 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: RodRubber
Date: 2008-05-06 03:57
Dear Friends,
We go through the box of 10 reeds, we find (or sometimes don't find) the one good one and many times we perform only on that one. Or we go through 5 boxes, and play on the 5 good reeds we find. In the end each of these good reeds is costing about $20 (actually more now that v12 is so high price). Of course we try to play on the other ones etc, try to fix them, but mostly we trash them. There is a premium on the good one in the box. We don't buy the box of reeds for those lousy ones, we want the good one. The one we play recitals on, auditions on, etc might be a $100 reed, or more.
How much would you pay per reed, not per box, but per reed, if you knew the one you were getting would work?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BandieSF
Date: 2008-05-06 04:38
I went synthetic and can get the one good reed for far cheaper than a box of V12 now that Vandoren started doing the flow packaging. I seriously got sick of having to mess around with reeds for half the class period in band when I could be playing to my heart's content. A Legere reed costs about $20-$30 for me. Why would you have to pay more, much less want to?
I just feel lucky that my band director hasn't said anything yet...
But again, that's synthetic reeds. As a committed synthetic, I don't know how much I would pay for a reed that won't last me more than two weeks when I can adjust to one that can potentially last a year or even more for a reasonable price.
Personally, I couldn't care less what the thing's made of as long as I can consistently get a good sound on it.
-----
Current set-up:
Classical:
Strength 4 1/4 Legere Signature Series
Vandoren M13 Lyre
Jazz:
Strength 3 3/4 Legere Quebec
Pomarico Jazz*
Clarinets:
Buffet E11 Student Model
Buffet R13 Greenline
<http://operationhighschool.blogspot.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-05-06 04:57
"How much would you pay per reed, not per box, but per reed, if you knew the one you were getting would work?"
I have been asked to help design a reed for a store. The store wants to sell them ONE at a time because some pro players in the area said that they would pay up to $50/reed if they knew that it would be a good one. Even with that, we are still looking into weather this is worth it (from the production side) on the small scale. Especially considering that there are so many brands and large scale distribution is very unlikely.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-05-06 09:10
Sky, what is a good reed for one player won't be for the next. Highest quality cane and a really good cutting tool is what will make for a good reed.
The Reserve Reed already does that along with several other brands (Gonzales, etc).
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bassie
Date: 2008-05-06 11:46
> How much would you pay per reed, not per box, but per reed, if you knew the one you were getting would work?
Heck, I'd shift to a different brand if I was getting less than 50% hit rate.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-05-06 11:58
David Blumberg-"Sky, what is a good reed for one player won't be for the next."
Yes, that is another cog in the wheel.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2008-05-06 13:07
(Disclaimer - I sell Gonzalez and Xilema reeds, Reed Wizard and ATG System)
Blummy is oh so correct that the difference in instruments, barrels, mouthpieces, and most importantly the player makes it near impossible IMHO to make the "one" good reed suitable for every player.
I had been so spoiled with both a huge stash of quality and classic reeds and the availability of bunches of free reeds on trial from the major manufacturers that I would just blow through a number of reeds to find really good ones, and toss the others but I've changed my ways. As Blummy again has indicated there are commercial reeds with good quality cane and decent cuts available to all of us.
The haunting question is what to do if your "perfect" reed fails you or gets chipped right before the important concert or recital? You must either have other great backups or the knowledge, ability, and experience to alter reeds to make them play when you need them. This brings up the whole question of: "do you play the reeds or do the reeds play you" ?
My approach has now evolved to develop the skills and experience to evaluate and modify existing reeds to play better and to adapt my own playing technique to be flexible enough to play a number of different variations in reed quality to the best advantage.
There are a number of different approaches to modify reeds including the old reliable good reed knife, sand paper, files, etc. and Ben Amato's Reed Wizard, Tom Ridenour's ATG system, and other good products, machines, etc.
It takes some trial and error and fortitude but over time most players IMO will be able to modify many reeds in a standard box of quality reeds to make them play very well. As others have attested, one should be able to get most reeds in a box to perform well through modifications and if you as a player become more versitile at playing different reed variations you should become able to give a quality performance on most of them.
This being said - there is always that unusually great reed found among the good reeds but this is a rare treat and should be considered as such and not the reed to be sought after but just enjoyed as a special gift. With the great variability in reeds due to their biological origins it is IMO impossible to make the perfect reed on a consistent basis, even so, it would only be the perfect reed for that one individual player - not everyone.
Just my own 2 cents and personal viewpoint.
L. Omar Henderson
www.doctorsprod.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Molloy
Date: 2008-05-06 13:15
I have trouble understanding this discussion. Maybe it means I don't play well enough to know a good reed from a bad one. In a box of Zonda reeds at least four of the five reeds work fine for me, often all five. They don't last long but they're very consistent so when one gets dull I just grab the next one.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2008-05-06 14:20
I'd say about $2.50 at the most.............and stop giving Vandoren any more "bright ideas!!"
...........Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2008-05-06 16:01
Bandie, where are you buying Legeres that they cost that much? I get mine from wwbw for well under $20/reed. Right now, they are $18.99 each, and the go on sale from time to time.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
Post Edited (2008-05-06 16:02)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ed
Date: 2008-05-06 16:02
One of the keys things as some have indicated is learning to work on your reeds. Step 1 is to have a good consistent break-in method. Step 2 is to be able to do a little balancing and be sure the reed is flat and seals to the mouthpiece. These small steps can work wonders. It is very little work and can get many to play.
