 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Robert Moody
Date: 2005-03-16 23:22
Okay I recently contacted a former teacher after a number of years. We got along okay as student and teacher, but I was always attracted to her in a physical sense as well. Black hair, blue eyes...simply a beautiful woman in many respects physical and talent-wise.
Any of you ever had a crush on a former CLARINET teacher?
["Don't ask, don't tell" applies here. Sorry...not into that.![[cool]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/cool.gif) ]
Robert Moody
http://www.musix4me.com
Free Clarinet Lessons and Digital Library!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-16 23:41
Hahahaha... That would be hilarious. My clarinet teacher posts on this Bboard! ^_^ I would think this would be for people that are closer in age to their clarinet teachers.
Love is such a wonderful thing ^_^ haha... If you think ya like her, although she is your teacher, I think it was a good idea to go for it. Although that would be a bit awkward, of course, you no longer take lessons from her... Hence the word "former"... Hehe, I just found this amusing.
I haven't ever had a crush on a clarinet teacher, however a science teacher I once was fond of.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: mkybrain
Date: 2005-03-17 00:20
hell no
|
|
|
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-17 00:21
I hear stories...older, male clarinet teachers...young college girls...impressionable musicians
I cant say I am attracted to mine (current), since she's a female, but she is pretty.
sorry, no good stories from me!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 00:35
Sometimes, since people lack ethics and morals nowadays, if a girl that was in college/high school was attracted to her clarinet teacher, I would think it would be best not to tell him... Dunno why, just doesn't seem right... Like you hear stories about some teachers who leave their wives for younger girls in high school/college... Not unheard of... Not sure how often it happens though... Dunno, just a thought that came to my head.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: hartt
Date: 2005-03-17 00:39
Robert Robert
Hmmmmmmmmm......attracted / crush on ????
I don't think soooooooooooooooooo
Greg Raffa
Leon Russianoff
Gene Zorro
Kalman Opperman
Peter Hadcock
John Denman
regards
dennis
ps..........now maybe if Michele Z ![[grin]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie5.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2005-03-17 00:41
psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't ask) wrote:
> Like you hear
> stories about some teachers who leave their wives for younger
> girls in high school/college.
or husbands for younger men. Happens both ways.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 00:42
I've actually had the conversation with Michele Z. about that.
But I can't tell you anything which was said (nothing bad though)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 00:44
>or husbands for younger men. Happens both ways.
yeah... true... disturbing, in my opinion.
Post Edited (2005-03-17 00:45)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 01:08
I think it should never be tolerated - It's a clear abuse of power.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-17 01:13
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> I think it should never be tolerated - It's a clear abuse of
> power.
yes, I agree
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Anon
Date: 2005-03-17 01:17
Yuck.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: hans
Date: 2005-03-17 02:22
I've never had a female clarinet teacher, but I had a great crush on my grade one teacher about 55 years ago.
I Agree with David Blumberg re abuse of power, at least until the student-teacher arrangement is ended.
Hans
|
|
|
|
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-03-17 02:30
Never had a clarinet teacher.
But I always go with the philosophy (in college at least), that if I'm required to take certain classes anyway, may as well try to get an attractive teacher. More motivation to show up for class.
So given a choice between a few clarinet teachers, I would definitely pick the more attractive one.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Contra
Date: 2005-03-17 02:30
I never had a clarinet teacher.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: dummer musiker
Date: 2005-03-17 02:33
I was at one point attracted to my high school band teacher...but nothing ever became of it... Just always looked forward to band, and got extra practice time in by going down to the band room a lot more often...haha.
"There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life: music and cats."
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-17 02:41
I took oboe lessons when I was about 17 years old and although I loved playing oboe, I had to quit. I could not concentrate on the oboe because of my unbelievably beautiful 30 year old oboe teacher. Another black haired, blue eyed wonder. I was transfixed and realized that I was going to oboe lessons just to experience her. I was horrible at the oboe and now can imagine what frustration I must of caused for her. I think teachers just should not respond to any "crushes" that any students have. If they do, they should at least stop teaching the instrument to the student and just go for the romance. Romance and any type of lessons do not mix. There is too much one sided power.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 02:44
I agree that there should be no romance as long as it's still a student teacher relationship, but building a friendship with your teacher could also be good...
|
|
|
|
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-03-17 02:45
Dano wrote:
> I think
> teachers just should not respond to any "crushes" that any
> students have. If they do, they should at least stop teaching
> the instrument to the student and just go for the romance.
