key): "A well crafted oboe should have no need of a 3rd octave key."
If you use a 3rd octave key, high harmonic notes, already tending to be sharp, may tend to go even higher sharp. And I find often the notes "assisted" by a 3rd octave key to be somewhat out of character in comparison to the rest of the notes on the instrument. A 3rd octave key does have some use for abstruse fingerings in modern and polyphonic music -see Peter Veale's book: The Techniques of Oboe Playing. I like key-work. A 3rd octave key is a wonderful gadget to behold- it just looks cool. I always simply tighten down the 3rd octave adjusting screw all the way so the vent will not open...
Oboes.us
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2017-03-06 07:38
I also hear that the 3rd Octave key can often go out of adjusment and must be adjusted now and again. Is this corrrect ?
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Author: oboeandy
Date: 2017-03-06 07:46
I play in contemporary music ensembles, and I wouldn't be able to survive in much of the repertoire I play if my oboe didn't have a 3rd octave key.
I will say, however, that for high E and high F, I prefer not to use the 3rd octave key, for the reason that Peter mentions above (these notes played with the 3rd octave key sound "out of character").
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-03-06 12:20
The 3rd 8ve key is prone to being bent and causing problems as a result. On conservatoire instruments where it is particularly vulnerable, if it gets bent down, it'll hold the 1st 8ve key open. The main cause for them being bent is the case and if the case lining is applying pressure to the keywork when the lid is closed or there's not enough clearance in the slot for the 3rd 8ve. Soft sided zip-up cases are the usual cause for 3rd 8ve keys (and other keys) being bent.
It's not an essential key and a lot of older pro level oboes don't have it fitted. But it can always be fitted to any instrument at any stage should you want one and best having it done by an oboe maker rather than a dealer as I've seen some really shocking examples fitted by an oboe dealer (likewise with thumbplates). If you're in the UK, have Howarth fit the 3rd 8ve (and thumbplate) as they make oboes, they have the various pieces in stock and they look, work and feel better than bits that appear to have been cobbled together and shoved on.
The 3rd 8ve key opens a full size tonehole located between the lower 8ve vent and the C-D trill key - if it was a soprano sax then it would be in a similar location as the high E or F tonehole (depending on the maker's preference) and instead of opening fully, it only opens by a very small amount and the venting is set with an adjusting screw to limit its movement and adjusted by the player to where it best suits them (likewise with the LH1 top fingerplate and the RH2 mid fingerplate when the C or C# key is held down so the upper and altissimo C#, D and Eb speak cleanly).
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2017-03-06 13:36
Sadly I am in Oz
Sometimes I wish I was overseas.. As there seems to be much better options than we have here.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2017-03-06 17:30
Contact Richard Craig as he's a Howarth agent and could be your best bet in having a 3rd 8ve key made and fitted should you want one.
The existing back 8ve touch will also have to be altered by having it recessed to allow the 3rd 8ve touch to overlap it and be within easy reach.
On thumbplate systems the 3rd 8ve touch is usually to the left of the thumbplate as that's easiest to make. They can be made to be positioned to the right, but that's more costly as the 2nd 8ve key will need to be remade with an arch to run over and clear the 3rd 8ve touchpiece. You need to be able to hold the thumbplate, 1st and 3rd 8ve keys all down together which is why thumbplate systems need the longer 3rd 8ve key touchpiece.
It's one of those keys which can be positioned out the way, but still within easy reach for when you need to use it, but also not in the way so it can be hit accidentally. That's fine with conservatoire system instruments, but thumbplate and dual systems will need the thumbplate and 1st 8ve touch fitted with a much thicker cork to raise them higher off the deck and the 3rd 8ve touch set as close to the joint surface as is possible so the left thumb can't catch it by accident.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2017-03-08 01:52
Thanks Chris
I will ring him today. and get some more info.
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2017-03-08 03:30
I'd say that Richard Craig wouid just about have my Howarth S55c Dual System serviced by now and I'd say he'd be asking around $4000 for it. It is a beautiful Oboe but it is heavy with mechanism. The only thing it doesn't have is a 3rd Octave key which I don't think is really necessary. Of course you'd have to relearn the fingering for C and Bb in both octaves which is no big deal. The real beauty of the Dual System is that you can use both the Thumb Plate and Conservatoire system fingering. From what I can remember , the conservatoire Bb was slightly better in tone than the Thumb Plate Bb and the Thumb Plate C had a better tone than the conservatoire C
Skyfacer
Post Edited (2017-03-08 03:31)
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2017-03-08 03:38
Another tit bit of information about the S55c was that it is a thick bodied Oboe. My S2 is a thin bodied instrument. It is said that the thicker bodied Oboes are a bit 'heavier' (have more resistance) to play than the thinner bodied Oboes like my S2. From my experience , this is actually so. I remember that my old Bundy Thumb plate plastic Oboe was thin bodied and had a light resistance just like my S2. I still regret having departed with that Bundy Oboe. For what it was , it played and sounded remarkably well for a beginners Oboe and like the S2 was 'reed friendly'
Skyfacer
Post Edited (2017-03-08 03:42)
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2017-03-08 04:25
Just lost a long post!
Argh
You know I am very tempted to ask Richard about your oboe. I loved it when I played it. But.. I was a real beginner then. So maybe I know more of what I want now! And don't want something that isn't a pleasure to play!
I had this issue with clarinet. And I stopped wanting to practise! It was too resistant a set up that my teacher encouraged. Grrr
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Author: SarahC
Date: 2017-03-08 04:43
But now with the ridenour mouthpiece and 3 reeds... We are a match made in heaven. And no chest pain caused when I am practising...
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