One of my old teachers used to say "a good mouthpiece is one that will play with many different reeds". Sometimes we get hung up on a mouthpiece that we like but that is very reed fussy. It is better to play with one that lets you get down to playing the instrument and not playing WITH the instrument.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: larryb
Date: 2008-05-06 16:30
It seems that what is needed here is not a per reed fee, but rather a risk management vehicle for reeds. In other words, reed insurance.
Is there a clarinetist/actuary out there who could develop an attractive reed insurance model?
Since even one good reed at $50 can not guarantee to be the best, or even good, reed insurance is the way to go.
We all need to pay into a reed insurance pool to minimize the risks and costs of buying reeds. Any deductable needs to be priced properly.
Someone also need to develop a reed insurance claim form.
This insurance could start as a localized policy for woodwind.org members only, but could eventually lead to national reed insurance, of course.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: 53engine
Date: 2008-05-06 16:49
Re: Reed Insurance
After this, we will have to have universal reed insurance. Perhaps, this will be the 2012 campaign issue.
Seriously, I don't get this thing about reeds. And, I agree with Molly. Perhaps I don't play well enough but I have found over the 54 years that I have been playing, that if I was having a lot of trouble finding reeds, I was using the wrong strength.
If you find good 3.5's harder and harder to find, then try 3's or vice versa. It's amazing what using the proper strangth reed will do for your playing.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: dmfett
Date: 2008-05-06 16:59
After returning to my clarinet after 25 years I found Gonzales reeds...I found that in the first 5 boxes I had 95+% work after a little work
The only problem was finding the right size and with lots of playing I found the size that works right for me and my mouth piece.
I feel they are the best on the market today...I like that they do not use pesticides and that is worth it even more...
What most (young and old Players) need to do is learn how to work on reed to make them play...the late Joe Allard showed me and I have lots of success and do not need anything but reeds, (Gonzales) sand paper and a reed knife and I have a good reed with little work on Gonzales reeds...(wish I get paid or free reeds for the words on Gonzales)
I would say find a person who studied with Joe Allard and learn from them on how to fix reeds...then the price will not be an issue
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Iceland clarinet
Date: 2008-05-06 17:19
It's always better to start with a strenght that is a bit too stiff right out of the box since they will get softer after brake-in and you can always take of some cane but you can't put it on. So if V-12 #3.5 works well for you right out of the box then you don't have much flexibility for adjustments. Then you can always take the once that feels good but are too stiff and play them more during the brake-in period.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: claritoot26
Date: 2008-05-16 16:50
Rod_Rub,
I haven't heard you lately, but always thought you sounded like you could find the good reed out of a box pretty consistently. We're always most critical of our own sound, and the vibrations you feel while playing can alter your perception of your "true" sound. I've had experiences when I think there is some strange buzziness or interference to my sound, or the reed doesn't feel good to play, but the master guru across the room says it sounds very good from there and that I worry too much. I was having a bad spell with reeds recently, but then I changed my Rico Reedvitalizer packet, and it did just that....the reeds were revitalized. good luck,
Lori
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BandieSF
Date: 2008-05-18 02:53
JJAlbrecht,
I overestimated. For me it's no higher than $20, but more often than not it's less than that. But that's beside the point. Every reed plays the same, and I can't get enough of my sound when I get to really play hard.
-----
Current set-up:
Classical:
Strength 4 1/4 Legere Signature Series
Vandoren M13 Lyre
Jazz:
Strength 3 3/4 Legere Quebec
Pomarico Jazz*
Clarinets:
Buffet E11 Student Model
Buffet R13 Greenline
<http://operationhighschool.blogspot.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2008-05-18 08:20
I just checked and the reeds I use cost about $23.00 for a box of ten. So I'd pay up to $2.30 for one reed. Not all in the box are always good but some good reeds can become bad but also vise versa because of weather, etc.
My main problem with recent cane reeds is that the tips break, small square chips missing, probably from slap tonguing. I don't use that more than before, and I don't remember that ever happening, so I assume it's the reeds. I've tried playing on only Legere for a couple of months to see if I can forget about cane reeds. The sound was good but I had response issues, especially in the upper clarion, that I never have with my usual reeds. At the end I couldn't stand it anymore and got back to my usual reeds, even with their disadvantages (sometimes they are fine though and don't break at all). I realized Legere reeds might just not work good with my mouthpiece, but even thinking about finding a different mouthpiece is the last I want to do....
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Neal Raskin
Date: 2008-05-20 15:03
Isn't this what the Vandoren "Hand Select" reeds are supposed to accomplish? You are getting ten hand selected reeds that should give you better chances of getting the perfect reed. I've never personally paid the extra expense of these reeds, but I've heard some poor reviews... Anybody have a take on these reeds?
Neal
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tom H
Date: 2008-05-20 20:07
I know the Vandoren scene for over 30 years. They're still the best, but try to get a really great one. In 1992 I was a soloist and found one days before the performances. Best reed my entire life, and to date. I could do ANYTHING with that one. Staccato, all dynamics, the complete range. I recorded the solo-the Bellini Concerto. Not the most difficult thing ever written, but when I listen to the tape I can't imagine anyone sounding any better. And I'm an obscure local band/orchestra guy.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