> Romance and any type of lessons do not mix. There is too much
> one sided power.
>
Or up it to two lessons a week for some extra cash . . . . . !!!![[whoa]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie10.gif)
But then, something like that has gotta be borderline illegal in every state except for some parts of Nevada - (couldn't just come RIGHT out with the joke due to censorship, but that's ok. I'll work within the bounds)
US Army Japan Band
Post Edited (2005-03-17 02:47)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-17 02:46
I was attracted to a violinist in our orchestra.
I eventually married her...GBK
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 02:48
>I was attracted to a violinist in our orchestra.
>I eventually married her...GBK
^_^ Such a wonderful love story... I almost want to cry... ^_^
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 02:54
My Piano teacher in College quit studying with his teacher as the teacher had made advances on him.
He was one of 5 students that the teacher ever taught.
The teacher?
Vladimir Horowitz
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 03:01
---------------------
> I think
> teachers just should not respond to any "crushes" that any
> students have. If they do, they should at least stop teaching
> the instrument to the student and just go for the romance.
> Romance and any type of lessons do not mix. There is too much
> one sided power.
-----------------------
Psychologically speaking, it is wrong. The Romance shouldn't occur as the teacher/student relationship can easily be abused (if that happens, it was!).
There's a name for the "syndrome" which I don't remember as I'm not a Psychologist, but it is what happens when a patient falls for a therapist. They aren't really falling for the person as a person, it's the power situation that the person is attracted to and mistakes it for romantic feelings.
I have no respect for Teachers who go after their Students (current or not) - and when Gigliotti did that, I lost respect for him. He was quite a "player" for a while back then and I saw it first hand.
I don't think it's right.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: ffrr
Date: 2005-03-17 03:15
I had a sax teacher. I am male and in my 40's, she was female and about 20 - I think. She was very cute, but I never considered any 'romance', and I'm sure she wouldn't either.
Nevertheless, I was aware of her youth and looks, so I just had to tell myself to be on best behaviour.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: diz
Date: 2005-03-17 03:27
Saying yes to this would put me in a compromising position ... so I'll pass.
thanks
Without music, the world would be grey, very grey.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 03:28
>Nevertheless, I was aware of her youth and looks, so I just had to tell >myself to be on best behaviour.
Wise thinking.... Because us female clarinet players don't take any crap from you male clarinet players...
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-17 03:39
While I agree that most teachers should shun any advances, I think that teacher-student relationships are sacred only if the student is a minor. I believe that adults can make up their minds when and with whom to have a relationship as long as they both agree. Being attracted to your psychologist is quite different than being attracted to your clarinet teacher. Psychs, police, Doctors, Attys, Govt. officials and religious leaders have a proffesional standard that should cause them to "loose face" within the community and their peers, but not a clarinet teacher. Life is short and to miss out on a conection with someone is wrong. The reasons people may be attracted to their teachers are the same reasons people are attracted to anyone. Some of us like weaker people and some of us like people in power. I don't think there is a proper way to be attracted to someone. People have had 60 year relationships based on that "syndrome" that I also can't seem to remember the name of.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 03:45
----------
Psychs, police, Doctors, Attys, Govt. officials and religious leaders have a proffesional standard that should cause them to "loose face" within the community and their peers, but not a clarinet teacher.
---------
I see no difference - It's a power situation, just like all the others.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-17 05:24
David, So you see no difference in a clarinet teacher-student relationship and a psychiatrist-patient relationship? The difference is the level of power. The afformentioned have power over peoples lives. A clarinet teacher has power over what? We all love music but we all know "it's just music". You can hardly compare the power of a clarinet teacher to that of a Doctor. Black and white makes for great photographs but not for such a great life.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: jez
Date: 2005-03-17 11:27
I'm married to an ex-student, so I ought to get her to answer this.
jez
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 11:52
Dano, maybe you aren't a Clarinet teacher. We are one of the very, very few people in a student's life who work one on one with them.
The power is there. And we often ARE the psychologists for our students......
