 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2012-02-09 02:27
I have some back-up horns, but they are a big step below my usual "good" horn (an R-13). So much so, in fact, that I feel a bit sheepish playing them in a couple of my groups due to more tone and intonation challenges.
Of course, my "good" horn will be back from the tech soon, and this won't be an issue. But how do others handle this? What do you use as a back-up horn and what was your criteria for choosing? And do you have different back-ups for different occasions (e.g., outdoor horn, shady gig location horn, travel horn, etc.)
I'm just wondering what others do....
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Author: Grabnerwg
Date: 2012-02-09 03:07
One of the great benefits of being a dealer. There are always extra horns around. The bad thing is when you start drooling over a horn you should be selling to a customer!
(I always have plenty of mouthpieces too!)
Walter Grabner
www.clarinetxpress.com
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-02-09 03:24
Ultimately I think the best backup instrument is one that you enjoy playing even if it isn't your favorite. An instrument that you won't ever play unless you main instrument is in the shop definitely isn't ideal.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2012-02-09 05:27
I have a backup that is a different model from my main clarinet but just as good (objectively). It's actually more expensive than my main clarinet. It used to be my main until I found my current one. I like my main clarinet slightly more so always use that one, but not enough for the hassle of selling the backup and buying another one like my main for a backup. I was using my then main (now backup) clarinet when I happened to find my current main clarinet. I use my main clarinet for everything, outside too (which rarely happens anyway, maybe twice so far) unless conditions are too bad to use it, which only ever happened once.
Post Edited (2012-02-09 06:04)
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Author: Clarimeister
Date: 2012-02-09 05:37
I only have backups for my Bb clarinet. My A and Eb are on their own. I have two Bb clarinets other than my primary R-13, but one of them is a Selmer CL300 student clarinet that I've had since I was in 7th grade. My true backup to my R-13 is a Selmer 10G Series. It's actually a really nice clarinet that my mother used when she was studying music in college. It was purchased in 1974 or there about. It needs some major keywork and TLC, but it plays really great for an oldie.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2012-02-09 06:13
You'd be surprised what a better barrel will do to a horn. I would search for a good barrel (I guess for outdoor horn, a greenline barrel or some other synthetic material). While it still may not be as good as your number one, it goes a long way, and is a small amount of $$$ to invest.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2012-02-09 06:56
I regularly play on my various backups. (I don't rotate reeds, but I rotate instruments. How cool is that)
The feel under the fingers may be different, but something one gets used to, and if not, the horn is no good as a backup, sell it and get one with better or more similar ergos.
I do, however, use my good mouthpiece with the backup, and in most cases, the sound is rather undistinguishable from last week with a different instrument.
--
Ben
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2012-02-09 09:11
My principal Clarinet is the Lyrique but I do often use my other Clarinets as 'back-ups' , these being a Schrieber , a Jupiter and an Amati. I don't have any horns for a 'back-up', all the above being single reed pipes.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-02-09 09:15
What's the point of a back-up horn? When I played Oehler system Wurlitzers for 13 years there was no 'back up horn.' If you keep your horn in good repair and know how to do most emergency fixes, there is no need for a 'back up horn.' Of course if you can afford a second clarinet for 'under 50 degree temperatures (fahrenheit) then get a Greenline Buffet otherwise one good horn (or set) should work.
.................Paul Aviles
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2012-02-09 09:22
I wouldn't want to use my "good" (read:irreplaceable) instrument for outside and marching - not because of the temperatures, but because accidents do happen.
--
Ben
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2012-02-09 10:25
>> What's the point of a back-up horn? <<
The point is to have a backup if necessary, even if it's extremely rare to need it. A lot of people probably never need one). I think I've used my backup clarinet a few times in the almost ten years that I have it. One time I just wanted to use it, for no "real" reason. Just felt I wanted to use it for a change. One time the (original) bell tenon cork fell about 30 minutes before a rehearsal when I disassembled my clarinet. I had about 15 mintues before I had to go and didn't feel like installing a new cork or putting tape/teflon/etc. so just took the backup.
Re inside & outside, I don't know. Some inside concerts/gigs are more "risky" than some outside ones. Regardless of temperature etc.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-02-09 11:00
It's good to have a familliar instrument on standby should something happen to your main one, as well as an instrument that will endure harsh playing conditions so you don't put your main one at risk.
While I'm not talking clarinets here, the same applies - I've sent a load of my main oboe's keys off to be replated, so that's out of commission for the time being until I get the keys back and refit them. I do have a plastic back-up oboe which I'm currently using which isn't the same as my Howarth (a Selmer Signet) but does have all the keywork my main oboe has (apart from the LH C# which I've added and the pieces are all at the platers) so it's a perfectly adequate instrument to fall back onto and allow me to carry on as near to normal as possible.
So if a clarinet player has just the one instrument and it needs some major surgery done to it (eg. accidental damage, keywork alterations, routine servicing or a full overhaul), they're a bit stuffed while it's away being worked on as they haven't got a back-up one to hand, so will either have to borrow or rent an instrument at short notice that might be nowhere near what they're used to. If they've got an imminent important engagement while their clarinet is out of action, playing on an unfamilliar instrument could cause problems if they don't have any time to get used to it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2012-02-09 12:48
I don't have a back-up as such. I have 3 instruments that I regard as equally playable and rotate them almost randomly. The one I take to a practice is the one I pick up first. If one is out of action it's not a problem, I still have a couple to choose from.
Tony F.
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-02-09 13:34
Paul Aviles wrote:
> What's the point of a back-up horn? When I played Oehler
> system Wurlitzers for 13 years there was no 'back up horn.' If
> you keep your horn in good repair and know how to do most
> emergency fixes, there is no need for a 'back up horn.'
