 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: missclarinetist
Date: 2005-07-01 16:52
I'm currently using a Vandoren 5RV lyre 13 Profile 88 with the new Vandoren leather lig . Just wondering if any of you are using the same setup as I'm using. Which brand of reed do you prefer? I have been using Vandoren for the past nine years but I fine the sound of Rico Royal reeds clearer then Vandoren whenever I speed tounge. I don't know the reason why I find it easier for me to tounge fast passages on Rico Royal reeds then Vandoren. I've been using Vandoren for years and I'm not too keen on switching to another brand of reeds. I have tried different strengths starting with size 3 1/2-4 reeds on the traditional, V12 and rue lepic reeds. What strength would you recommend that I stick with? I'm the sort that like harder reeds and find that 3 1/2s are too soft after I practiced on it for awhile. If I went on to size 4 reeds, I'll have a hard time tounging on fast passages. My partner in the college orchestra tells me I'm always playing flat. How can I tell if I'm playing flat and how do I correct the problem? Is a Bb Buffet E-11 suitable for undergrad students or should I think of switching to the R-13s?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Richard Ashmore
Date: 2005-07-01 18:21
My wife uses the method of Ridenour, found at http://www.ridenourclarinetproducts.com/tuningBb.htm
for tuning her clarinet. Get an electronic chromatic tuner, they're inexpensive and accurate.
I am a banjo player and have now exhausted my knowledge of clarinet tuning.
Richard
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: pewd
Date: 2005-07-01 19:01
how long is you barrel, E11's in the US have 64.5mm barrels. One I saw recently measured just UNDER 64mm - quite sharp. How long is yours?
does your orchestra tune to 440 or 442? if you tune to 442, a 13 series mouthpiece might be a bit flat. borrow a 5RV-Lyre (not the 13 series) from a music store and compare it with a tuner.
get a tuner http://www.wwbw.com/Intelli-IMT202-i114494.music
tuner and metronome on your stand while you practice - always.
practice long tones with the tuner - learn to play in tune. firm up your embouchure to bring the pitch up. check pitch on both the vandoren and rico reeds. I cant stand rico's fwiw. compare with different reeds - using a tuner.
imnsho, better high school level players need a pro horn in most cases, and college students certainly do. E'11s are student models.
what does your private teacher recommend?
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: missclarinetist
Date: 2005-07-01 20:31
My current teacher is Wayne Fritchie and did his undergrad studies at Julliard. When I first brought my E-11 to college, he didn't mention anything about me having to switch to pro. I just bought this E-11 a couple years ago. Aren't E-11's considered intermediate models? I go to a private college in Florida and so my college orchestra tunes to the American A440. I didn't know that E-11's tune to A442. Thanks for the information. Now I know why my fellow partner complains I'm always going flat.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: stevensfo
Date: 2005-07-01 21:37
>>Aren't E-11's considered intermediate models?
No. From what I remember reading from the Buffet website years ago, the E11 is simply the wooden version of the B12, ie a student instrument. There are many people, particularly in Europe, who cannot imagine ever playing on a plastic horn. The Buffet company, like all companies, know this and have well paid marketing experts who calculate the cost/sales ratio and pass this on to the advertising dept.
As we all know, advertisers can sell anything.
The true Buffet intermediate model is the E13.
The professional instruments start with the basic R13.
However, other posts have pointed out that the whole question of beginner/interm./prof. is open to question. The plastic B12s are good horns and no doubt an experienced player will make one sound like a professional horn.
Have I got that right?
Steve
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BobD
Date: 2005-07-01 21:52
Your opinions are stated with much conviction. I've owned and played both E11 and B12 Buffet horns and do not agree that the E11 is a wood equivalent of the B12. I got rid of my B12 as I considered it a beginner level instrument. It was light weight which would probably be an advantage to a beginner. I would consider the E11 an Intermediate horn for anyone who couldn't afford an R13 new or used and who felt that a wood horn was superior to a non-wood horn. My guess would be that most college level clarinet teachers would consider anything below an R13 level horn indicative of a student who was not really serious about clarinet.
These are strictly my opinions, as usual.
Bob Draznik
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: stevensfo
Date: 2005-07-01 22:38
>>These are strictly my opinions, as usual.
Which I appreciate and value very, very much, as you know.
I don't speak with conviction. That's the problem. I only say what I've read over the years. The whole question of beg/int/prof will be discussed till the sun burns out.
The only new clarinets you can buy here are B12s and E10s. I won't tell you how much they cost. You wouldn't believe me!