So in my opinion "Book em Dano"
Post Edited (2005-03-17 11:54)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: RAMman
Date: 2005-03-17 12:27
Can I point out there is a VERY respected clarinettist who married their music teacher?
|
|
|
|
|
Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2005-03-17 14:20
The problem with these ethically hazy situations is that they are seldom "black and white".
Sure, when the power differential between two people is great, there is the potential for abuse. And the burden is on the *more* powerful partner to keep the boundaries clean. This is especially true when it comes to relationships of adults with underage people, some of whom have their own ways of wielding power (flattery, flirtatiousness, and so forth). My general advice to a teacher tempted towards such a relationship would be a resounding, "No! No! No! No! No! No! No!".
But . . . among adults, sometimes you just play it where it lays, so to speak. My husband's 84-year-old cousin just lost his wife of more than 60 years. She was 94. They met as student and teacher -- he, the student, a young tenor vocalist and organist; she, the teacher, a more mature soprano. They were devoted to each other, and had a long moral and fruitful partnership.
There is also the story of a high school classmate of mine, who married our band director. They met when she was a sophomore in high school, and it was clear to all of us that they had a special bond, in a way that may have been innocent, but today would probably have gotten him kicked out of his job (with her spending lots of time in his office, him giving her rides home from school, etc.). To their credit, they kept it cool until she had graduated and gone to college.
Come to think of it, my late first husband had actually been my doctor. After I was ready to be discharged as his patient (this was a hospital setting), he came to me and, with considerable embarrassment, asked if he could see me "on a non-professional basis." We were married within the year, and until his untimely death 13 years later.
These were all, in hindsight at least, non-predatory situations, where the relationship was based on something other than power trips. But at the outset, it is sometimes difficult, especially from the outside looking in, to tell the difference.
It's like what the Bible says about how to discern a true prophet -- if the prophecy comes true, then the prophet is true. A connundrum, for sure.
Susan
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-17 14:45
David, You should not be the students psychologist anymore than you should have an affair with the student. Talk about abuse of power!! If I knew that my childs clarinet teacher was playing "psychologist" with him or her instead of teaching clarinet, I would not only pull my child from that situation, but I would have to teach an ugly lesson to the clarinet teacher myself ( that is where the "book um Dano" would come into play). Even if my clarinet teacher tried to be psychologist to me I would find another. To think that you could in any way have any right to be a clarinet teacher and also serve as "psychologist" to anyone is outright delusions of grandeur, (if that is how you spell it). Sounds like another clarinet teacher thinking they are much more important than they really are in the scheme of things. Makes me glad I am through with clarinet lessons and do not have to deal with this in real life. Only in theory.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-03-17 15:03
Perhaps what Dave meant was not psychologist in the sense of prying into their lives, but maybe just someone whom can be trusted to give an opinion on something. While I certainly usually only "talk shop" to anyone that I deal with on some sort of professional level, there are times when I ask some advice that isn't shop related.
Teachers in schools deal with these situations often, and so I imagine that in one-on-one situations like lessons, the teacher might be asked something like this as well. And I know whenever I'm asked a question, I try to give an answer (albeit I always warn them ahead of time that I will not lie or hold back on my opinions, and so to be careful when they ask me questions if they think they may not want to hear the answer - I find that sugarcoating answers can lead to misconceptions. So I'm blunt and straightforward most of the time.)
Alexi
In any event, you can always explain when starting lessons some sort of "disclaimer". Many teachers are doing things like this just to AVOID conflicts (stating that they WILL NOT give lessons unless it is conducted in a public institution, such as a rehearsal room at a local college, or at the students or instructor's house and ONLY when another adult is present for the duration of the lesson) - this would probably avoid a situatoin you stated above, Dano, where you said "If I knew that my childs clarinet teacher was playing "psychologist" with him or her instead of teaching clarinet, I would not only pull my child from that situation, but I would have to teach an ugly lesson to the clarinet teacher myself ( that is where the "book um Dano" would come into play). "
US Army Japan Band
|
|
|
|
|
Author: johnsonfromwisconsin
Date: 2005-03-17 15:59
What if one is teaching their wife/fiancee or girlfriend?
-JfW
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 15:59
Come on Dano for keyrist sakes.......
We aren't talking about kids here.
I know what I'm talking about, obviously more than you do.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 16:00
ps - that's my "civil" answer to Dano.
The other part of this is what about the guys who leave their spouses for the younger, hotter, newer, etc, etc, etc, student?
