 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Franklin Liao
Date: 2012-04-12 04:51
So, Backun Musical is finally about to let the cat out of the bag:
http://backunmusical.com/product/protege-b-flat-grenadilla-clarinet/
http://backunmusical.com/product/protege-b-flat-cocobolo-clarinet/
I find it interesting that Backun Musical hasn't put forth the A version of these horns out, although it may be true that only serious orchestral type would apply.
I've not expected this line of instruments to boast gold plating as per CSGH, especially not on something that 'boasts' the aim to be that of amateurs/intermediate range. Doing this would mean that it would directly target the 1st time R13 buyers...
As the $1000-$1500 is addressed by Antigua Backun, and the quality plus the added expense of the keyworks, we can expect this to be of a higher grade offering. E11, high-end Bliss, YCL-450 would not be what the Protégé compete against, so I think.
At the range of $1500-$2000, we see some competition, where YCL-650, Cadenza, top-end Amati, E13 or customized E11 may sit. Something like this may be impacted by the presence of this instrument... maybe the silver plated Grenadilla Protégé would be at the high end of this bracket.
If the price is right inbetween the E11 and R13, say around $2000-$2500, we'll have an instrument that may have no real peer in the price range. This may be the sweet spot... A mark of $2500-$3000 range would put it at the YCL-CSG/SEV point.
This layperson feels that $2500-$3000 is a point where there's room for real disruption, where there's real leeway to shake people from R13 and E13/E11. If Morrie decides to really brew a storm in the tiny Clarinet teacup, to the tune of $1800-$2400, many buyers will be thrown overboard...
Although, to be frank, this line can easily be priced on par to that of the R13, or the Patricola CL2s and above. Be fun to know how things turn out...
(2 cents, what do I know, etc...)
Post Edited (2012-04-12 04:59)
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Author: ttay1122
Date: 2012-04-12 09:50
Very interesting. It will be interesting to see where these are in the price range. I read a comment from Backun's YouTube that this is aimed as a competition with the R13, and I admit I laughed a little when the labeled the R13 as an intermediate instrument.
Here are the comments:
User commented: My teacher told me that you guys would make a $3000 clarinet equal to the R-13 is that true?
To which Backun Musical replied: Thanks for the comment. We are indeed working on an intermediate Clarinet, though no price-point or delivery date has yet been scheduled. We will be updating our social media and website pages once more information is available. If you're interested in this Clarinet, contact us to have your name put on a list for more information. Best, BMS
These instruments do look very fine, and it will be interesting to see how well they play (assuming that day will come)
I wonder why this clarinet does not have the in-line trill keys that many claim is an advantage. I think it would also be nice if Backun would allow an upgraded barrel for maybe a little more.
I'm also wondering where this compares to the grenadilla Bliss, although I have a feeling that the Bliss will soon be advertised as a Student-level horn, whether in composite or grenadilla, like the relationship between the Buffet B12 and E11.
We will see what happens in the future with this new clarinet from Backun. Just my thoughts.
Taylor.
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Author: Franklin Liao
Date: 2012-04-12 10:19
@Taylor:
A few things come to mind:
1. Bliss is now the sole responsibility of Leblanc, as Backun Musical is now a dealer for Buffet. This means that there is no sacred cow on either end to leave Bliss alone.
2. It wouldn't be surprising if Backun does allow for leeway mix and match for the Protégé, although that depends on the distribution model for the instruments.
3. If these are meant to break into other markets, then it would be essential to set some them in Long & McQuade and other big box stores... I don't usually see gold plated instruments being shelf-darlings save for Howarth's or Ishimori, so these might be in-shop direct order fare initially... we'll have to wait and see.
4. I wonder if we should expect this as the follow-up on to the Backun Cadenza... reason being why I am hesitant to call it a Symphonie replacement would be in the fact that the bell and the barrel are Protégé branded, and the fact that the instruments lack the adjustment screws.... it's just impossible to speculate further.
Post Edited (2012-04-12 10:22)
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2012-04-12 16:55
According from sources form my repair place it's the same wood Protege uses in the Tocsa. The price difference is due to the extra key and the heavier material on the keys. The wood is selected to be a shade above the r-13 wood. Most pros still like the R13's and think the Tosca is a bit costly although the sound seems just a bit warmer. I've played it and liked it a lot to the point I'm probaby looking at buying one within a week or 2. The only other difference is the cut of the bores. It's a different drilling for better tuning.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
Post Edited (2012-04-12 16:59)
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Author: The Watcher
Date: 2012-04-27 08:42
I recently asked my teacher about Backun Clarinets. She told me "although he is a very nice man his products have a tendancy to crack and never play as well after repair". I am now looking at Yamaha as an option to Buffet.
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Author: SamuelChan
Date: 2012-04-27 10:31
All wooden instruments have the tendency to crack, not just certain ones. It's a matter of caring for the clarinets!
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2012-04-27 15:18
I have not had ANY of my Backun products crack. They are well made, and with proper care, will hold up as well as any other clarinets. It sounds like your instructor has an axe to grind.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: Joe Bloke
Date: 2012-04-27 15:29
What I don't get is why Backun is now selling Buffet products on his website. Could it be: if you can't beat them, join them.
No question the guy (Backun) is King when it comes to design, innovation and all things technical. But, it seems there's a identity crisis in his business model. In just the last couple of years we've had: Backun/Leblanc, Backun/Antigua and now Backun/Backun. Don't want any of those? How about a Buffet?
With that kind of scatter confronting the consumer, the real instrument King is likely to remain the R13.
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Author: Morrie Backun
Date: 2012-04-27 16:26
Hello Everyone and thanks for the comments. Just a few points to try and offer some clarity.
THE WATCHER- I do not know who your teacher is - or their experience with Backun products but I would be happy to discuss it with you.
Samuel - You are right that all makers using wood have cracking to deal with as a reality. Ironically, I often find that well repaired instruments often play better after cracking as internal stresses are relieved.
Joe Bloke - I don't think there should be much confusion. Our shop works with players all over the world. For Buffet players, we offer new instruments set up to our high standards as well as repair and customizing services. I have great respect for the work Buffet does and regularly work with Buffet artists and players.
I have done design and consulting work for different companies over the years, to try and create high quality and affordable instruments. This work spans many years and as some work is completed, others work begins. In many cases this work involves helping companies refine their designs and manufacturing processes.
The Backun Clarinets made at our shop in Vancouver are very high quality instruments. Since they start at 7500 dollars (US) and delivery is currently about a year due to the large volume of existing orders, we have also started building the more affordable Protege, which is our own unique design at a very affordable price and available through the Backun dealer/distribution network. This instrument is in the 2000 dollar price range.
I always try to encourage players of all levels to try many makes and models of instruments to find what is right for them. The world of Clarinets has many choices available and there is excellent work being done by many companies. If you are visiting Vancouver we will be pleased to give you a tour of our facilities and show you what we do.
Since I do not want this to become a "commercial message" please feel free to contact me "off list" with any questions...Thanks and may all your reeds be superb.
Morrie Backun
morrie@backunmusical.comJoe Bloke wrote:
Morrie Backun
Backun Musical Services
604-205-5770
morrie@backunmusical.com
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Author: Joe Bloke
Date: 2012-04-27 19:06
@Morrie Backun
Thank you so much for taking the time to help us better understand your efforts.
I've often wondered if we -- most clarinet players at all levels -- really understand what we're witnessing and experiencing with your work. Are we seeing the most important instrument innovations and creations in generations? In my humble opinion, the answer is unequivocally: YES!
So, thanks again for your post and what you do.
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