 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Playsk8r
Date: 2013-12-29 03:32
hello. I am looking at upgrading my clarinet setup. I may have the chance to buy a Buffet RC. Apparently it's just been repaded, and all the tenon corks have been changed. What I want to know is how this compares to the R-13. Is the bore the only difference, and what is considered a reasonable price for once in decent condition?
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-12-29 04:21
It's my understanding that the "RC" is merely a slightly modified R13. I played one many years ago and it was pretty much a standard R13 from my perspective at the time with some different tuning characteristics (can't remember precisely but I think it was mainly in the altissimo).
All prices would be the same as the standard R13. As for the value to YOU, that depends on what you think of it when you try it.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: hartt
Date: 2013-12-29 11:01
I, too, owned an RC at one time.
Buffet site no longer the the bore specs for individual clarinets. However, it is about the same +/- 2 thousandths. The register key, unlike an R13, is 3mm higher. This is also found on the Prestige, Vintage, Tosca, etc. series. The purpose is to help with the intonation of the above staff A and B......at a slight expense to the throat Bb, which is a notorious note adn has its own tuning issues.
The RC felt smaller in diameter, like the early pre R13. My Vintage model has the same sensation.
The RC has a differnt taper to the bore and an egg shaped ream in the bell. From a sound perspective, I heard no difference of that of my R13's. In fact, I swapped bells among them and none sounded better than with the original bell.
Know that an RC may have a higher new purchase price but, the R13 is more sale-able when used.
Although you are in Canada, you probably would be best to buy either or any Buffet clarinet that does not have the letter F as a prefix to the s/n. Much has been written here about that and you can do a search for it.
I did find my RC to not have the power of my R13's and projected less. Others who heard a solo, etc, made similar comments. Almost as if it had a more delicate sound. Good?, Bad ?
Despite the advertised egg shaped ream in teh bell, you would perhaps be better served finding the RIGHT repairman to have the bell choke reamed. I had this done to 2 Bb (R13 and Yamaha) and they came back different instruments.
Would I buy another one. NO. I'm content with my R13, Vintage and an old Yamaha SE (R13 clone). All have been slightly tweeked and as such, play better than before.
I have a set of Vintages, Yamaha SE's and an R13. Content.
As with any instrument purchase, try as many as you can, USE A TUNER. If you are trying several of the same model, try swapping bells and barrels...but ONLY among the same models
Trust I have not confused you.
Price?....it is only worth what you are willing to pay for it. Check ebay completed auctions for prices
Despite comments, it is your choice /preference of sound. Above all else as with any clarinet purchase us a TUNER.
There are several brief articles on how to tune a clarinet, do a search...and do not forget the 12ths.
me
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Author: Jeroen
Date: 2013-12-29 08:42
The RC and R13 are considered to be equal in quality and price (at least in Europe).
De RC favours a more colourful French sound but is less resonant than the R13.
Buffet tried to combine the powerfull R13 bore with extra tonal colours into the Festival clarinet.
I played several years on a pair of RC's.
Nice instruments, but I finally departed from them because of the lack of power.
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Author: bbillings
Date: 2013-12-29 13:52
Alex,
Perhaps, you should have continued with this question on your original thread. There shouldn't be a Buffet RC in your previously mentioned $600 price range. If there is, there is something wrong with it and you should run away. You should continue to look for a good intermediate clarinet and a fine mouthpiece, IMHO. It's nice to shop for Ferrari's but realistically your previously stated budget won't support that purchase. The Yamaha 450 is a fine clarinet as is the Buffet E11. Either will easily take you through high school and not inhibit your growth as a player. There is prejudice favoring Buffet. I've played both. Personally, I like the Yamaha 450 with silver keys better than the E11. I play a very nice R13 but they are significantly more expensive. I'd spend my money on getting the good mouthpiece and having the clarinet set up properly as I mentioned before. The mouthpiece/reed/embrochure interaction is most responsible for your sound. Shopping is fun though. Good luck with your playing.
Brian
Best Wishes!
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2013-12-29 22:29
I don't want to say "money-is-not-a-consideration," but I firmly believe that ANYONE who can obtain a professional line horn is better off, since the only difference between those and lesser horns is the QUALITY of the engineering which directly affects PITCH (internal, that is, note to note) and timbre.
So I recommend buying the best horn you can afford.
As for mouthpieces there are plenty of professional line mouthpieces that are around $100, so this does NOT have to be a "buy a or horn OR buy a mouthpiece" scenario by any means.
............Paul Aviles
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Author: bbillings
Date: 2013-12-29 23:21
Paul,
Didn't you read the $600 max budget and that they are 13 years old and playing for under a year? It was in the previous thread and I presume their budget is at the mercy of their parents. Have you ever seen a professional level clarinet for $600 or less that isn't in less than adequate condition? Alex had earlier inquired about intermediate vintage clarinets. I can't imagine getting anything new that is adequate with the expressed budget and in the used market one would be lucky to end up with an E11 or YCL-450 with silver keys. They'd both be very capable. It's my opinion, they should focus on getting modern forged, sturdy keys and a convenient, protective carrying case with a horn that is in very good mechanical condition.
With regard to your assertion about better engineering in professional horns, maybe but debatable. The R13 hasn't really changed drastically in 40 years+. Tweaked here and there yes. Even tweaked then reversed for a "vintage" model. Your Yamaha is likely more highly engineered but isn't as highly adopted for whatever reason. I have (2) "professional" vintage clarinets that are less highly engineered than any current design but both sound and play wonderfully. Wood vs. other media, again highly debated on this board. Robert Spring sounds wonderful on his Greenline clarinets and Tom Ridenour makes his rubber ones sing. I'd be surprised if a professional couldn't perform a virtuous concert on either the E11 or 450 and I'd contend that any difference would be apparent to very few listeners. Most manufacturing processes are equivalent given the adoption of technology regardless of the company. Hand work and skilled craftsmanship has been minimized. I recall Julian Bliss promoting his clarinets claiming he'd be capable of performing any night with one to his satisfaction. I'm certain he could perform to my satisfaction on any clarinet he chose. I've personally heard Eddie Daniels play on several different manufacturers and he sounds great regardless. Most importantly, he sounded just like Eddie Daniels on all of them. Different clarinets, different technicians, different mouthpieces etc... "Professional" is a designation from the manufacturer and may or may not be any indicator of quality, mostly a marketing ploy I assert.
Respectfully,
Brian
Expressly my personal opinions and biases. I suspect we all make decisions based on our desires and modified by our budgets and priorities. Paul has helped me in the past and I respect his opinion; hopefully, no one reads this as a personal affront to Paul!
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