Take care,
Steve
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2005-07-02 03:57
Sarah,
Buffet actually refers to the E11, E12 and E13 as "student" models (check their website). Of course the E11 is heavier than the B12. It's made out of very dense wood. But check the keywork and the bore and you'll see that, aside from the material they're made from, the B12 and E11 are quite similar in design. That said, IMO the E11 is a very good student model and can take you a long way. For college students who play in the pep band or other college ensembles for fun and take lessons for self-improvement, an E11 may very well be all the clarinet they will ever need ("want" is another matter ). I know many adult amateurs who do just fine with an E11. Also pro sax players who use an E11 for doubling.
Most students who are preparing for careers as professional clarinetists (or who see themselves as serious amateurs) eventually reach a point where a professional instrument makes sense. If you are such a student, you may not have reached that point yet. I suspect that, if your teacher thought your clarinet was holding you back, he would recommend a change.
The fact that the E11 is set to play at A = 442 does not explain why your section partner perceives you as playing flat. All other things equal, an E11 would actually tend to make you play sharp. I wonder how good your partner's ear is. Maybe s/he is sharp or can't tell the difference. How do you feel about your intonation? What does your conductor say about it? Your teacher? Other members of the orchestra? What do you see when you play with a tuner? Before I rushed off to try to correct a problem, frankly, I would want to be sure there was a problem in the first place.
I've never particulary liked Vandoren mouthpieces (just my personal experience, YMMV) so I can't help you there. The range of reed strengths you are using sounds reasonable, though. If you haven't already, try taping yourself. You will get a more accurate assessment of how you actually sound than what you hear (or, perhaps better, "feel") when you are playing
Best regards,
jnk
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: pewd
Date: 2005-07-02 05:22
an e11 with a stock barrel and a 5rv makes many students with developed embouchures quite sharp - thus the 'get a tuner' suggestion, and measure the length of your barrel.
use the tuner to determine if you are in fact flat.
have it on when your oboe tunes the orchestra - are you getting an A at 440, 442, or something else?
are you sure the other clarinet player has a good ear? maybe he's the one out of tune - get a tuner.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
Post Edited (2005-07-02 05:32)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarinetmaniac101
Date: 2005-07-02 15:49
so lets talk mouthpiece and reed,
you know that the vandoren reeds compared to the rico royals are like this
1.a vandoren 2/5 reed is like a 3/5 reed
2. a vandoren 3 is like a 4 on the rico royal
3.and a 3/5 vandoren reed is like a 4/5 rico royal reed.
That is how I can put it for you. Now mouthpieces(I play a Vandoren M15, with an inverted gold plated cut out ligature)
now what cut out means is that there is less contact with the reed to create the ultimate vibration, so you won't have trouble with response of the clarinet, it is always important to have the ligature not touch the reed on the side of it almost not touch it at all but all that comes to the taste of the player. Now speed tounging vandoren reeds are known to be stiff even when you break them in they are still kind of stiff, so I have a reed shaver to take some of the wood off of the reed and make it alittle less stiff, even my teacher still dose that so you won't be alone.My teacher can speed tounge on a vandoren reed, so all you need to do is just get a reed shaver and shave some wood off I makes a whole lot of a difference. mouthpieces(go to vandoren.com and those mouthpiece has suggested vandoren reeds to go with those mouth pieces) but continue to try other mouthpieces you might like hand made ones well eveybodys love those kind, so I hope that was helpful. GOOD LUCK IN SEARCHING.
Rashad
*clarinet
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: GBK
Date: 2005-07-02 19:16
clarinetmaniac101 wrote:
> it is always important
> to have the ligature not touch the reed on the side of it
> almost not touch it at all
![[huh]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie11.gif)
> Now speed tounging vandoren reeds are known to be
> stiff even when you break them in they are still kind of stiff,
It is amazing how much misinformation is written as fact ...GBK
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-07-02 19:34
If you are trying the Rico Royal Reeds then you should really try the Rico Grand Concert Thick Blank or their Evolution Reed.
Superior cut to the Royal reeds and better cane too. I'm an artist for it so I am biased, but I became an artist due to me liking them so much. Initially I wouldn't try them on a bet as wouldn't want to have anything to do with a Rico product, but Marcus Ely (Curtis grad and was instrumental in their development) who was at the Belgium Clar Fest back in 1993 dragged me into a room to try them and I haven't looked back since.
They are very good and need minimum work if any.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: MikeH
Date: 2005-07-02 22:11
All of the above suggestions sound useful but one possibility has been overlooked and that is the pitch of her mpc; they are made at different pitch levels and she might have one at 440 where the her playing partner has one a 441-442 which would not be unusual. I think that this is a possibility, someone correct me if I am wrong. I happened to notice that Clark Fobes makes his mpc at 441 442 because he says that playing at 440 is unusual in this country.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
