 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: billryan
Date: 2004-02-25 19:35
At a dinner party given by my Prof, a coversation about buying a instrument on ebay was the highlight for me*. The talk was about the jerks you meet when buying online. Seems that a highly regarded music instructor was looking to buy a few old horns. My Prof told him that he must be very careful, as when he tried (ebay) to ask questions about the clarinets condition, the person selling "went ballistic"! Like totally crazed and sent angry and threatening emails to him! So, this persons email handle was given out to all and it's going around the school. I guess when selling clarinets on ebay, it doesn't matter if your a nut or not. Then again some appear to be "normal" and turn out to be sicko's. Any ebay horror stories out there? *Well, also the Shrimp!
Bill
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2004-02-26 00:31
I have met many wonderful and informative clarinet enthusiats via ebay . My first sale went to a performance major, and the second to a Professor. Recently someone was checking on my reputation and asked around....turns out he knew the Prof. and the deal resulted in a long and thouroughly enjoyable exhcange of stories and wisdom.
Compared to other venues that I have associated with, clarinet dealing on ebay has been a rather positive experience for me.
Bad apples are everywhere, however, and ebay is no exception.
(Now if you really want to get frosted, try an equestrian site. . Just ask about any horse trainer or dealer, and the soto voce response will make the brickbats that get hurled at Aker Bilk seem like Nobel Prize accolades. JMHO based on loads of experience)
Disclaimer...yep, I buy and sell stuff on ebay.
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Author: Douglas
Date: 2004-02-26 03:35
I agree with Alseg about the experiences on eBay being more positive than not. There are many good clarinet related items to be found, and it also is true that simply searching the clarinet sales on eBay will provide information about makers and equipment than cannot be found anywhere else. eBay also provides a quite reliable sense of value for equipment...who would have known without eBay just how high Kaspar mouthpieces might climb? The original posting seems to be based on a negative concept that there just has to be something wrong with dealing with eBay and invites only "horror stories". Why not request "triumphant tales" about buying on eBay as well, just to keep things balanced?
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Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2004-02-26 03:36
I have bought several Clarinets through eBay. Any one said to be in good condition was. Any one said to need work did. Any seller who said "I do not know anything about Clarinets" truly did not.
Buying through eBay is like buying anywhere else; you just don't see your opposite number face to face.
I have never asked a question which stimulated a "ballistic" response, but then perhaps I'm just so pleasant as to put respondents at ease. 
Regards,
John
did you really believe that last line
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2004-02-26 03:58
Hi,
I have been a buyer and a seller on eBay and have only had two awkward moments in well of 100 sales. I have purchased some outstanding clarinets, mouthpieces, reeds, music, etc. and sold the same. All the deals I got were fair and only a couple of times was I disappointed.
If you are buying you'd want a chance to return a bad item, right? So, if you're selling, give your customer the same option. But if it is an As Is item, just be clear about it up front.
Yeah, I've meet some pretty great people (just like this BB) and there have been a few jerks (just like....). Never had anyone go ballistic.
I love eBay because it is the world's largest garage sale.
HRL
PS Each one of my top 4 clarinets (Buffet Academy, LeBlanc Dyn 2, Selmer 9*, LeBlanc L 200) I bought on eBay for a total less than you could imagine. Two needed full repads and key polishing which I knew ahead of time.
Post Edited (2004-02-26 12:48)
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Author: ron b
Date: 2004-02-26 04:50
I've purchased many clarinets and a few other instruments via eBay, Bill. I've only had a couple of, as Hank says, "awkward moments"; nothing seriously negative. I'd have to say that dealing with eBay folks has been pretty much as the above responders relate, educational and friendly.
The only 'horror stories' in my musical experiences I could tell you about happened as first-hand encounters with real live people. Maybe, in hindsight, things would have worked out differently if I could have left 'em some Feedback
- r![[cool]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/cool.gif) n b -
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Author: jo.clarinet
Date: 2004-02-26 13:49
I thoroughly enjoy looking through the ebay listings - I find it really interesting, and exciting when I'm bidding! ![[hot]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/hot.gif)
I have to admit that the USA ebay has much more on offer than the UK one (I'm in England), and much more variety too! The main disadvantage of the USA ebay is that because of the time difference the auctions very often seem to end in (for me) the middle of the night, so I have lost out on several good deals! And of course the international shipping costs add quite a bit to the total.
I've bought several excellent clarinets through ebay and haven't had any unpleasant experiences at all. But I do think you need to research very carefully before committing yourself - I 'searched' on this (invaluable!) BBoard and other sites a lot before finally deciding to buy any of the clarinets!
Joanna Brown
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Author: Bob A
Date: 2004-02-26 14:51
If you are really serious, know what you want, are firm on the top price you will pay and plan on making only that one top bid---then invest in one of the many "sniping" programs that put your bid in, automatically, seconds before it ends. Many of us have been beaten that way. Seems to me it would take all the "fun" out of it and turn it into somewhat of a business. But it might get you your horn.
Bob A
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2004-02-26 16:54
'Experts' are often the worst customers... they expect second-hand gear to be as good (or better) than new.
I have heard it from both sides of the eBay fence...
If you want actual customer service, contact a Woodwind.org sponsor.
If you want a bargain, be prepared to tease out useful information.
I just paid under $200 USD for a wonderful Alto saxophone, in like new condition... try doing that inside your local shop!
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Author: jo.clarinet
Date: 2004-02-26 21:51
Bob A - I never knew that could be done! That's really sneaky! Do lots of people do that sort of bidding?
