 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-15 19:10
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I've had way more clarinets come and go from my home over the past 6 years than I've needed. But none packed this sparingly until the last couple of weeks. Is this a new "green" minimalist trend? I hope not.
(Edited to update thread title.)
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2016-10-25 16:18)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-15 19:13
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Whoops- forgot to sanitize and remove addresses- give me a minute to repost.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2016-10-15 19:15)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-15 19:27
Since I scrambled 2 sets of photos, let me clarify.
1) Yamaha YCL-72CS shipped in Yamaha case simply shrink wrapped in plastic, from Miami to Orlando. Case latches both broken, probably not shipping damage. Clarinet had messed up register key and other issues, probably also not shipping damage. I returned to sender (in a box!) as "unplayable" and got a full refund.
2) Leblanc VSP shipped in Priority Mail box with no additional padding, from St Cloud FL to Orlando. Clarinet is in great shape, I'll post about that later.
Does anyone want to defend this kind of treatment of fine instruments as no big deal? Do you ship your $3000 R13's this way? From NY to Berlin and back? And nothing bad happens? Or if it does get damaged, it "would have happened anyway" even with a good sized outer box and plenty of padding?
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2016-10-15 19:29)
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2016-10-15 20:07
Just an uninformed shipper. Maybe someone that thinks that a case is good enough protection. I certainly would take more care, but then again, I can UNDERSTAND someone just not knowing better.
Just let the customer know the error of their ways. Hopefully they'll be grateful you told them because it seems like no one else has!
Alexi
PS - What I'm trying to say is I think this could be a case of "ignorance" (just lack of knowledge) instead of laziness or not caring.
US Army Japan Band
Post Edited (2016-10-15 20:07)
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Author: knotty
Date: 2016-10-15 20:20
Probably a lot has to do with high shipping costs nowadays. Priority mail has box size limitations.
~ Musical Progress: None ~
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2016-10-15 20:23
A friend bought a Yamaha YCL650 on EBay and it came shipped in a plastic mailing envelope. Fortunately intact.
Tony F.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2016-10-15 20:31
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I had a Buffet S3 alto sax posted to me in just the locked case. The low C keyguard tab had come unsoldered. I also had a Yamaha YAS-62 alto posted with the case wrapped up in the same manner as your Yamaha clarinet:
http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/download.html/1,5168/DSCs-08113blur.JPG
Fortunately no harm came to that alto (besides the poor overhaul it had before I bought it).
Whenever I've sent out any clarinet or other instrument through the post, I've used a lot of bubble-wrap and also entirely surrounded with polystyrene chips to fully suspend the case within the box. Also packed the instrument with either polystyrene blocks or bubble wrap to hold the ends of the joints down (but not applying pressure to the keywork) so the joints won't get jolted or rattle about within the case. Also wrapped the joints in bubble-wrap if there's sufficient space within the case to do that.
I remember a photo of a Yamaha trombone case sent to John Myatt that was just wrapped with string and had strips of cardboard covering the edges where the string ran over them.
A few years back I sent a cor anglais to the USA which was in a box with a specially shaped foam support that slipped on both sides of the case to suspend it within. I may have also filled the voids either with polystyrene chips or bubble-wrap to insulate it. It arrived safely.
Bassoons, keyboards and other instruments I've sent out have arrived well. But anything is at the mercy of the delivery company - I just received a Bose Wave radio yesterday which had been damaged in transit (see attachment) - alarm bells had already been sounded when I realised who the delivery company was.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: gkern
Date: 2016-10-15 21:55
Stan - I am curious as to what you think of the VSP after you play it.
Gary K
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-15 22:03
Alexi- yes perhaps I am being too harsh here. However, the Yamaha came from a pawn shop with over 3000 feedback- not much excuse there.
Gary- yes I will eventually have a lot to say. Less than 24 hr in I can already say- yes it is a quality backup for my Arioso that could eventually become primary, yes it plays very similarly as it should by pedigree, does not seem the intonation is quite as spot on as my Arioso- again that makes sense since Tom improved the designs year after year. More later.
(Edited a week later to add- not so good after all- see later post.)
Chris- the sound from your radio will just have some unplanned waviness.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
Post Edited (2016-10-22 03:23)
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2016-10-16 01:26
I'm sorry, I can't help laughing at Chris's post. That stunned me! People are simple nuts! Nothing else to say...
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: Johan H Nilsson
Date: 2016-10-16 03:05
The case IS a good protector. It is more important to put some bubble plastics inside the case than outside, to prevent parts from moving around.
