 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2016-06-25 14:59
Hi all,
Wondering if anyone has tried this extremely difficult excerpt on the A clarinet and did it make it easier?
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2016-06-25 17:36
Yes, as long as you can get to the high D7 (or have the 2nd clarinet play that part of the run on the E-flat Clarinet).
I've also heard it is even easier (comparatively) on a C Clarinet.
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Author: donald
Date: 2016-06-25 18:01
Play the outer sections on the A clarinet, but do the middle bit (with the trills and the run up to the high note) on C clarinet... on C clarinet the run is only up to a B. It's possible to continue from the high B to the end of the solo on C clarinet, but the first section needs to be on Bflat or A as you need to play the low D concert before fig 19.
A part written out for A clarinet appears in "The Clarinet- May/June 1997"
dn
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Author: DAVE
Date: 2016-06-26 06:22
Outer sections on A and the middle on Bb. Here's a video of me doing this a few years back. It's not perfect and more sloppy than I'd like, but I had only been working on it for a few weeks. I messed up the end too. But I hit the scale up to C#. I think I put the fingerings in the comments.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCzFVuWXe8o
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Author: Simon Aldrich
Date: 2016-06-26 20:11
If you have access to a D clarinet, an option is to play on D clarinet the section that contains the run up to the high note. In my opinion this is the most satisfying solution for several reasons.
- There are 8 measures before and 8 measures after the high-run section, so switching clarinets is easy.
- The run starts on a low A on A clarinet. Therefore the run starts on a low E on D clarinet (and finishes an a high A). You can't do the whole run on an Eb clarinet unless your Eb clarinet has a low Eb.
- The end of the run is more electrifying (and usually cleaner) on a piccolo clarinet.
- If you play the run on D clarinet you will not kill your lip practicing the run on Bb or A clarinet prior to the concert.
- On a soprano clarinet, the run up will always be iffy. A lot depends on your reed, the amount of muscle-memory practice you did, the amount of caffeine ingested on the day of the concert, etc. Life is too short to let a single run ruin a few months of your life.
Another thought that older clarinetists will understand; a few decades ago most players used mpcs that featured mostly shallow baffles and thin rails (Kaspar, Selmer, Vandoren, etc); the kind of mouthpiece that produces high overtones and high notes more easily. Today, a lot of good mouthpieces have deeper baffles (Zinner blank mpcs) and many have thicker rails, qualities not conducive to getting out ultra-high notes.
A few decades ago, playing this excerpt was not a big problem. One fingered the high notes and they just came out. With today's warmer, darker mouthpiece, playing this excerpt is less straightforward.
When I play contemporary concerti that have a lot of ultra-high notes, I use a mouthpiece that "gives up" those notes more easily, either a Kaspar or an M15. The sound of these particular mpcs does not have the breadth or warmth to use in orchestra, but they make life a lot more bearable when playing contemporary concerti.
Simon
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2016-06-27 03:15
I am often amused by how easily some young clarinetists are able to toss off this much labored and feared passage. For example, the young lady in this JONDE Youth Orchestra seems to be having no more trouble getting through it than she would sipping lemonade at a picnic. And she appears to be using just one clarinet (a Patricola?) throughout.
Oh, and yes, I am among those who do labor over and fear the passage.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Ginastera+Variaciones+Concertantes+Estelles+JONDE.
Post Edited (2016-06-27 03:16)
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Author: JHowell
Date: 2016-06-27 09:58
A clarinet. With the right fingering, the D is quite possible. Or, take the run on e flat and leave out the first note. Marcellus took the second half of the run down and octave.
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Author: blueclarinet
Date: 2016-06-29 01:29
If you can locate a D clarinet, it would be ideal for the middle section. I used the A clarinet for the outer sections, and C clarinet for the middle one.
Correction: AAARGH! I meant the middle section, which dips low, could be played on the A clarinet, and the outer sections on D.
William C Sereque
Post Edited (2016-06-29 02:24)
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Author: grenadilla428
Date: 2016-06-29 05:42
So here's a follow-up to Morrigan's question:
How would you handle this in an audition?
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Author: donald
Date: 2016-06-29 15:53
I'm a bit confused by the post above from William Sereque- I'm looking at the music now, and the "middle section" is quite playable on the C clarinet, however 2 bars before figure 19 (in the "first section") there is a low D concert (an F on the A clarinet, E in the original B flat clarinet part) that would be unplayable on the the C clarinet.
I do recall the former principal of the NZSO (now playing in Sydney) showing me his super special method/fingerings for doing the run up to the high D on the A clarinet. I should have written this down somewhere as I can no longer remember the details, but HE was able to do it 10/10 which I suppose confirms the opinion given above by JHowell.
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Author: Bob Barnhart ★2017
Date: 2016-06-30 03:31
Out of curiosity, I searched the web for the clarinet part to the Ginastera and found this dissertation by Thomas James Kmiecik:
http://digitalscholarship.unlv.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2294&context=thesesdissertations
In it, he discusses a number of issues in the composition and performance of the work and includes the complete clarinet part in Bb, A, Bb+C, and the middle part for D clarinet (with PART of it for Eb).
After looking at these transcriptions, I think I would probably rather play it on Bb+C or A+C, mostly because a good C clarinet (e.g., Ridenour) is probably easier to acquire and a D clarinet.
Bob Barnhart
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Author: Tom Kmiecik
Date: 2016-07-02 16:06
I'm always glad to see when someone finds the dissertation helpful! I feel like I know more about this piece than any one person should...
It's not mentioned anywhere in the dissertation since I was sticking with outside sources, but I played it on A clarinet. There are some great D fingering choices in Opperman's "The New Extended Working Range for Clarinet."
Tom Kmiecik
Artist Relations, D'Addario Woodwinds
tkmiecik@daddario.com
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2016-07-02 18:20
I think most players do it on the A today and learn a fingering for the high D. When I played it at EMF many years ago I didn't think about doing it on the A so i played it on Bb. Since I played Eb, I had my second players begin the one run and I finished it on the Eb and had time to switch back to Bb for the rest of it. It would make more sense to have the second player do the high part on Eb if they play Eb. When I learned years later that many people did it on the A I gave my students the part for both. Probably because I learned it on Bb I found it easier to do it that way but never had to oppertunity to play the part again anyway.
ESP eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2016-07-05 12:49
Thanks to everyone who has commented! I tried all the combinations listed above and I can confirm that playing it all on the A clarinet is, indeed, the easiest option. By far!
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2016-07-06 18:11
And now the follow up question:
Does anyone have any fingering suggestions to get fluidly through the scale all the way to the top? On my instrument, the top D comes out quite easily with no fingering at all, just open. It's the G, A, Bb and C that concerns me.
Cheers guys!
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Author: grenadilla428
Date: 2016-07-06 20:21
Finally got the time to sit down and read the dissertation.
Nice job, Tom! Thanks for the insight on this piece (and for making me feel a bit better for struggling with this excerpt! It's nice to hear that it really is difficult for everyone else, too.) ;-)
And thanks so much for including parts in the appendix - looking forward to experimenting with these alterations.
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