 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ClariBone
Date: 2005-10-15 02:13
Hello!!
I know that there are several members of the BBoard, myself included, who will be entering college shortly studying music. I know I (others as well??) would be very interested in getting advice from those who are currently or have been in the college music scene. Feel free to give advice, personal experiences, do's and don't's, etc. here!!
Clayton
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Author: clarinetfreak
Date: 2005-10-15 02:57
Try to get in touch with the Professor beforehand and schedule a lesson with him or her. This will make it more personal for the teacher when he or she hears you at the audition and you will get an idea what you're trying to get into.
Good Times!
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Author: hans
Date: 2005-10-15 13:44
Attachment: Attendance&Grade.jpg (129k)
ClariBone,
I teach university part-time. For last year, I graphed the final grades as a function of attendance (graph attached). The graph shows a strong relationship between attending classes and final grades.
There are probably other variables, but I think most teachers would agree that attendance is important to success.
Therefore, my best advice is... don't skip any classes.
Regards,
Hans
P.S. - Good luck in college!
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Author: Bob Phillips
Date: 2005-10-15 16:26
Hans' data show a pretty strong *correlation* between attendance and grades. They do not, however, *prove* that going to class improves grades. It could be that a third factor causes both. It might be that something like enthusiasm caused both.
I have 4-degrees in technologies and often think that I'd like to go back to study music. I've helped my son through his bachelor's degree and watched as his peers and some of our local young people do their servitude in a college.
Here's my $0.02.
Be assured that your college experience will change your life. You will come out with an evolved perspective. The degree of this change depends upon the dilligence with which you pursue your studies, the breadth of your cirriculum and how much time you spend in the college library (reading).
Learning is a change of behavior. If your courses do not change you, you haven't learned!
College is also limiting; there really is an "ivory tower" element to it that allows you to think about major issues without having to suffer their real-world affects.
Some schools allow one to focus on his/er core cirriculum to the exclusion of other studies. Usually this privelege is granted to the best students --allowing such things a minimal "breadth" requirements --sometimes offered on a pass/fail business (i.e., a D grade is good enough). My experience indicates that that is a bad thing for the student. Sure, if you only want to play the therimin and do nothing else, such a focused course of study would minimize your distractions.
But, if you want to be a constructive member of society; you should think more seriously about broadening your studies. That's hard work, because you will have to leave your comfort zone and put effort into unfamiliar areas.
In particular, I think it is critical to understand logic, evidence and the scientific method. The science and technology majors are usually required to take some courses from the liberal arts side of campus. Few will come out able to write or debate intelligently. Liberal arts students can graduate with no understanding of causality and be capable of ignoring facts --still relying on intuition and folk tales.
College also bridges high school to the real world of adult and workplace politics. This is an opportunity to learn to look for other's underlying motivations, to learn to trade with others to improve your socio/political position. This awareness needs to be developed and applied to everyone. Your student peers, upper and lower classmen, faculty, staff and the surrounding community.
Another element of college, often over stressed, is to prepare students to enter the work force. As has been mentioned many times on this forum: it ain't who you are, its who you know that matters. As part of your political training, consider the difference between answering a want ad with a well prepared resume and being invited to apply for the job by a friend or a friend of a friend. The insider has a presence that the outsider's piece of paper can not match.
As part of this social breadth development, think about where you will do your graduate work. A key is to have the academic credentials (courses, honors, grade points, faculty support) to go where you "need" to be. You CAN jump from a state college to an ivy league graduate program and develop relationships with folks who can invite you to "join there club." You will need the scholarship or teaching assistantship that your undergraduate study, politicking and contacts have enabled.
Spend a lot of time as an undergraduate thinking about what you will study in graduate school.
Keep an open mind --and fill it with information and the tools to process that information.
And the most important thing to learn in college: the location of the library!
Good luck to you all.
Bob Phillips
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2005-10-15 17:46
Dear Claribone,
If you're still looking everywhere and anywhere for schools, I have some thoughts. If music is your exclusive concentration in life, go to a conservatory or a school where the atmosphere is filled with peers who are as intent on music as you are. My experience was at a University that had good instructors, however, the program was small, the campus was small; it was not an atmosphere that fostered the interaction amongst the musician-students that is an invaluable aspect to learning the craft.
If music is important but not everything, find a good University with strengths in other areas and take those courses too..... just in case you don't make the Berlin Philharmonic. :-)
........Paul Aviles
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Author: ajhogan
Date: 2005-10-15 20:11
I will be in college next year as well, and I appreciate the advice.
