 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: m1964
Date: 2019-02-15 11:56
Hi,
I have a question for professional repair techs:
I noted that two notes on my R13 are quite low: the D1 and low F both are about -10C.
The corresponding A2 and C2 are in tune. Tightening my lips is not enough to put these two notes in tune.
When playing slow music, I can manage to "pull up" the D1 by pressing the "forked" B key on the lower tenon, but it is not very practical solution and does not work well when playing faster.
Is there any way to improve tuning of these two notes without affecting the corresponding A2 and C2?
Thanks a lot.
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2019-02-15 15:58
If you don't mind doing some modifications to your instrument then it may be possible. As far as being out of tune, 10 cents is nothing, especially for the low F. On some instruments this can be as much as 20 cents or more.
There are two main factors in play that determine how the registers will line up with one another. The shape of the bore and mouthpiece chamber and most importantly the location and size of the register vent. Ideally you want one register vent for every note, however this would be far too impractical for real world applications. Instead the location of the register vent is a compromise. In order to compensate for this, the register vent must be longer and have a smaller diameter. The first thing I would do if intonation was your main concern is to get a slightly longer register tube, or one with a smaller diameter as the Festivals have. Then the clarion C should be flatter, so you will now need to undercut the tonehole. A hole in the bell would also be a good idea as if you bring the C down the B will come down with it. If you do this right, the low F will be better, although still not perfect. Also now your throat Bb will be flatter, although on many instruments the Bb is already a bit sharp so this may not be as much of a concern. You can sometimes fix this by raising up the register key pad, although this may not always work and you may need to relocate the register vent up a bit.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2019-02-15 17:33
Just the two notes by -10C? I wouldn't worry about it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: m1964
Date: 2019-02-16 08:34
Chris P wrote:
> Just the two notes by -10C? I wouldn't worry about it.
>
Guys,
Thanks a lot for your replies. The D1 and low F are the two I cannot correct by lip tension.
I have somewhat "improved" tuning by raising certain key pads (to the point where the throat A which used to be slightly flat became slightly sharp).
I hoped that there was a way to undercut tone holes below the flat notes to improve the tuning. If I understand correctly, I cannot just enlarge the tone holes because it would bring corresponding C2 and A2 up as well and make them sharp.
Thanks
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Author: gwlively
Date: 2019-02-16 21:54
I am not a repair tech, but I saw Tom Ridenour undercut the low C hole to raise the pitch of low D. It did not effect the 12th (A).
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Author: m1964
Date: 2019-02-18 01:51
gwlively wrote:
> I am not a repair tech, but I saw Tom Ridenour undercut the low
> C hole to raise the pitch of low D. It did not effect the 12th
> (A).
Hi qwlively,
Thanks a lot for your reply.
I am trying a different MP - older B45. Until yesterday, I played on a newer B45 I bought a year ago. The old one is from late 1970s.
After a little break-in I am going to check how the older B45 affects tuning (I am breaking-in my lips, not the MP).
I do know a tech who said that undercutting does not affect the 12th note(s).
Thanks
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Author: gwlively
Date: 2019-02-19 03:46
To clarify, Tom Ridenour said undercutting does not affect notes near the middle of the clarinet, but as one goes higher up, it does make the 12th sharper along with its fundamental.
I had also wanted throat E raised in pitch, besides low D, but he talked me out of it. The 12th above (B) was already 5 cents sharp.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2019-02-20 03:58
High B being 5 cents sharp is easily lippable down to pitch if you're playing using a tuner (which no-one does in a concert setting). Bear in mind clarinets aren't perfect equal temperament instruments and tuning is relative - you may want that high B to be on the sharp side to be in tune with someone else.
And E isn't a throat note as the throat notes are usually from open G up to Bb in the lower register. If you sharpen the lower register E (xoo|ooo), the upper B will be even sharper and wilder than by a mere 5 cents.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2019-02-20 08:01
Chris is correct. You can try a small 1/2 piece of electrical tape on the key pad closest to the mouthpiece side, below the B/E key to lower the pitch. A very common practice with Moennig in the mid 70's when I studied with him.
I'm not sure what F and D you are referring to. But yes these can be adjusted by most talented repairmen.
Mouthpieces and barrels will make a big difference, so I've always tried not to undercut holes unless that note or note dead sounding and need to be freed up.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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