 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2005-11-28 17:48
I've been working on getting used to a LeBlanc "paperclip" contrabass clarinet that I was recently given to play. I still intermittently squeak when playing it--most often when I am going up over the break, say, in playing a run upwards that includes going from A to B. A likely contributor if not the out-and-out cause of this squeaking may be from not cleanly changing from one fingering to the next. And a likely cause of this may be poor hand positioning. On the contra, the left hand has to be held, I'm guessing, six inches higher than it does on my bass. The natural thing to do is to have the arm angled upward and the wrist relatively straight, but this is likely resulting in a band hand position. (I also have trouble hitting the C#/G# key without hitting something else at the same time.) So, the options I can see are to (a) keep my arm relatively low and angled upward with my wrist cocked at an awkward angle or (b) raise my arm to where my elbow is sticking out to my left. Neither is completely comfortable and the latter would eventually tire my shoulder. The ideal but impractical solution, in my opinion, would be to have something to rest my elbow on while keeping it raised like a chicken wing. Any suggestions?
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2005-11-28 20:47
I recall reading many, many years ago that Hovennagel (sp?), when he designed the "paperclip" horns, was advised of this very problem, and that it was left hanging there without solution when the design was finalized. It may have been speculation on someone's part, but if it was not it would not be the first time that good advice was ignored by an innovator.
Playing any of the large clarinets is a bit of an ordeal. I had some twinges of carpal tunnel in my left wrist when I spent a season playing contra-alto as a favor for a band director once back in the 1970's, and that was with the old Selmer straight design. With the paperclips, it's almost like you are grabbing a flagpole at two points about a foot and a half apart while positioning your head at a point just below your left wrist, and I found that I needed to do a little contortion of my seated posture to make it all "work".
Mind you, I've heard similar complaints from soprano clarinet players who have been drafted into the ranks of the bass clarinet world for a short period. It is different in that case, but not nearly as extreme as with the paperclip horns.
Also, with the harmony clarinets, you've got the whole "the mouthpiece has to be at this exact height due to the floor peg" issue, probably bearing as much on the problem as does the hand spacing.
At least you're not having to hold onto a curved sopranino saxophone...
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: BassetHorn
Date: 2005-11-28 21:13
I personally don't experience any problems with the hand position issue. I guess having a longish and wide torso helps. My left elbow doesn't need to be raised anymore than on the bass, and the fingering is overall quite natural for me. When playing it, it literally feels like I am hugging the beast and it doesn't feel all that monstrous.
I agree with Don that hitting the left pinky F#/C# key is tricky. So as much as I can I use the right pinky alternate key for low F# and upper C#. I have also put key risers on 3 keys so my short stubby fingers have a fighting chance of reaching them correctly and comfortably, they are the left pinky low D and low E keys and the left palm side G# key. The right pinky low Eb key is also a bit low, but I am out of key risers….
What I am having difficulty with is reading music while playing this thing. The bell intrudes my view and I can’t really use both my eyes on the music, either cock my head to my left and use my left eye mainly to read the music positioned on my left, or do the same with my right side. Tremendous eye strain after a few minutes.
Willy
Post Edited (2005-11-29 04:38)
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Author: Shorthand
Date: 2005-11-29 02:19
The BBb contra definitely forces you to get your elbows out and up. AFAIK, this is the correct playing position for the Bass as well, but its easy to get lazy on the Bass until you're whacked over the head with a bunch of very fast throat notes.
That high left hand position isn't optimal, but just be thankful you aren't playing a Bassoon.
Squwaking over the break on the BBb contra isn't very likely a hand postion issue unless you're hitting the G# key, doubly so if you have your right hand down first - its just the Contra being the Contra.
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2005-11-29 14:24
Thanks for the insightful comments.
Shorthand--When playing my bass, my forearm is pretty much parallel to the floor without having to hold my arm up very much--no great strain. With the contra, to hold my forearm parallel to the floor would require holding my elbow at near shoulder level, something that could make it tire very quickly. Maybe I need to build shoulder strength and endurance.
I guess it's comforting that squeaking may be the contra just being the contra, until I find myself doing it in ensemble rehearsal or performance. I've played the contra in two less-than-critical rehearsals (trying out music for next Spring, etc.) and found myself occasionally squeaking and then cursing--and hoping that the director and everyone else realized that I was just getting used to the instrument, especially since I consider myself lucky to even be in this group.
One thing I still need to do is double check for leaks. I wonder if I can fish a string of Christmas lights into the instrument? I had also noticed that the A just above the staff is stuffier than other notes and used my right hand to clamp down individual pads while playing it, but got no improvement. I realize that this doesn't eliminate the possibility of a leak being the cause, but it probably decreases it.
BassetHorn--You complain about being able to see around the instrument. It is true that a disadvantage of a paperclip is that you have to look around a cluster of three tubes or two tubes and a bell where with a straight model you would only have to look around one tube. I have been sitting at an angle to the music stand, looking to the left of the instrument, but I would much prefer a better view of the music.
Yesterday, when reviewing this thread, I thought that a common solution to both the hand position and sight problem might be to angle the instrument to the left about thirty degrees from vertical. I haven't yet tried it, but I expect it is very difficult to hold the instrument this way.