Thanks
Austin
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-10-15 21:13
Explore early, explore often. Finding GE courses that you think you'll enjoy may open up new fields to you. The stuff you've never been exposed to is often what you're best at. Take on a minor. As a computer science major, it's my music minor that led to my now second major in music composition. Unlike most of the department, I was taking the piano and theory classes as "fun electives."
Take into account the type of people that will be at your college. Visit the school if you can. Take a tour. Talk to the people. Attend some of their concerts, and rehearsals if you can. Look at whether there are a lot of options in the courses you'll take. Visit the surrounding area.
Ask students for opinions on their program, facilities, ensembles, faculty, and students, as well as their opinions of other nearby universities--the atmosphere, attitude, and level of cooperativeness/competitiveness is often key. Answers to these questions will tell you a lot about the place you're at as well as the other places you're asking about. People will often be surprisingly open about these things. In a visit to one university (not the music dept.) I was told repeatedly, half-jokingly, by multiple unrelated sources, "Don't go here. It's all a scam. Sure, it's a good school, but it's not all it's cracked up to be."
I've been approached a couple times by prospective grad students for such opinions, and was very straightforward and honest.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Aussiegirl
Date: 2005-10-16 00:19
Advice from somebody who entered uni music this year? Be prepared to change stuff about your playing, ive had two teachers this year and both have changed so much about the way i play, and it has helped me become a better play so much. If you're moving out of home, a bar fridge is your best friend Look forward to meeting lots of new people as well, ive learnt so much from attending clarinet/woodwind workshop and performance practice and watching the other players perform and hearing their feedback....and ive made a lot of new friends too, as when i went into the course, i knew two people at the university and was living away from home for the first time.
Enjoy it!
Fiona
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Author: Nick H
Date: 2005-10-16 01:23
If you are at a music school- go to every concert, masterclass, visiting lecture, open rehearsal that you can. If you are playing chamber music, try to work with as many different ensembles and coaches as possible. I believe in my undergrad you needed 2 semesters of chamber music credit and I took 8. Learning from the fabulous non-woodwind faculty is also enlightening when you see what the other instrument families take for granted.
If you are in a decent program, you probably won't get to play in orchestras until later in your college career. So make friends with the grad conducting students and ask if you can play in their conducting recitals. Often they are desperate to find people to play in their ad-hoc orchestras and generally you can work your way in playing second (or bass/eb) to one of the better clarinetists at the school. I wasn't in orchestra full time until my junior year. By that time I had played lots of orchestral grad recitals at school and had made it known that I was a reliable and proven orchestral player. And it's a great way to learn the rep and make connections for future (paying) gigs.
Take as many auditions for festivals, jobs, school ensembles, competitions, etc., as possible, even if you think you don't have a chance. Auditioning is a skill that needs to be practiced like you practice the clarinet. Off the top of my head, the final thing I can think of is be nice, courteous, and respectful to your colleagues and professors. If you want to gossip or complain about someone, do it behind closed doors, and preferably alone. You never know when something you say will come back to haunt you. I guess that's good advice for life, too. Just my .02.
Nick
Post Edited (2005-10-16 01:24)
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Author: RodRubber
Date: 2005-10-17 15:48
Hey Nick H.,
Your college sounds a lot like mine, contact me off line.
Thanks
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2005-10-17 17:46
Everyone in high school wonders and worries about what it will be like in college. It's made worse when well-meaning adults ask you about what you plan to do, and you really have no idea.
You will of course read catalogs, visit campuses and talk to college students. In the end, you have to make a choice, and, believe it or not, as long as you pick a decent school, it doesn't much matter where you go, or what your plans are.
Any college will have more going on than you can possibly do. That's the big difference between high school and college. Any college will have faculty (including a clarinet teacher) who know more than you do, and are anxious to impart it.
The most important thing you do in college (after finding various ways to appall your parents) is to try one thing after another to discover what you like. More often than not, it will be something you hadn't thought of, or even heard of. I've told this story many times: My freshman college roommate had his entire list of courses planned, so that he would get a five-year joint degree in physics and engineering.
He graduated with a major in medieval German literature.
The real job is to go to college with an open mind, and take things as they come. There's nothing more exciting.
Ken Shaw
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2005-10-18 00:50
Don't skip classes.
Don't drink.
Don't party (much).
Do your homework.
Enjoy learning new things.
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2005-10-18 01:28
What do you do when your best friend in the entire world decides getting drunk is fun, and before that he thought it was just as stupid as you did.
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Author: rc_clarinetlady
Date: 2005-10-18 06:27
Go to class every day!!!! Don't drink.... and write or call your parents frequently.
