 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: cigleris
Date: 2004-06-29 21:01
Does anyone over the pond in either the USA or Canada own any of these clarinets? Was thinking of getting some ordered to use here in the UK as the exchange rate is low between Can Dollars and GBpounds, if anyone let us in on what these instruments are like would be most appreciated
Peter Cigleris
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2004-06-30 00:39
Peter -
I just got a lightly used one, in Bb at A-430. It has two sets of center joints, to change from a 5-key Mozart model to a 10-key classical model. It's beautifully made, like all of Steve's instruments. I haven't had a chance to play it much, and won't for another few weeks. I'll post my impressions later.
I understand that there is a substantial waiting list for them.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Liquorice
Date: 2004-06-30 06:25
I've recently been using on one of Steven Fox's copies of a 3-keyed Baroque instrument. It's an excellent instrument, and I highly recommend his work.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cigleris
Date: 2004-06-30 11:55
How do you find the tuning? I would need them at 430hz. I recently had one made over here in the UK but found the tuning not quite right, it's quite embarrassing sitting next to Tony Pay in the OAE and not having an instrument that is reasonably in tune. Any comments would be most helpful.
Peter Cigleris
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: diz
Date: 2004-06-30 22:07
Tony Pay's a wonderful musician ... heard him play with the OAE when they came to Sydney on tour, too long ago ... isn't the whole problem with historic instruments (wind that is) the tuning one, because they are so "bare minimum" when it comes to key work? I'm sure it's a nice challenge for those of you passionate enough to persue it.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Alphie
Date: 2004-07-01 00:33
Try Peter van den Poel in Holland or Agnes Guerroult in Paris. Or ask Tony, he has all the connections in the world!
Alphie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Liquorice
Date: 2004-07-01 10:02
Re: tuning
All historical instruments that I've played need some "humouring" as far as tuning is concerned. I've found that playing on a relatively closed tip opening and fairly soft reeds gives me enough flexibility to push the pitch around quite a lot. It's also easier to get a more even scale with this kind of set-up. But if you're playing in the OAE I guess you know all this!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cigleris
Date: 2004-07-01 12:15
thnks for the comments I know all about setting the instruments up but the problem is freelancing on both 'modern' and 'early' clarinets I don't really have time to spend sorting them out and was wondering if Stephen's clarinets are pretty well in tune (at 430) when you get the from him.I know that you need to 'fiddle' with them at first.
Peter Cigleris
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: diz
Date: 2004-07-02 01:40
cigleris ... simple answer to this is no ... it's the nature of the beast. Modern instruments have tone holes and other mechanisms (think fine tuning) that aid tunning, these are not found on early clarinets, until you start getting into "romantic period" clarinets and beyond.
Without music, the world would be grey, very grey.
Post Edited (2004-07-02 05:46)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Alphie
Date: 2004-07-02 08:52
cigleris, take this from someone who was a talanted beginner in 1982 with an orchestra that became a world leader in the early music field. THERE ARE NO SHORT CUTS!
I was a free lancer on both modern and early instruments for 15 years before I got a position in a modern philharmonic orchestra. Now I mostly play chamber music on early clarinets.
What you need to have is a passionate dedication, then you take the time it takes to do what you have to do. It's always a delicate balance to find the amount of time to do many different things and maybe combine it with a family life as well.
To find a good setup of old style clarinets is always a 'fiddleing' for years before you're happy if you want to do it on the highest level. There are no standards as there are on modern instruments and it just takes time and effort to find the right combo for yourself. Since you're playing with the OAE already you should take the time immediately to find a good setup to start with. If you're enough serious about making a carrere playing early clarinets on a high level you're gonna do fine. Why not taking a year to study with Tony or with Eric Hoeprich in The Hague. Good luck.
Alphie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Alphie
Date: 2004-07-02 09:31
cigleris, you already have a most impressive C.V. and carrere so I'm a bit surprised that your question is so 'basic'. I think you have to decide for yourself if you want to go on making a carrere on early clarinets and make the effort that it takes. First, make sure that your 'modern' carrere is on solid ground. Then, add the early clarinet on top to make your musical perception wider. You have to do it for musical reasons to find dimensions that the modern clarinet can't give you. First then, you'll find that it all makes sence and it's worth the effort it takes get into the early clarinets. You're already envious for many players having already gotten into the OAE. If you wanna do it seriously don't waste the chance.
Best of luck,
Alphie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Liquorice
Date: 2004-07-02 10:30
The bad news- Alphie and diz are right. Even though Steven Fox makes fantastic instruments, they are still copies of historical clarients, so they will also have the specific tuning problems of those instruments.
The good news- with the right mouthpiece and reed set-up, the tuning is incredibly flexible on early clarinets. I recently played a Baroque opera on a clarinet without a C# key. Unfortunately this C# kept turning up in the score. The only way to play it was to play a very flat D! It worked though. I would never have been able to do something like that on a modern clarinet.
But of course you have to spend some time working on tuning. If you look around you can also find some amazing fingerings to help some tuning problems. What are the specific notes that you are having problems with on your instrument?
I have noticed that period instrument orchestras and ensembles seems to have an ever increasing popularity (at least in Europe). An unfortunate consequence of this is that many musicians are trying to jump onto the early music band wagon. This is sad, because many of these musicians lack the passion of those (like Alphie) who started the whole thing. There are some makers who make instruments that are not actual copies, but are "period-ish" instruments which are easier for modern clarinetists to play. I know one clarinet player who uses a 10-keyed instrument with a modern mouthpiece for performances of 18th century music! This is a typlical example of someone is isn't prepared to "go the distance" in terms of playing on early instruments.
For myself, I enjoy the struggle. And the results are often surprising and very pleasing. Playing in A major using fork fingerings, for example, gives a completely different character to the melody than when one uses extra keys to produce the chromatic notes. "Chromatic" means colour, and playing on ealry clarinets certainly gives colours which one can't obtain on modern instruments.
Anyway, sorry for the lecture! I'm not at all implying that cigleris is one of the early music bandwagon people. In fact, if you play in the OAE, you are obviously on a much higher level than you modest posts would imply! I'm just passionate about early clarinets, and would be happy to discuss playing problems and experiences with cigleris and others.
Post Edited (2004-07-02 10:32)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cigleris
Date: 2004-07-02 12:51
thanks guys you've been helpful. Playing the early clarinets has been something that i've done since my first years at the conservatoire, my love of the instrument and of history drew me in. At the time there was nothing for me at the Birmingham Conservatoire ad had to fight the organisers of the early music department to let me do some stuff which resulted in a performance of the Fasch Chalumeaux concerto one of the most scariest things i've probably done! So finding the balance to get both to a high standard was hard. Anyway would love to talk with Alphie and Liquorice about work etc. their end, is there much work over the pond cause there really isnt that much here for clt, Baroque music is more in 'fashion' at the moment.
Peter Cigleris
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: donald
Date: 2004-07-02 12:55
i like the struggle too- forked fingerings etc are difficult but somehow there is a feeling of "connection with the vibrating wood" that i really like
i've got to say, however, that i really miss the thumbrest, even when just playing the chalemaux. If i was to get a really good set of historical instruments, i'd probably ask to have a thumbrest stuck on, historically accurate or not.
sorry
donald
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
