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 Re: Blowing terminology
Author: Tony Pay 2017
Date:   2008-09-22 13:55

rdc wrote:

>> Rather than two separate things, what we think of as “support” could better be viewed as a subset of “blowing.” We could call it “effective blowing” or “excellent blowing.” >>

Just to start with, of course it doesn't really matter how we use words, provided we make it clear how we are using them. But there are advantages and disadvantages to any particular use, and though I agree that 'blowing with support' is a subset of blowing, and even agree that in the majority of cases 'blowing with support' is the best way to go about playing a particular passage, I continue to maintain (contra you in what you say in the remainder of your post) that in some simple sorts of playing there is no particular way in which blowing with support is 'excellent', or could be said to be 'effective', over blowing without support.

There would be no particular harm done if someone were to blow with support in ALL cases. I go on talking about the possibility of blowing without support because its existence seems to be difficult for some people to accept; furthermore, I find that the REASON that that they can't accept it is very often rooted in their misunderstanding of some of the basic concepts needed to understand support.

With respect, I would include you amongst those people, as I shall explain.

One of your first explanatory sentences shows where the trouble lies. You write:

>> The diaphragm (as is true of all muscles) can contract (or flex), bringing air into the lungs, or it can relax, expelling air from the lungs. >>

The first part of the sentence, about flexion of the diaphragm bringing air into the lungs is true; but the second part is misleading, if not wrong.

The reason that air is expelled from the lungs when we breathe normally is that in the absence of the action of the diaphragm (in its role as a muscle), the elasticity of our guts pushes back against the diaphragm (in its role as a membrane), and so it rises and expels the air. The force involved comes not from the relaxing of the diaphragm itself, but from the energy stored in the process of compressing the guts, and pushing out the abdominal and (perhaps) back muscles, that the diaphragm drives when we breathe in.

Consider what happens when we try to put more rubbish in the trashcan than it wants to hold. We push down on what's already in there, looking to create space for our extra rubbish -- and in fact that works to create space until we stop pushing -- but then it springs back up again, and we're no better off. It's the upward force occasioned by the release of energy stored in the compressed rubbish that defeats us.

People unschooled in elementary science often find the word 'force' difficult to use. It seems odd to them to talk of the FORCE exerted by a feather on a table, for example. Similarly, it seems odd to talk of the forces involved in something seemingly so UNFORCEFUL as our relaxed breathing out after a deep sigh. Nevertheless, that's the way the language of science works.

You write:

>> If [the diaphragm] remains contracted, no movement of air can take place.>>

This is another misconception about forces -- namely, that when they are operating, they cannot be overcome. But if you and I armwrestle, and you are stronger, then I can be exerting all the force I can muster as you bend my arm back to the table. (In passing, a better word than 'contracted' here is 'flexed' -- otherwise all you're saying is that if a muscle doesn't move, it doesn't move:-)

>> Air leaving the body implies that the diaphragm is moving (relaxing). >>

Again, no: that the diaphragm is moving doesn't mean that it is relaxed, as in the armwrestling example.

>> One can take a full breath and blow out all of the air very rapidly if no resistance is offered, that is, with mouth open and diaphragm relaxing as quickly as possible. >>

One of the important reasons why support is useful is that a muscle like the diaphragm can relax practically instantaneously, whereas it takes a little time to build up to its maximum force. So I would write rather:

"...that is, with mouth open and diaphragm RELAXED."

>> Attempting to do this while playing the clarinet is also possible, >>

Rather, "Doing this while playing the clarinet is also possible,"

>> ...but if the diaphragm is relaxing rapidly (offering no resistance), the only resistance to the abdominal push of the air would be that of the mouthpiece-reed set up.>>

Yes.

>> Tone can be sustained for only several seconds this way, until the air pressure drops when its speed can no longer be maintained.>>

This statement just isn't true. The sustainable length depends only on the dynamic involved and the precise details of the reed/mouthpiece setup. You do need to make sure that you're not letting more air through the reed/mouthpiece than you need, but that management has nothing to do with the diaphragm.

>> Blowing is pressurizing the air by the use of diaphragmatic resistance to the abdominal push.>>

No, blowing is pressurizing the air by the use of the abdominal push. Diaphragmatic resistance reduces the effect of a given abdominal push, but is a great help in its precise control.

Tony

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 Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-09-18 15:10 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
cigleris 2008-09-20 20:28 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Tony Pay 2008-09-21 19:37 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
rdc 2008-09-23 02:37 
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
mrn 2008-09-24 21:15 
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
sdr 2008-09-27 22:32 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Tony Pay 2008-09-28 06:08 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
davetrow 2008-09-28 00:13 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-09-28 16:40 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Mark Charette 2008-09-28 17:40 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
davetrow 2008-09-28 20:51 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Tony Pay 2008-09-28 22:16 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Tony Pay 2008-09-29 20:59 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-09-29 00:01 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Mark Charette 2008-09-29 01:40 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-09-29 02:24 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Mark Charette 2008-09-29 02:42 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Tony Pay 2008-09-29 20:37 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-09-29 21:08 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Mark Charette 2008-09-29 23:02 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
vin 2008-09-30 03:41 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Liquorice 2008-09-30 14:36 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
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 Re: Blowing terminology  new
cigleris 2008-09-30 18:16 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-10-01 14:41 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
cigleris 2008-10-01 16:09 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
mrn 2008-10-01 17:57 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-10-02 13:21 
 Re: Blowing terminology  new
Arnoldstang 2008-10-02 13:53 


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