 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: RogerD
Date: 2002-10-29 11:26
You may not believe this but it is true.
The other day I was in the Tallahassee, FL Superwalmart. As I was leaving I saw some large boxes on the wall with pictues of clarinets on them. Upon investigation, I discovered that walmart was selling clarinets (with reeds included!) for $249. Brand name (as I recall) "plus." They also had flutes and trumpets for the same price.
I wonder if anyone knows anything about the quality of these beginner instruments.
Will Buffet and Selmer come to Walmart next?
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-10-29 11:34
The few I've seen don't qualify as beginner instruments. Overpriced wall decorations would be a much more accurate description.
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Author: jenna
Date: 2002-10-29 12:37
Similar horns are popping up at BJ's and Sam's Club. Sam's Club being part of the Wal-Mart family may have something to do with that.
I got a laugh at the assembled samples at my local store. Both the flute and clarinet were put together wrong. I found some solace in the fact that they didn't seem to mess the trumpet up.
jenna
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2002-10-29 12:44
Someone bring me a box of tissues, this is awful.
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Author: Bob Arney
Date: 2002-10-29 12:53
They have managed to ruin many small towns, now they are starting on US!
Bob A
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Author: Ralph G
Date: 2002-10-29 13:08
How much are they without the reeds?
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Author: Dan Borlawsky
Date: 2002-10-29 13:19
Ralph, the reeds are probably the best component. Seriously, I teach beginning band, and have strongly advised my kids' parents AGAINST purchasing these ISO's (Instrument-Shaped Objects).
--Dan
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Author: Ed
Date: 2002-10-29 13:25
Be afraid, be very afraid!!!!!!!!!
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Author: David Kinder
Date: 2002-10-29 14:05
Were they in the hunting section to help you make duck noises?
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Author: David Spiegelthal
Date: 2002-10-29 14:13
Presumably, like nearly everything sold in "Buy American!" Wal-Mart, these alleged musical instruments are made in China. But why be afraid? The people that really care about clarinets will buy real instruments from real dealers. The people that buy clarinets at Wal-Mart will get what they deserve, and their poor innocent children will progress about as far as they probably would have anyway. Besides, does the world really need or want more clarinetists?
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Author: Bob
Date: 2002-10-29 14:47
They were in the automotive dept. at my Waalmaart and described as "Oilers"....
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2002-10-29 14:48
jenna, you truly have stimulated my brain. I cannot help wondering: how does one wrongly assemble a *trumpet*?
Why must a $249 Clarinet be a POJ (piece of junk)? Can't some manufacturer turn out some kind of Clarinet that would retail for $249 *and be worth it*? Yes, I know that Clarinets require a lot of hands-on labor to produce. But maybe some supplier could take a tip from the Lyons Clarinet (a sponsor of the BB) and make a similar molded instrument in Bb that snaps togehter. Maybe Lyons, eh? Why Not? Mr. Lyons, are you reading this? Why not make Bb instruments for beginners with hands big enough to handle them, so there could really be such a thing as an inexpensive, reliable Bb Clarinet? So we wouldn't have to cringe when some parent posts on the board, "I have just bought my (daughter/son/nephew/whoever) a beautiful new 'Pluto of Paris' Clarinet. The brochure says it has keys made of pure zinc. Can anyone tell me more about this fine instrument?"
"Look at that, Maude... that thing's all black, and it has shiny keys! Why, it looks the same as a Buffet! It must be really good. We oughta get one o' them for little Elmo!" Is that *really* the way people pick out Clarinets? Some manufacturers and sellers must think so.
Regards and grumbles,
John
just brimming with questions today
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Author: Hans
Date: 2002-10-29 15:07
And you save $401. Unfortunately it does not include a box of reeds!
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Author: Vic
Date: 2002-10-29 15:34
John, I rather think those who would actually purchase one of your "Pluto of Paris" instruments wouldn't associate Buffet with anything other than something having to do with food.
On the rare occasions I've actually visited my local Walmart, I've felt as if I've entered "Deliverance." Have never seen one of those fine clarinets, but I have heard the faint strumming of banjos and squealing of pigs. I guess it was pigs.
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Author: Curt at MusicMedic
Date: 2002-10-29 15:39
I bet with funding from a huge company like Wal-mart and the guarantee of large orders, a clarinet manufacturer could produce a decent instrument.