They are sleazebags.
I've seen families destroyed by it. It's never pretty, and it's never right either.
Post Edited (2005-03-17 16:10)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-17 16:03
Robert Moody, what is your email?
I looked in your website and can contribute to 2 of your interests.
Thanks.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-17 16:05
David, I hope your students are not reading your dribble. You may loose some power.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 16:14
Dano, I'm not saying that the teacher is their psychologist, therapist, etc - what I am saying is that they have similar power of a position like that and there is a personal relationship developed which shouldn't be abused.
It was just like writing when a sports coach is the "mother, father, therapist, etc.... "
There should be boundary lines which shouldn't be crossed.
What do I think are acceptable lines (as in after the student doesn't study anymore) I would think it would be while the student is at the institution they should have a no dating policy in place between the Faculty and Student body.
Just like the Philadelphia Eagles Football team is not allowed to date the Cheerleaders
Post Edited (2005-03-17 16:16)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-17 16:24
David, I am surprised that you are one of the "I know what I am talking about obviously more than you" guys. You sound like someone that does not need too much clientel. Enjoy your fund of knowledge, which oviously is much more than mine. I am sure you would agree that you know more than all. Now.....since I find it difficult to argue with someone drunk with knowledge as I find it difficult arguing with anyone that is drunk with alcohol, back to being the Holy Knowledgable Clarinet Dude. That is my "civil response" to David.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 16:48
Actually Dano, I don't 
|
|
|
|
|
Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-17 16:53
[ Points of view have now strongly been expressed, let's move on. - GBK ]
|
|
|
|
|
Author: allencole
Date: 2005-03-17 17:37
Attractions can develop and they can happen both directions. If the teacher senses that a student has developed an attraction, it might be possible to channel the feelings into something more proper and productive. I suspect that this goes on quite a bit with teachers and their better students. If the student insists on crossing the line, here are some considerations that will cool your jets with even the most tempting student:
1 - The student's welfare/chance to have a normal, untainted life
2- Consequences to you (or your credibility) as a teacher
3 - The strong probability that the student's feelings involve some sort of transference, hero worship, isolation, common interest, or even mental problems that are NOT true love--at least not in the early stages.
4 - The dangers that you may face if encourage romantic expectations on the student's part and then have to "jilt" them. This is particularly true of the student's crush is related to mental or social difficulties in their life.
5 - Creating the impression that you are sexually interested in a student who is NOT interested in you, whatever the signals.
6 - The fact that an attractive student may actually flirt with you as a means of manipulation and/or testing her own powers of attraction. Respond, and you put the student in a position of power that others will definitely notice.
Susan hit the nail on the head in saying the the person with the power or authority MUST take responsibility for maintaining the boundaries.
I enjoy my students tremendously, and do not hide that fact. I joke and tease and try to get them to smile or laugh, particularly if they are working on something that might frustrate them. This is even more the case with better students--where the risk of improper bonding is highest. With a female this can start to look like or even feel like flirtation. How to maintain boundaries without making things stiff?
When we're joking around, I always try to keep a few things on hand that convey to the student "I am a middled aged man, and you are a teenaged girl." Not only to discourage crushes, but to avoid the appearance of flirtation on my part.
That's the flip side. If the student perceives an attraction on the part of the teacher, it's probably going to be necessary to pull the plug. Susan's band director should've kept things cooler than he did, although I've seen a lot worse. The experiences of acquaintances who were band directors have led me to most of the thoughts that I've posted here.
Allen Cole
|
|
|
|
|
Author: hans
Date: 2005-03-17 18:06
David Blumberg said above: "we often ARE the psychologists for our students".
I would be surprised if that were NOT the case in at least one respect.
A significant part of successful teaching involves motivation and motivation is an important field of study in psychology (as in Maslow, Herzberg, McClelland, Vroom, Adams, etc.). If you don't know what makes a student "tick", you can't easily motivate her/him.
Psychologists are also concerned with behaviour modification, as teachers often are.
Much of this knowledge is intuitively obvious to mature adults and may not necessarily require formal training in psychology, although some reading on Operant Conditioning could be useful.
I did not interpret Mr. Blumberg's comment as meaning necessarily that he would try to psychoanalyze or treat his students. That would be foolish and irresponsible, as I'm sure we all agree.