That's all well and good until it's time to send you main horn out for an overhaul and you suddenly have no instrument to play. Maybe you are lucky and the tech gets it back to you in a day or maybe he/she gets backed up with work and you have no instrument for a week.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-02-09 13:44
I want to apologize for a possibly testy tone. I may not be at my best first thing in the morning.
I think what a wanted to get at was a vamp on a bit of advice put out by Riccardo Morales on one of the short Backun videos. In it he says that one should always strive to play the very best that you can. I feel that unless you MUST play in some extreme conditions (whether running with your horn or playing in cold temperatures) you should have your best game face on to include your best equipment, best ears, best attention.
Any hint of purposely using a system that lacks in any category is abhorent to me.
And as for the overhaul - yes, you schedule well in advance and take a week off.
.................Paul Aviles
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2012-02-09 14:17
Thanks to all for the helpful advice and perspective! Really terrific insight offered into what others do. In particular, I've learned that...
1. I should make friends with a dealer like Walter Grabner (I'm not THAT far from Highland Park!)
2. The fact that I have a back-up eefer is unusual, and I should perhaps reconsider since my back-up is considerably more problematic than my main eefer (which is challenging enough!)....sadly, my main eefer is currently in the shop, so I actually NEED a back-up at present....I guess I'll struggle through...
3. I may have been scarred by the fact that when my R-13 was overhauled last summer, it took 14 weeks to complete (due to work piling up at the tech, I guess)...so maybe I'm over-reacting to the need for a back-up overall due to this recent experience.
4. I like the idea that one should rotate between a few "good" horns that can be played interchangeably -- although (as noted) this is tougher with the As and Ebs which don't see as much action. Also, this could be quite expensive!
I'm definitely interested in more thoughts on what works for each of you! Thanks in advance.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2012-02-09 14:28
> 4. I like the idea that one should rotate between a few "good" horns that
> can be played interchangeably -- although (as noted) this is tougher with
> the As and Ebs which don't see as much action. Also, this could be quite
> expensive!
Depends. Most of my instruments are sub-$100 steals from auctions.
I should add that I refurbish these instruments myself, so in a way I only play on "custom" instruments.
What doesn't pass the "rotation test" will inevitably got sold.
I have a backup bass, but no backup Alto. Yet. (I wonder what the definition would be for a guy who doesn't only own an Alto but has a backup as well!)
--
Ben
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-02-09 15:12
bradfordlloyd wrote:
> 3. I may have been scarred by the fact that when my R-13 was
> overhauled last summer, it took 14 weeks to complete (due to
> work piling up at the tech, I guess)...so maybe I'm
> over-reacting to the need for a back-up overall due to this
> recent experience.
Wow. Was this just a regular overhaul or were you having additional work done like having the keys replated or waiting for a replacement part to arrive? I can understand a tech keeping an instrument for 2-3 weeks if they get backed up but 14 weeks is just crazy.
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2012-02-09 15:41
It was just a regular overhaul. I wasn't in a big hurry, so I was prepared to wait for up to 6 weeks. But it turned into 14 weeks, and caused me some serious issues on the end (I ended up having to audition for a group on Eb when I would have preferred Bb, but had no horn and no chance to practice!)
In the end, the overhaul was nothing short of spectacular. And it was significantly discounted based on the late delivery and my patience. In the end, my Eb playing improved (and I'm now playing it regularly in the group I auditioned for) and all is well.
Still, I'm a bit gun shy about turning my horn over to a tech (which I just had to do with my Eb!)
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Author: Nessie1
Date: 2012-02-09 16:09
This is slightly off topic but something I've been wondering for a while so I'll ask - If, as I would ideally like to do, I get a pair of clarinets that I consider better than my current 1010s and keep the 1010s as back-ups, does anyone have any advice on keeping them in shape or myself used to them, bearing in mind that the whole point would be to have them ready to turn to reliably at a moment's notice if my other clarinets were out of order? For example, is it wise to get a back up instrument out may be once a month or so to practise on so that one remains used to it? Get your tech to give it the once over once a year? or.....?
I would not be in the camp of considering my back-up instrument far worse than my main ones but just a bit less good.
Any suggestions?
Thanks
Vanessa.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-02-09 22:02
If you do get a new set of Peter Eaton Elites (the nearest thing to your 1010s), then use your 1010s during the playing in period of the new ones. Then every now and then once your Elites are fully played in, use your 1010s regularly but with a period of rest in between.
Provided they're well maintained by yourself (add the odd drop of oil to the mechanism as and when), you won't have to get them serviced as regularly as they'll be played far less than they normally would (the intervals between each service can then be extended to three or four times what it currently is). But you will at least still have them in ready playable condition for the time your main clarinets are away for their regular service.
Or you could use both new and old sets in rotation - that will double the interval between services on both sets.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2012-02-12 10:36
I like the additional thought from Chris P that rotating through a couple of horns should actually keep each in good repair and maintenance longer. This concept of "it's not a back-up, it's just a variety of high quality instruments that I like that I choose to rotate through" is a really interesting one. A great way to think about things.
As for tictactux, I too like to pick up vintage or lesser known brands for bargains and see what can be done with them. My R13 Bb soprano backups include a Penzel Mueller Artist Model and a vintage Kohlert Full Boehm. I also have a few projects waiting for me to address.
So, tictactux....when do you draw the line and decide that one has to go? After I've invested time (and sometimes money) in them, I find myself being far too patient and forgiving. What's your criteria?
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