It would take a good deal of new tooling and a lot of research but with enough money thrown at the problem they might be able to do it.
Imagine if Wal-Mart set out to purchase low cost high quality student instruments (that's an oxymoron I know) and would not settle for junk. They may have to search a little and pay a little more but they, more than anyone, would be able to do it.
Once a few of the well-known manufacturers heard about what they were doing and how large the ordering quantities would be they might consider having a go at it.
The question is, would anyone have an open mind about buying a Clarinet from Wal-Mart.
Of course all this is based on the assumption that Wal-Mart would hire knowledgable people to do this sort of search, and that they would go against there well known traditoion of accepting low quality/cost for a higher return.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-10-29 15:46
You know, I've shopped at Wal-Mart more than a few times in my life, and I've nothing against the store - small towns being "ruined" notwithstanding. No reason to disparage the store per se ... but
A lot of parents have to buy or rent band instruments for their children, and are looking for lower-cost alternatives to the local (and oftentimes only) music store. Why couldn't Wal-Mart or some other major store link up with Leblanc or Selmer or Yamaha or Buffet and sell their low-end clarinets for $250 ... considering the quantity they'd order, everyone would still make a profit. I can buy a Yamaha keyboard at Wal-Mart - why not a clarinet?
Of course, the local music stores would suffer immensely, especially those selling & renting highly marked up beginner clarinets, and they'd have to lower their price and compete on a different level ... maybe even hire someone who knew something about instruments in general and have an instrument repair person on-premise rather than farming the work out to who-knows-who at who-knows-where. Considering that they'd lose their current underpaid help to Wal-Mart ... amybe they'd actually gain some business ...
Nah. A lot of those music stores are already in cahoots with the local school districts - or at least I think they are, after going to band nights and wondering why some of their competitors are never invited ...
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Author: Ed
Date: 2002-10-29 15:56
Unfortunately, many people don't know anything about instruments and buy based on cost. When I was young i didn't know anything either. The big problem is that they don't ask or don't know where to ask. Consumer reports doesn't review clarinets last I knew. They only go based on the fact that it looks like a clarinet, so it must be ok.
Many vendors, even music stores, sell junk and tell the customer it is great. A few years ago I had a student who wanted to buy a sax. I recommended that he look at the Selmer and Yamaha lines. He came back with a Vespro. He was told that it was just as good or better than those I suggested he look at. (Coincidentally, the store did not carry Selmer of Yamaha) Of course, the Chevy dealer will also tell you that the Hondas or whatever else you are considering are no good.
Hopefully, little by little, we as musicians may be able to steer some in the right direction. It is tough at the beginner level, where cost is an issue and many parents can pick up an off brand cheaply made instrument for less than the cost to rent a decent one.
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Author: anon
Date: 2002-10-29 16:05
Correction. It says the pads are US made. The clarinet is imported.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2002-10-29 16:36
"Your broken clarinet is still covered by our Wal-Mart warranty.
Just leave it here, and I'll call you when I fix it." ...GBK
<img src = "http://www.smurfit-stone.com/images/walmart.jpg">
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Author: Henry
Date: 2002-10-29 16:36
I would agree that it is probably junk but isn't there someone out there who has actually tried these horns before we judge too harshly?
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2002-10-29 16:51
The description says "semi-pressed felt pads." Sounds like those red things on the Chinese/Indian-made abominations. I'd say run, don't walk, in the opposite direction.
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Author: James
Date: 2002-10-29 17:34
Wow! you guys are great... if you ever need a laugh on a so so day.. come to the sneezy board
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Author: LL
Date: 2002-10-29 18:57
Oh my gosh.. I was seriously considering buying one for my cousin. Is it really that bad?
Thank you.
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Author: andreak
Date: 2002-10-29 19:25
Wow.... that WalMart photo actually shows 2 clarinets! I wonder if you get the one in the case and the assembled one. It DOES include easy assembly instructions......
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Author: Laurie
Date: 2002-10-29 19:32
How are clarients sold by like Macy's or JC Penny's ? I've seen the quite a few times in the catalogue beofre -
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Author: Kat
Date: 2002-10-29 19:35
I really like how on Walmart's website, they have the clarinet classified under "You are here: Home Page › Electronics › Portable Electronics › Musical Instruments." Who knew? Maybe these are already equipped with pickups... And I guess we already knew they were portable. Now if Walmart puts a Steinway Baby Grand under "Portable Electronics," we'll know something odd is up!
