 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: kchan ★2017
Date: 2023-02-19 03:26
Folks,
I don't recall having this issue in the past but I left a mouthpiece out on a shelf by my desk. No sunlight directly hit it but we have fluorescent fixtures at work. It was there for a good 6 months but now I notice it's discolored and the surface feels "tacky". I had a new mouthpiece in one of those plastic rectangle tubes in a mailer envelope and it too is a little tacky.
I don't care so much about the discoloration, but is the tackiness a sign that it's integrity is degrading? Just before I wrote this I did a quick rinse in a bath of dawn and now the tackiness is gone.
... a little sulfur smell.
How you store your equipment safe and sound?
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2023-02-19 07:41
kchan wrote:
> How you store your equipment safe and sound?
>
I have well over a dozen mouthpieces ranging in age from a few months to 30+ years in a wooden file cabinet drawer, most of them in whatever plastic container they were sold in. I've never taken one out of its container and felt a tacky sensation on it. Granted, they hadn't been exposed to light - they live in the drawer. I have some that are years old that are still the same black they were originally - no discoloration. So, except maybe (but I've never heard of it before) for the fluorescent lighting, I can't explain the changes.
What are the room temperature and humidity like generally? Is the tackiness oily or watery?
Karl
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Author: kchan ★2017
Date: 2023-02-19 10:55
I have window view in a climate control building that's supposed to be energy efficient climate controlled, so it's cool but not cold. I guess the it could have been exposed to the sun more than I'm aware.
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Author: sonicbang
Date: 2023-02-19 14:12
A thin layer of cork grease can prevent oxidation. It seals the mouthpiece from the air so the sulphur content won't react.
Mark
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Author: Michael E. Shultz
Date: 2023-02-19 15:42
Fluorescent lights do emit UV-A radiation, especially where there are flaws in the phosphor coating. Glass blocks UV-B and UV-C radiation. Polycarbonate blocks UV-A radiation. I used to demonstrate this at work by shining the 365 nm black light through the glass door of the incubator. The water samples would fluoresce, but when I put my polycarbonate glasses in front of the UV light, they would not fluoresce. UV light causes degradation of many materials. That's why art museums are careful about UV light exposure on the exhibits.
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read."
Groucho Marx
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2023-02-19 18:21
Michael E. Shultz wrote:
> Fluorescent lights do emit UV-A radiation, especially where
> there are flaws in the phosphor coating. Glass blocks UV-B and
> UV-C radiation. Polycarbonate blocks UV-A radiation. I used
> to demonstrate this at work by shining the 365 nm black light
> through the glass door of the incubator. The water samples
> would fluoresce, but when I put my polycarbonate glasses in
> front of the UV light, they would not fluoresce. UV light
> causes degradation of many materials. That's why art museums
> are careful about UV light exposure on the exhibits.
>
What would the connection be between fluorescent lighting and the release of the Sulphur content of hard rubber?
Karl
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Author: Michael E. Shultz
Date: 2023-02-20 15:37
The sulphur smell is due to the degradation of the hard rubber. UV light would increase the rate of degradation. Ozone and heat will also increase the rate of degradation.
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read."
Groucho Marx
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Author: Djudy
Date: 2023-02-21 16:43
Does "care" include buffing up the rails and tip ? I've just acquired a vintage Selmer C* for alto and there is a tiny nick on a rail and some skuffs. Do I just buff it up with some super fine polishing paper or does this kind of 'wear' require refacing ?
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2023-02-21 18:29
Djudy wrote:
> Does "care" include buffing up the rails and tip ? I've just
> acquired a vintage Selmer C* for alto and there is a tiny nick
> on a rail and some skuffs. Do I just buff it up with some super
> fine polishing paper or does this kind of 'wear' require
> refacing ?
>
Doing that *would be* refacing it. Even a small amount of buffing on one side or the other may significantly affect the way the facing works. If you suspect that the nicks and scuff are affecting the way the mouthpiece plays, it's better to have them (or any kind of rail damage, however slight) repaired by a skilled re-facer. Or, if the nick isn't causing squeaks or other problems, leave it alone.
A mouthpiece as well-worn as the one in your photo might do with having its facing "freshened" up a little - a light refacing to restore the original specs might improve the mouthpiece's overall response.