Hans
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-17 18:19
You got it Hans. ![[hot]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/hot.gif)
I just feel that Academic Insitutions aren't and shouldn't supposed to be used as Dating Services for their Faculty.
Post Edited (2005-03-17 18:23)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Elizabeth
Date: 2005-03-17 19:16
This is hilarious! I was/am in "love" with a former clarinet teacher. A gorgeous blonde haired college guy! What can I say? It's hard not to fall in love if you're working hard at the same thing.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: elmo lewis
Date: 2005-03-17 20:56
Two famous musicians who married a student: Bela Bartok, Zoltan Kodaly. Two famous musicians who left their wife for a younger woman: Igor Stravinsky, Serge Prokofiev. A musician who proposed marriage to a number of younger women but was rejected: Anton Bruckner.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 21:42
Mr. Hans (I call him Mr. Hans because I feel like it... ^_^) said: "we often ARE the psychologists for our students".
I would be surprised if that were NOT the case in at least one respect.
A significant part of successful teaching involves motivation and motivation is an important field of study in psychology (as in Maslow, Herzberg, McClelland, Vroom, Adams, etc.). If you don't know what makes a student "tick", you can't easily motivate her/him.
Psychologists are also concerned with behaviour modification, as teachers often are.
Maybe though, if a teacher were to abuse his/her power, they could always use the things that motivate them in order to get what they want... I mean, that would only be in a situation where the teacher's intentions aren't honorable. Some students though, if a teacher told them that if they didn't tell that the teacher made a pass at them or something, they would basically learn more on clarinet or become like a professional musician or something (whatever makes them "tick")... Some students are that eager that they might go for that... Which is an abuse of power on the teacher's part, and should not be tolerated.
I guess the point I'm trying to make, although I'm not very clear, is that anywhere there's good there is also bad... It just depends what intentions the teacher has. Motivation can be used for or against the student depending on the intentions of the teacher.
Good luck understanding that, I'm not quite sure what I'm getting at either.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Robert Moody
Date: 2005-03-17 22:17
Quote:
I just feel that Academic Insitutions aren't and shouldn't supposed to be used as Dating Services for their Faculty.
![[frown]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie2.gif) I guess I should stay in the Army. Supposedly, a uniform attracts women as a whole. Unfortunately, someone forgot to tell the women I am around.
Seriously, between an adult teacher and a teenaged student, there is simply no excuse for a relationship to develop. If it does, then I would, unequivocally, eyeball the teacher for taking advantage of a situation and abusing it. If the teacher/student situation is between two adults (implying that both adults are free of parents and are self-sustaining), then while I would suggest keeping up a good guard, do not avoid life. If there is a connection at a level beyond music, my advice is to cease the teacher/student relationship and pursue the romantic one distinctly and without bias as much as you can. IMO, romance being interjected into a teacher/student relationship ends the real teacher/student relationship forever. It should be released and if interest remains, other aspects of their relationship explored. That is between adults, of course.
Quote:
David, You should not be the students psychologist anymore than you should have an affair with the student. Talk about abuse of power!!
Simply put, this statement is ignorant. ![[right]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie8.gif) Ignorant of what David clearly meant and ignorant of the norm or reality. Anytime two human beings spend regular amounts of one-on-one time together, a bond or relationship of some kind will develop. As human beings the exchange of experience will happen naturally from the more experienced to the lesser experienced. Often, but not always, that is along age lines (i.e. older to younger). The NORM in human relationships is to grow accustomed and relaxed in this relationship unless it is abusive for one or the other.
I can spend three years with a student and have nothing extraordinary develop in their playing or anything in our relationship as student/teacher, but when they move away or the lessons stop, there will invariably be a sense of loss. That teachers naturally fall into the "older sibling"/"parental"/"wisdom-giver" role is natural a part of the human process.
God...I'm boring myself to death!
In any case, I think I'm going to agree with David on nearly everything he's said and still go back to teaching college. Maybe the next time I'm at Shenandoah University teaching and three model triplets from Poland enroll, I'll be luckier than just having them as Literature students.
http://www.alizma.com Yes...they were students of mine and I was a favorite teacher of theirs.