Terry--Am I correct to assume that with a curved sopranino sax your hands are basically jammed together right under your chin? I would expect it would be hard to not hit extra keys as well.
Finally, one other observation. Lately, I have been practicing almost exclusively on the contra in order to get used to it. I then find that when I pick up my bass I have to retrain my fingers as to where some of the keys are. After a minute it comes back to me.
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Author: CJB
Date: 2005-11-29 16:58
I've had the misfortune to have to play an exceedingly badly looked after paperclip contra.
I am unable to find a seat position that is comfortable for my right hand and always require my wrist to bend to an unpleasant angle (to be fair I have much smaller than average hands)
The majority of squeeks on this beast come from a particularly poor adjustment of the 1st 2 touch pieces for the right hand. Last time I had the pleasure of playing it a low Bb was impossible due to the leaks. The less said about the register key mechanism the better.
I can never understand how an instrument that is so large and stuffy can project so well and high pitched when it squeeks
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Author: BassetHorn
Date: 2005-11-29 18:11
I find that having some basic knowledge about key adjustments and the desire to do some adjustment oneself improve one’s pleasure in contra playing. I always carry with me a little bag containing screwdrivers, pliers, spring hook, scissors, plumber’s tape, electrician’s tape, brushes, Q tips, and key oils, for the emergency situations where I have to do some basic repairs or adjustments on the spot. Contras being contras, may go out of adjustments frequently just due to frictions of large size keys rubbing against each other, a natural process, which some basic adjustment will take care easily. If you have to go to the repair guy everytime this happens, it will hurt your morale not to mention your wallet too. If anyone is living with a contra and plans to play it on a continuous basis, hitting up your repair guy for some paid lessons on basic repairs/adjustment is a good idea.
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Author: CJB
Date: 2005-11-29 19:02
I've done a fair ammount of work on that instrument, I even managed to persuade it that there are notes in the upper register! Its way beyond my basic skills to get it playing properly. At least 1/2 the pads need replacing, keywork has been bent to accomodate missing cork and the dent in the bottom needs to be seen to be believed :-(
It needs someone to invest some cash into it, but I really don't have that sort of money spare, and its owners have no interest in maintaining it.
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Author: archer1960
Date: 2005-11-29 19:06
CJB wrote:
> I've done a fair ammount of work on that instrument, I even
> managed to persuade it that there are notes in the upper
> register! Its way beyond my basic skills to get it playing
> properly. At least 1/2 the pads need replacing, keywork has
> been bent to accomodate missing cork and the dent in the bottom
> needs to be seen to be believed :-(
Sounds like the one I played in high school: I was constantly using pieces of tape to hold spacers made of folded paper in place to keep the linkages aligned properly. Never had to mess with pads, though, and when I had it in adjustment, it would play all the way from jake brake (low E[?]) to the C above the staff with no problems. I don't recall ever needing to go above that, but it would have probably done so, at least by a little.
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Author: natt12321
Date: 2005-11-29 20:59
Shorthand wrote:
>That high left hand position isn't optimal, but just be thankful you aren't >playing a Bassoon.
?? what does this mean exactly, I've recently about 2 months ago taken up the bassoon myself and haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about, please do enlighten me, i am rather curious.
'Music is the only sensual pleasure without vice'
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2005-11-30 00:21
It’s extremely crucial that the instrument itself is in perfect condition. Contras are very unforgiving about leaks. Take special care about the double speaker key system. Have a good tech to take a good look at it. Take a lot of time to get an idea what reed strength you need. A too soft a reed only “rattles” and doesn’t produce a good sound. Use as hard reeds as you can, for sound and most of all, use your ears! It should sound like a nuclear power reactor, not like pushing a dining table across the floor. Use a lot of air in your cavity and absolutely no pressure with your jaws.
I usually keep my forearm in 45 degrees angle pointing up from the elbow. I keep my left hand in a “flute playing” position. Like this I don’t have any problems reaching all the keys with the pinky. Be sure that there is no bending or tweaking with your wrist but keep the forearm, wrist and hand in a straight line.
Alphie
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Author: Shorthand
Date: 2005-11-30 05:36
What does a nuclear reactor sound like? Are you referring specifically to a boiling water reactor (BWR) or a pressurized water reactor (PWR)?
A physics degree under my belt, and I still don't know.
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Author: archer1960
Date: 2005-11-30 12:24
Shorthand wrote:
> What does a nuclear reactor sound like? Are you referring
> specifically to a boiling water reactor (BWR) or a pressurized
> water reactor (PWR)?
I've never been around a BWR, but a PWR is silent except for the coolant pumps' humming. The steam plant can be incredibly loud, though, with the steam hissing through the pipes and all the rotating equipment it takes to run one.
(I"m a former Navy nuke, so I do have first-hand experience)
> A physics degree under my belt, and I still don't know.
Get out and operate one, instead of just studying the theory <G,D & R>.
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2005-11-30 14:57
The left hand, second to third "finger split" on the bassoon can take some getting used to for players accustomed to the "Boehm-ized" clarinet fingering system. I always have to get reacquainted with the hole positions for LH whenever I take up the faggot after a long absence, but it comes to me after two or three passages with flubbed notes scattered about.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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