Karl
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Author: Djudy
Date: 2023-02-21 21:51
Thanks Karl, pretty much my take on this but not based on anything other than an overabundance of precaution. Sometimes I test my instincts for innovation but I'd rather have a lovely vintage mp in good working order. Only pbm is over here they are (mp refacers) scarce as hen's teeth.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2023-02-21 22:51
It is not regional. There are very few folks who KNOW how to work on mouthpieces. For my money ONE such person is Clark Fobes of San Francisco California. If you have Boehm mouthpiece issues you'd be well served to have him help with anything.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: kdk ★2017
Date: 2023-02-21 23:18
Djudy wrote:
> Only pbm is over here they
> are (mp refacers) scarce as hen's teeth.
>
Everywhere. Unless you're one of the lucky few who do have a skilled mouthpiece worker working nearby, you'll have to send it somewhere. Assuming "over here" is not in the U.S., there must be qualified mouthpiece techs scattered throughout GB and Europe.
As a young player I was rather spoiled to have "Matt" Matson living a half hour or so from me. I didn't know how rare his equal was until he wasn't here anymore.
Karl
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Author: Pokenerd
Date: 2023-02-23 04:57
What are some good containers to store mouthpieces in? I currently have my mouthpieces in a plastic container(like a pencil holder from preschool) by the window so I am slightly scared after reading this thread :(
Minjun
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2023-02-23 06:35
Hard rubber (vulcanized rubber) will fade exposed to light. So I store my ebonite pens safely in a dark drawer. My mouthpieces remain in the dark as well, just accidentally mind you because the closet was the best place to store my clarinet accessory draws.
.............Paul Aviles
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Author: Chris Sereque
Date: 2023-02-26 10:16
Years ago I had a funny conversation with Charles Bay about this. He got a call from a customer in Germany shortly after sending some mouthpieces over: he was told by the customer: “your mouthpieces schtink!”. Evidently mouthpieces outgas hydrogen sulfide (marsh gas) as they age, and if contained will “schtink”. Nothing to worry about!
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-02-26 13:59
Hard rubber is a material that can have a lot of weird issues with its chemistry it would seem . The lists of things that can affect it adversely seem to vary or be somehow inaccurate . I've taken to cleaning the Ridenour hard rubber periodically with light oil and with no adverse affect whatsoever, although it's not supposed to be an oil resistant material. I mentioned this cleaning method to Lesle Craven and he said " Oh yes! ... I use light oil too . " Hard rubber mouthpieces are clearly resistant to water and yet the hard rubber for Ridenour bodies turns chocolate brown almost instantly in contact with water and starts to soften .
We could do with a chemist on the forum to fully explain the varying characteristics of hard rubber and how best to look after it ..... I for one would
love to have a bit more insight into the whole matter which seems to fall largely into the arena of speculation in everything I've read to date .
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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Author: Michael E. Shultz
Date: 2023-02-26 15:22
We had a chemist, Dr. Lloyd Omar Henderson, who died March 15, 2021. He developed The Doctor's Products.
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read."
Groucho Marx
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Author: Djudy
Date: 2023-02-26 18:24
Chris, about those Charles Bay mps that "stink" : yes they do stink, like skunks !! And after they warm up after about 5 minnutes of play they become, to me at least, intolerable!! Simply toxic! This is really too bad because they are often very nice players, but concerning the ones I have, I have not yet found any way to block the stink to the point where they can be played. Thank goodnes I finally found a healthy one as I'm very fond of it, it goes very well on the RC Prestige.
Let me say that I have sadly also see interesting vintage Leblanc mps that stink, usually from having sat in a window of glass display case. Too bad ! If anyone have a miracle treatment to stop the degenerating hard rubber from stinking please let me know ! I haven't thrown them out but they are sealed tightly in a semarate drawer from the rest.
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Author: Julian ibiza
Date: 2023-02-27 00:34
Djudy,
Anything that smells is releasing molecules into the air . In the case of your hard rubber mouthpieces ,those are no doubt sulphur molecules which are used in the vocalizing process to form a molecular chain to bind the natural rubber's polymers together . Either there is a lot of surplus sulphur that's moving freely to the surface ,in which case it should get less smelly over time , or else the sulphur chains are gradually breaking down . Either way I think it points to poor vulcanizing, rather like my Ridenour bass where contact with water draws out the sulphur causing brown and tacky stains that do eventual fade away but leave watermarks . I don't know why some hard rubbers seem very stable and resistant while others do not .
Julian Griffiths
Tel. 34 696 798 853
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