Enjoy this time in your life....it's the only time you'll have like it. Once you graduate and get a job you'll work the rest of your life.
Don't get married and have babies, this is your time. Be selfish with it and study, practice and get really good at what you want to do.
Also, you are going to school to MAJOR in something not mediocre in something. Make A's in your classes. It's too expensive not to.
Keep practicing all summer prior to leaving for college in the fall. I didn't and had an embarrassing few months when I got there. It would have been much easier to just keep up the practice throughout the summer.
Good luck to you,
Rebecca
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Author: clarinets1
Date: 2005-10-19 16:58
i second the don't skip classes advice. it is a hard habit to break once it becomes a habit. try to meet lots of different people. learn as much as you can about anything that even remotely interests you.
practice like hell!
be respectful to your professors. it will make your life sooooo much easier.
if you do decide to partake in the party life, GET YOUR WORK DONE FIRST. then go have fun. take it seriously. you get back what you put into it.
did i mention that you should practice? you may have to schedule in time to do so.
final word of advice: take it all in and enjoy it. don't lose sight of your goals, but roll with the proverbial punches.
i miss college..... :(
jk
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Author: SueSmith
Date: 2005-10-19 19:30
This is my experience as a Music Performance major at two different schools - one a state college and one a conservatory.
1.) Make sure that the school you are attending/planning to attend caters to your desires - ie. don't attend a school with a department which caters to music education if you are a performance major. And vice versa - don't waste money on a conservatory if you plan to be an education major. State school/universities do that job better.
2.) Be prepared to have your new teacher change EVERYTHING - most likely embouchure, MP, reeds. Of course, your teacher may not make any drastic changes, but be prepared for it. My first College Instructor changed EVERYTHING in my first lesson, and a played like crap for almost a year. Don't get discouraged by it.
3.) If it turns out the school/instructor is not to your liking - DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT ASAP! College is EXPENSIVE, especially if you are taking out loans for it. If you wish to pursue a masters, your total loan payments will probably be in excess of $700+ at the end of 6 years(but probably more with the raise in tuition and interest rates) So, if after one year you hate your Major/Teacher/School - take a good hard look at yourself. Are you depressed? Are you a music major because you cannot think of doing anything else? Do you and your teacher not have rapport? Is the school ignoring your department (watch out for wind players getting shafted out of decent masterclasses/extras compared with Strings/Pianist). By your 2nd semester, you will have a pretty good idea if there is an overall fit or not...the sooner you transefer out, the more money you save.
4.) Take advantage of your schools music library - study all the scores you can. After you graduate, you may not have such easy access to these types of music resources.
5.) Be prepared to have 9 to 10 graded courses per semester. No kidding! My first semester at my state college consisted of -
Private Lessons - 4cr
Wind Ensemble - .5cr
Orchestra - .5cr
Symphonic Band - no cr, but required by my WE conductor
Choir - .5 cr
Class piano - 2 cr
Music Theory - 2 cr
Ear Training - 2 cr
Freshman orientation - no cr,required 1 semester for all freshman
Rhetoric I- 3 cr (writing/speech class)
LIberal Arts I - 3 cr
Italian I - 3cr (all liberal arts majors required to have 9 cr of a language)
Yes - I had 20.5 credits my 1st semester Freshman year. Usually, you have no more than 18, but don't be surprised if you have as many classes with little or no credit given. You will be busier than peers with a different major - who have 4 or 5 classes per sememster.
Tips for softening the credit load blow - if you don't play piano - take lessons NOW! Just learn your scales, arpeggio's, chord progressions. Otherwise, you will end up wasting a lot of time practicing for stupid piano finals insteady of practicing for your clarinet jury, if you can't play a lick of piano. If you can't sight sing - start NOW! You can learn this by yourself...with some music and a keyboard to check intonation. By starting ahead of time - in area's you may be deficient, will help soften the shock. Also, some peers in your class may have better overall training in these area's and you will be scrambling to catch up. If you've had great music training - beyond clarinet - consider yourself very very lucky and more ahead of the game than most.
6.) If you don't know all of your scales (major and all three minors) - learn them now. I know, it may sound silly, but you wouldn't believe how many kids go to college and don't know their minor scales.
__________________________
The above is most of the stuff I wish someone had told me...in the days before the BB and internet. Due to these resources I believe kids today, from less exposed musical backgrounds, will have a better idea of what music school at the undergrad level entails before they attend.
If I had to do it all over again - I'd have gotten a BA in accounting...and used all that extra time to practice and study privately. Studying music in college, if you haven't attended a HS of the Arts, can be a shock to the system. It can make you hate playing. It can overwhelm you with all the bullsh*t required - and most of what you learn in the college classroom is bull.