Katrina
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Author: george
Date: 2002-10-29 20:51
The clarinet is no doubt pretty bad, but the fact that Walmart sells it seems to be the only evidence anyone has that it's awful. Does a ten year old with no musical background just starting in the shool band program need something more expensive?
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-10-29 23:47
george wrote:
>
> Does a ten year old with no musical background just
> starting in the shool band program need something more
> expensive?
The chances are very good that the answer is "yes", but not all that much more expensive. Good <b>new</b> student clarinets, ones that have stood the test and are backed up by the manufacturer and music stores, not a general merchandise store, can be had for closer to $300 or so. Used but very servicable beginners clarinets can be had for around $200 or so.
The beginning student has more need of a rugged, relaible clarinet than someone with more experience; the beginner has no notion of what's good or bad or what can cause problems.
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Author: Willie
Date: 2002-10-29 23:54
Big corporate "General Merchandise" store like this are looking more at profit margin than anything else. If they could sell a name brand Vito for the same price, they would still most likely go with the Chineese horn as they will make more profit on each sale. If any of you do buy one of these, I suggest getting two. You probably can't get any spare parts for them anywhere.
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Author: spf
Date: 2002-10-30 03:40
OK,
But has anyone TRIED these clarinets?
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2002-10-30 07:06
This 275$ clarinet seems far worth buy in the sense that they know the meanings of barrel, polycyrindrical, 17 keys(They are gold plated!) etc.
http://www.dominicsmusic.com/productpages/prod_667.html
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-10-30 11:18
spf wrote:
>
> OK,
> But has anyone TRIED these clarinets?
Not this particular brand, but another available at a Wal-Mart last year looked like:
pot metal keys
uneven springs
pads not seating
roughly finished plastic
At that point it wasn't worth playing unless they has a music department that could fix 2-4. They didn't.
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2002-10-30 12:46
Having not seen these particular instruments, I cannot judge them, but if they are low-quality instruments, Wal-Mart is doing a great disservice to budding musicians and their parents. There is little that is more discouraging than an instrument that you have trouble getting to play. Many kids will give up music because they will assume that it's too hard or they don't have the required talent when the actual problem is that their instrument is poorly made. And, if a hard-to-play instrument does not discourage one from playing outright, it will certainly discourage one from practicing.
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Author: Lori
Date: 2002-10-30 13:05
As a band director in a poor area, when I first started I too thought that a beginner might be OK with a cheaper instrument, at least for awhile...hey, at least it works, right? The problem is, it doesn't! I had a kid come in with a (I think) De Villers clarinet. It cost about $250 new. It wasn't even made out of plastic- it was some weird material- it was really light compared to a plastic clarinet- and it cracked (yes, the upper joint cracked almost in half after about a month). We couldn't find a repairperson who was willing to go near it. He had to buy a new horn.
It's NOT worth it...
I can't judge the Walmart clarinets, but JC Penney had a booth set up one year at the Midwest Clinic, and I tried one...and I recall being amazed at how poor the construction was and how difficult it was to play. Imagine someone with no experience trying to get a decent sound!
My 2 cents...
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2002-10-30 16:21
No, I'm not one of their senior workers, but do shop there among other stores. I asked at ours, a "Super Store" in a fairly affluent community, the girls checked, NO, somewhat surprised! I suggested that they NOT stock them [for the above reasons], got a cool reception, doubt the locals have any influence anyway. Will check in OK City, maybe Tulsa and post. Don
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Author: Blake
Date: 2002-10-30 17:01
For $250 you can by a brand new B-12 Buffet from several of the retailers here on the board. I did. Use it for marching and as a backup the couple of times I had to put my old R-13 in the shop. Too bad parents won't take the time to shop around for a good horn. Blake
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2002-10-30 19:37
Blake wrote:
>
> Too bad parents won't take the time to
> shop around for a good horn. Blake
It's more complicated than that. All parents I know would shop around - if they knew that they needed to. All too often it's "band night" or nothing. I know that not so many years ago, as a parent, I knew absolutely nothing about band instruments. I never played in a school-sponsored band (I played guitar & bass in rock bands in HS). Heck, I was surprised I had to keep buying clarinet reeds and thought the world was at an end when my kid accidentally flattened a ligature by sitting on it ...