Robert Moody
http://www.musix4me.com
Free Clarinet Lessons and Digital Library!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: ffrr
Date: 2005-03-17 22:25
What's the emoticon for impressed? :-)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: fredackerman
Date: 2005-03-17 22:34
My day job is photographing beautiful woman, I know its tough but.. When I chose my instructor I somehow ended up with a clarinet teacher who had a pretty Crush? Sure, in fact I manage to fall in love with every model/actress I shoot! Sorry I couldn't resist.
Fred
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Robert Moody
Date: 2005-03-17 22:36
Oh, I forgot! Someone asked for my A Beautiful Face address to send me some pictures for my www.abeautifulface.com website.
It is Robert at that address.
Robert Moody
http://www.musix4me.com
Free Clarinet Lessons and Digital Library!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-17 22:53
"in fact I manage to fall in love with every model/actress I shoot! Sorry I couldn't resist."
Wait.... I don't understand... Wow, I am ashamed! I mean, if you really did love them you wouldn't shoot them! YOU JUST COULDN'T RESIST SHOOTING THEM?! WHY?! Wow... someone's got a little bit of an anger problem there... You could always say, "I shot her because I didn't want her to see how terrible life could be, and it's much better in heaven, and so I put her out of her misery"... I can't believe you!!!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: mags
Date: 2005-03-17 23:05
I certainly don't want a relationship with my clarinet teacher. A good snog would suffice..Mgt x
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Bnatural
Date: 2005-03-18 00:08
Robert, .... *jaw drops*... you my friend are a lucky man...
I had something to saw about this but suddenly I forget...
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-18 00:16
As always, I am the only one that agrees with myself. I think I am attracted to myself and will abuse my position of power with myself. That way there will be no complaints. Unless of course I break my own heart and leave me for my clone. Or maybe just shut up and play the clarinet. I am not a fan of those girly little smiley faces, but if I was, I would probably have one that is winking on the end of this.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: fredackerman
Date: 2005-03-18 00:48
Mary I did mention I'm a photographer and my weapon of choice is a Nikon You are really funny!
Fred
|
|
|
|
|
Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-18 01:00
http://www.macon.com/mld/philly/news/11120302.htm
Here, teacher gone wrong....really, really wrong..... It's all in Phila's news big time. Ironically, his wife used to be my son's Pediatrician, and his daughter was my Clarinet student. She's a really sweet, quiet, polite girl, and has to be beyond mortified at this as anyone else would be.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-18 01:13
>As always, I am the only one that agrees with myself. I think I am >attracted to myself and will abuse my position of power with myself. That >way there will be no complaints. Unless of course I break my own heart >and leave me for my clone. Or maybe just shut up and play the clarinet. I >am not a fan of those girly little smiley faces, but if I was, I would probably >have one that is winking on the end of this.
^_^! That's awesome... you could always put (^_~) HAHAHA!
>Mary I did mention I'm a photographer and my weapon of choice is a >Nikon You are really funny!
Haha, I know... just thought I'd lighten things up a bit...
|
|
|
|
|
Author: emylooa
Date: 2005-03-18 01:18
If you want love, get a dog. A LOT less complicated, LOL!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: Dano
Date: 2005-03-18 01:58
And Robert Moody thought he was asking a simple little question. Ha!!
|
|
|
|
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-03-18 02:05
Quote:
If you want love, get a dog. A LOT less complicated, LOL! I agree. That's what I've settled for recently. The friendly face saying hello at the door when I come home. No matter WHAT the time.
As per the abuse of power comments, what if the person is inadvertantly abusing the power (without their knowledge). Take for example a teacher who has an adult student (no other affiliation, just a student), who falls for them due to their 'power' and 'prowess', but the teacher doesn't realize it's a power thing.
It seems to me we're often (even in this thread) going after the abuser of power, but what if they don't know that that's what it is? An abuse of power, in my mind, means that they know and actively USE their sense of power in order to attract a student. For all we know it could be unintentional.
Just pointing out that although we as a society seem quick to acuse the one that's higher up the chain. When it may not even be on purpose.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-18 02:13
>It seems to me we're often (even in this thread) going after the abuser of >power, but what if they don't know that that's what it is? An abuse of >power, in my mind, means that they know and actively USE their sense of >power in order to attract a student. For all we know it could be >unintentional.
Well then, it would be best to get out of that situation asap, if they wanted to actually have a relationship that was sincere. Not just an attraction that is caused by a sense of authority with unintentional abuse of power. So, it would be better for the student to go find a new teacher, if she wanted to go out with her former one... BUT, what if she falls for her new teacher?! hm... makes you think...