There are a few professional Clarinetists who have majored in something besides Music - so it is possible to succeed without that BM. You can attend a cheaper state college for a degree in Math/Science/Anything but music, study privately with a professional, and then go onto an MM. I'm going backwards, getting my MBA after my BM - and will pad it with an Arts Management Cert....
Maybe my post applies to one of you or none of you...but, its just another point of view. And what I wish someone had told me.
Best of luck to all!
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2005-10-20 22:27
Hi Clayton,
As a retired proferssor, I really appreciated the advice offer by jk above "be respecful of your professors." We love seeing our students thrive and do enjoy getting to know them as much as possible (I play golf with as many as possible and do not expect any extra strokes).
However, here are just a few rules.
1. Do not miss class or turn in work late. Let your professors notice you because of your exemplary work.
2. Don't expect your professors to make exceptions for you that can not be made for the whole class. We have already heard all the sad stories that there are and have probably used a few ourselves.
I have a niece at U of Michigan this fall and I told her, there is something going on every night on most campuses. Pick carefully but get you homework and reading done before. However, attending a college football game on Saturday with 100,000 other frantic people is a must do as often as possible!
HRL
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-10-21 01:00
Also, be friendly with the departmental staff. The people who run the office, manage the music library, schedule concert halls, schedule classrooms, process your paperwork, etc. If you're in a bind, they're often available to bail you out, and they'll be much more likely to if they like you. They're also usually pretty cool people.
--
Unless you know that you absolutely, positively, never want to do anything other than music and have killer chops, I'd recommend going somewhere that has decent departments in other things you're interested in. Whether for odd classes, a minor, or a later change of major crisis, it's good to have open options and available variety. If I wasn't in my seventh and final year of a double major, I'd be looking into a bio minor right now due to an excellent class.
--
Once in college, hang out in practice rooms with the door open. People will (though not everywhere, I hear) stop to shoot the breeze. Practice with the door open once in a while (if such things are not frowned upon), and always have duet, trio, etc. books handy. An open door or positioning near the window means "I'm practicing, but am looking for an excuse to take a break." Closed door or back to the window means "I'm woodshedding, don't bother me."
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2005-10-21 01:27
Don't talk behind the backs of people, especially those above you. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that others are better than them and they take that out with gossip and etc...
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2005-10-21 01:58
Hi,
Alex has reminded me of an important point. The department staff is a big help but also get to know the custodians, the cafateria/food service folks, the people at the bookstore, and the librarians at the main library (the research staff above all).
Also make sure you give the parking lot ticketing people no reason to even have a job (i.e. don't park in the faculty lot, plan to be on campus early if you commute, and have a valid parking sticker).
HRL
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-10-21 02:06
Indeed, Hank. Our department hasn't worked quite as smoothly since our custodian retired just over a year ago. The chairs in the recital hall lobby are arranged all wrong, the bathroom runs low on supplies and frequently has a wet floor, corners are overrun by spider webs, etc. Instead of our friend Ray, we now share random custodial staff whenever other departments can spare them.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2005-10-21 15:17
At the University of Tennessee geology building, the smell in the student men's room would knock a vulture off a nice rotting zebra.
As a student, I wasn't allowed in the faculty men's room (which was locked to keep the likes of me out), but I'm sure the only odor was disinfectant.
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2005-10-22 01:04
My advice is that you can get SOMETHING out of EVERYTHING. If attending a workshop, don't switch your brain off when, for example, a bassoonist gets up and plays a 'boring' study. Just because it's something you'll never play and it's technique may seem irrelevant to you, listen to the comments, and get something out of it. Watch others closely; listen to the person next to you in the practice room. Are they doing something that is ingraining a bad habit? Well, there you go - you just learned NOT to do that, the easy way.
This is gonna sound like a bad thing to say, but, if you wanna be one of the better musicians, hang out with the good ones. They'll talk about technique and practice a lot, provide support, and they'll ask you to play in their ensembles (or you'll ask them). As opposed to hanging around with the ones who never practice and hang out in their college dorm smoking pot. It's an unfortunate thing, but true.
If you're moving out of home, don't go nuts. This is a discipline and if you don't have it from the start you're wasting your time, your teacher's time and your (or your parent's) money.
Think of your time at college as formative - you don't have to be a professional by the time you get out. At the end of your degree, you should have the basics down, 100%.
I just finished my degree and that's my advice. I'd like to think I was pretty successful; I've come a LONG way in 3 years. Good luck, hope you get a lot out of it.
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