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Author: jenna
Date: 2002-10-30 20:13
John:
I'm not sure how the trumpet could be mixed up, but you know what they say - "anything is possible."
I saw the Sam's Club instruments assembled, but since they were in a case I couldn't actually handle them and check out the real conditions of pads, etc., let alone play on them. (For those of you who don't have a Sam's Club, it is very similar to a Pace, BJ's, or Costco, and is encompassed within the Wal-Mart company - at least when I last checked.)
I don't remember them looking very nice or well constructed, though. I suppose one could be surprised, but for some reason, judging my what I witnessed, I'm not thinking they are spectacular.
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Author: ~ jerry
Date: 2002-10-31 12:07
Ed said,
"When I was young i didn't know anything either."
Ed, the older I get, the more I find out that I don't know anything(most of the time it is something I should have known -- sort of like the guy in the commercial, timing is everything).
Ed also wrote,
"They only go based on the fact that it looks like a clarinet, so it must be ok."
Hey, if it looks like a clarinet and squeaks like a clarinet, it must be a clarinet.
The advertising says that it is easy to play.........I am going to grab my MP and head for Walmart.........I've been trying to learn to play my Buffet for more than a year, and it has not been easy!
And you guys stop knocking Walmart.........I may be working there as a "greeter" in another year or so (to supplement the SS check).
Ain't music fun?
~ jerry - still in clarinet boot camp.
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Author: Sandra F. H.
Date: 2002-11-01 00:27
[Snipped. I was hoping the Wal-Mart politics wouldn't infect this thread. I was wrong. Thread closed]
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Author: Henry
Date: 2002-11-01 00:52
[Snipped. Thread closed]
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Author: Ken
Date: 2002-11-01 01:34
[Snipped. Thread closed]
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Author: d dow
Date: 2002-11-01 11:22
[Snipped. I guess you had trouble reading. Thread closed.]
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Author: RogerD
Date: 2002-11-01 11:52
[Whether or not you started the thread, it is closed. I appreciate people following my instructions the few times I have to take over a thread.]
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Author: Ralph Katz
Date: 2002-11-01 16:25
[Snipped. Read the last couple of posts.]
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Author: katie
Date: 2002-11-03 00:25
don't trust anything from Wal-mart, thats such a cheap store!!!
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 2002-11-04 13:46
Sometimes I insert a wrong valve into a wrong valve casing.
I know it when I cannot blow the horn.
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Author: Avie
Date: 2003-07-23 14:19
Walmart is a discount store that sells merchandice for 30-40 percent or more discount on many popular brand names. Shouldnt we give the Walmart clarinets a fair trial as we do Buffet, Selmer, Yamaha, and others? Hurting the local music store business is not a good reason to condone it. It would be nice to hear the opinions of those who have tryed the Walmart instrument as to the reasons they are inferior to others.
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Author: William
Date: 2003-07-23 15:17
"Look at that, Maude... that thing's all black, and it has shiny keys! Why, it looks the same as a Buffet! It must be really good. We oughta get one o' them for little Elmo!" Is that *really* the way people pick out Clarinets? Some manufacturers and sellers must think so.
Unfortuntely, the manufacturers are thinking correctly. Most purchases by uniformed consumes are bases on cost rather than qulaity. Hopefully, current trends in required music education classes will help produce more knowledgable consumers in all areas of the music market place.
Why don't you see more music stores represented at "band night"?? My experiance as band director in a large metropolitan suburb many years ago, is that the different music vendors were already screened, before "band night", to select the one offering the best rental/purchase optitions for the parent, student and the school music program. In many of the smaller state school districts, there is usually only one music store serving the area and that is the one that is choosen. It might be argued that if more music vendors were in attendance at band night presentations, the competition for business would produce better prices for all--and that may very well be true. But the advantage of having only one music store (already choosen for it's competative bids) is that we, the school music program, can retain some control over the resulting instrumentation of the beginning ensemble and (hopefully) prevent having all the beginners sign up for percussion, sax, flute and trumpet.
I know this thread is closed (or trying to be), but just some thoughts that might be of interest to some.............
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Author: GBK
Date: 2003-07-23 16:09
[ Let's not have two concurrent threads running at once - Add any additional pertinent clarinet comments to the newer thread - GBK ]
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