I think emotions are thrown around all too much nowadays...
Wow, I talk like an old person... "nowadays"... haha! ^_^
|
|
|
|
|
Author: diz
Date: 2005-03-18 03:19
The 'beautifulface' website didn't quite work as I expected. But the computer generated image of a beautiful woman's face was pretty attractive, I must admit. It would appear that symetry plays an important part in what we think makes 'beautiful'.
Without music, the world would be grey, very grey.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: ginny
Date: 2005-03-18 04:26
My kid's grandad was their grandma's college chemistry teacher. I believe they went out after she finished the course.
On the other hand my son's former choir teacher has been brought up on charges of abusing three girls in the school in a mere three years. Many people still stand up for him, as he is very charismatic. I believe he's sociopath or some such. Much too charming. His stepsister supposedly will testify that he raped her when they were young.
http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/11118790.htm
I don't think these things are simple. Clearly my in-laws having had over 50 years and several children and grandchildren together did a good thing. I hope there's a special place in hell for my kid's former choir teacher.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2005-03-18 20:54
>I hope there's a special place in hell for my kid's former choir teacher.
Yeah, what she did was pretty bad... But still, hell hurts! ALOT!
Anyways, I'm sorry bout what happened... I guess that's why it's always good to check up with your children to make sure nothing like that would happen. But, in cases, they may not tell, and that is where you have to be afraid.
|
|
|
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-20 00:43
here's my take on the psych view- no expert, just passing on my teachings (I took a psych class) - many females (or males) attracted to their [older] teacher (clarinet or otherwise) are MOSTLY going to fall under the Freudian electra/oedipus complex... for those of you who don't know, it pretty much means that a female who grows up without a father or father-figure and likewise a male who grows up without a mother or mother-figure tend to fall for older men/women. It is based on the inner desire for that missing and very important relationship and bond...a father-daugther relationship. So girls not only tend to "crush" on older men, but older men in power (i.e. teachers). [*cough trust me, I know! cough*] Is this right? I am not sure. I don't think that it applies to EVERYONE who grew up with out one or the other (or both) and/or no proper male/female figure, I am saying that is Freud's theory and I believe it.
I for one understand what he is saying. And from my standpoint could almost care less about a relationship ensuing between a [younger] student and his or her teacher. However it is innately a power struggle, like it or not. People over the age of 20 are in a further developmental stage than people under 20. And therefore a relationship might not work. or be lasting. and if it happens between a student and a teacher, that relationship is ruined. If you are not 'seeing' each other any longer, how could you possibly bear to take a lesson from that teacher?!
on the other hand, who the hell knows what love is or where attraction comes from? is the crush or relationship (if it has gotten that far...) based purely on the physical aspects...or emotions?
this is not a black and white area.
and the whole deal about a clarinet teacher being a "pyschologist"- I don't think that was meant to be taken literally. mine certainly doesn't sit there and pyscho analyze me, but she has sometimes told me she feels like a psychologist (not always in direct realtion to me, but in general). Because in a sense, she is. I don't "lie on the couch" and spill my life problems, but still, she seems to double as a psych in a way I cannot explain.
I believe, male or female, young or old, everyone should have a relationship with their teacher- not that of a sexual nature per se, but more like a friendship. I feel that I can improve because I am not afraid to ask my teacher anything or she to tell me anything. I also feel like if nothing else, my relationship to my teacher motivates me to practice simply because I feel I would be wasting an hour of her time and putting her through needless pain because I didn't practice. and I feel a need to prove myself to her (hmmm...power...)
I have also opened my musical tastes because of her. and have had an easier time of searching for colleges and chosing the best one because of her.
but anyway...
allen cole- well said. and hans! wow. that is right (about motivation)
...didn't charlie neidich marry his younger student?
-Lindsie
Post Edited (2005-03-20 00:55)
|
|
|
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-20 00:52
sorry, just a side note...Quote:
The 'beautifulface' website didn't quite work as I expected. But the computer generated image of a beautiful woman's face was pretty attractive, I must admit. It would appear that symetry plays an important part in what we think makes 'beautiful'.
symetry can be so boring sometimes...I cherish imperfection. call me crazy.
-Lindsie
|
|
|
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