If the case itself needs be protected I doubt that the forces that will damage it would be stopped by layers of foam.
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-10-16 19:48
Well, enough of horror stories. I have a good story. Two weeks ago I bought a nicely refurbished Yahama SE(V) clarinet online from SaxQuest in St. Louis, Mo. The instrument, expertly adjusted by Audrey Denny, was covered inside the case with a protective layer of bubble packing material. The lock snaps on the case were tightly shut and the case protector snugly zipped. The clarinet arrived in a very large box filled with a bucket full of big styrofoam beads.
When I opened the case, the clarinet was bright and shiny, undamaged, with pads perfectly seated and sealing, all spring mechanisms working, and in fine mechanical adjustment. If you're looking for a used clarinet in great shape, safely delivered to your door, I suggest considering SaxQuest. They sell many used brands including Buffet, Selmer, LeBlanc, Yamaha, a Rossi now and then, and others. On their website, I even got to hear Audrey Denny play an etude on the Yamaha SE before I bought it. So some folks out there are doing it right.
Post Edited (2016-10-17 19:20)
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-10-17 17:35
I'm conflicted.
On the one hand I don't like thoughtless people like your shipper.
On the other, buying [clarinets] other than in person, from unknown sellers, even with good reviews, presents risk you knew going in: from misrepresentation of product, to poor packing, to seller innocent damage of excellent well protected product while in transit.
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-17 19:44
I try to follow something I heard a long time ago- "Never ascribe to malice what is explainable by ignorance". That's one of many versions of "Hanlon's razor". I'm better at it some times than others.
And on plenty of occasions I'm the one in oblivious ignorance and in need of other folks to cut me some slack.
And I'm sure sometimes that I think I'm following Hanlon's principal- really I'm the one in ignorance. It all happens in life.
I find the auction site to be several notches above the old classified ad days, or purchases even in person at pawn shops, swap meets, and such. There is a degree of security that makes it often possible to recover from a bad deal- which makes it easier to try iffy deals that otherwise would look too risky but turn out to be great. In my 1000+ transactions I've really only been burned a couple of times either as buyer or seller- infrequently enough to stand out as anomalies.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-10-17 20:48
A razor about ignorance you can't have here plays no role. Many such transactions you've discussed on the board, if not your last paragraph, recognizes your assumption of risk going in based on some of your disappointing auction history, if not common knowledge.
Again--sorry the purchase fell short, but most ebay purchases, as you've noted, work out, (maybe because) there's some recourse when the don't, and are cheaper that store front transactions precisely because the marketplace provides you a discount for the assumption of this risk you knew of.
..it's a little like complaining that when playing craps, knowing the odds, you didn't get a "21..." or that the store front gear you freely purchased with less risk was too expensive.
Post Edited (2016-10-17 20:50)
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-22 03:25
Gary- I find the VSP intonation to be disappointing. I'm inclined to take that as a compliment to my Arioso rather than a significant issue with the VSP which in other settings gets good marks. My tuning measurements compare well with those reported elsewhere, so I think there's nothing wrong with my particular example. But I guess I have to resell and save up for a 2nd Arioso or a 576BC. I'm spoiled, and I'm not willing to work that hard to play in tune. So not much reason for a separate VSP thread after all.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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Author: Ursa
Date: 2016-10-24 10:58
Stan...before you write off the VSP, why not send an inquiry to Tom Ridenour about having him freshen it up?
If it's not worth his time or your money, you can count on him to be up front about it.
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Author: jdbassplayer
Date: 2016-10-24 18:17
Ursa,
I don't think Tom does restorations anymore. It's a real shame because he certainly has extensive knowledge of clarinet acoustics. Seems he's to busy making Lyrique clarinets.
-Jdbassplayer
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Author: fskelley
Date: 2016-10-25 07:39
I made a quick inquiry to Tom. He said, "The 576 was based in large part on the acoustics of the VSP. But like all the clarinets I've designed in hard rubber, the hard rubber came out superior to the wood clarinet bearing an analogous acoustical design. In addition, you are looking at quite an old clarinet now-- it's hard to believe but the VSP is about 25 years old, and wood can change quite a bit."
So looks like this VSP is what it is- reasonably good for its time, but the science has moved on for those who know what to look for.
Kind of off the original topic of how to pack and ship clarinets, but that happens to a lot of threads.
Stan in Orlando
EWI 4000S with modifications
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