I do agree that it would take the fun out of it though. I think I'll stay as I am!
Joanna Brown
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Author: BobD
Date: 2004-02-26 21:57
eBay's published suggestion of deciding on your absolute top price and using if as you bid is still probably the best.....but there's the rub....would you pay one-dollar more than your top price!??!! Trying to outfox the sniping "programs" is an exercise in frustration as far as I'm concerned. But, if you don't get that horn you thought you wanted maybe it's just as well. There will always be another
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Author: Ralph
Date: 2004-02-26 22:27
Like others that have responded to this posting I have had mostly good experiences on e-Bay. I have been both a seller and a buyer. Included in my purchases have been several clarinets. They generally have been as described. Only once was I truly disappointed - an individual neglected to mention the condition of the plating on the keys. As others have mentioned, know what your bidding on is worth and never assume anything - if you have any doubts about the item ask the seller a question. If a seller refuses to answer a question, I refuse to bid.
Ralph
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Author: sherrietanner
Date: 2004-02-26 23:39
Hello Bill, I hope your enjoying your new Signature! I've been buying stuff on ebay for a few years and have some experience to impart. Many times while looking at descriptions like: Pristine, Mint, Like New, with no mention of any marks or problems, I find when you send the ebayer a note, asking them to be absolutely specific about the condition, things seem to pop-up! Like the one gent (I think gent), who wrote back and said "on closer inspection", I've had many of these "on closer... answers. To me, pristine means mint, which means, new. Pristine items do not have any problems! Yet, unless you dig a little deeper with some of these sellers, you don't always get the straight story! On a whole most ebayers want to do the right thing, checking their feedback is very important and if there should be a negative remark about the seller, the sellers response means much to me. Some of these people are downright nasty, and I refuse to have anything to do with them. I also see much "stuff" that can be purchased online and in stores for less. One more thing, even when you do a specific search, a bunch of garbage also comes with the good.
Sherrie
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Author: Rick Williams
Date: 2004-02-27 15:24
I've sold and bought a number of items on e-bay, but then again as a disclosure I bought into e-bay when they first went public. I read the original business plan while in grad school.
I've never really had a serious problem and most people have been very nice. But like all such processes, you need to exercise due caution.
Best
Rick
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Author: billryan
Date: 2004-02-28 20:35
Hey Sherrie, Good advice! Love the Selmer and thank you for asking.
Bill
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Author: Taxijazz
Date: 2004-03-15 11:41
Ebay is a gamblers arena full of theives. If you like gambling, and like clarinets, ebay is great.
Feedback is unreliable. Fraud protection is fake.
I bought over 200 clarinets on ebay and the most terrible ones were supposedly with recent overhauls. Most of them didn't work, but if you expect that it's the same as going to a retail store--you're nuts. Ebay is a nightmare. The sellers on ebay are often just scavengers that find junk, and if you get something really good you might be buying stolen property. There are some retired people that just like working on instruments--And they get screwed because people on ebay want junk prices. You get what you pay for a lot of times, but a couple of times the sellers didn't even ship the item after they were paid and I never did get the matter resolved--And I'm a Gila Monster--One ebay seller that got me for $200 went to prison, but he got a lot of people real quick after he built up 500+ perfect positive feedback. And negative feedback usually gets the same, so just because someone has negatives might mean that they complained about getting ripped off. You want horror stories--try some of the repairmen that specialize on the internet, or the outfits that look like big businesses but they are just on the internet.
Post Edited (2004-03-15 13:09)
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Author: growlingbunny910
Date: 2004-03-15 11:51
While I love ebay for lots of items, I think a clarinet should be held and played prior to purchase. There can be a variation between two exact model instruments in sound and feel that it is always my rule of thumb is to touch before you marry it.
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Author: leonardA
Date: 2004-03-15 12:07
I have bought four instruments on ebay and all of them were as represented, and the experiences were pleasant. I try to deal only with sellers who have a lot of positive feedback.
Leonard
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2004-03-15 12:57
Given the current state of affairs with Lynn's mouthpiece posting, I find it the admission that eBay is a "Den of Thieves" refreshing.
I suppose you meet the kind of people you're looking for most anywhere.
*******
It is still a bargain hunter's paradise.
The problems fall on both sides of the 'expectation limit'...
Snapping up a hidden treasure
If you buy an instrument for less than the cost of an overhaul, you can anticipate it will need one. (Bottom feeder's remorse)
Trusting advertising copy
If you buy an item (a nice old mouthpiece, for example) and it has an obvious defect that was hidden in the description, you're dealing with someone uniquely qualified to discuss deception.
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Author: Taxijazz
Date: 2004-03-15 13:08
Positive feedback doesn't mean much-- people are reluctant to leave negative feedback because they'll get the same in return every time. I've got plenty of negative feedback because people pull stuff that they would never dare try if they met me in person. Also people leave negative feedback in haste and can't retract it when they realize it's a mistake. You have to ask or you won't know if the feedback is valid.
It is important to email people and ask questions, and also be able to determine through their method of communication what is really going on.
People who are hostile for no reason in your first encounter will usually be a bigger problem later.
People who imply that you might be a crook when they haven't had much communication are probably crooks themselves, and will accuse you of cheating them because they couldn't cheat you enough.
If they act stupid, playing dumb should make you suspicious.
If it's serious business you might try the phone. And a clarinet can be played over the phone too.
If they won't allow a pick up in person--what do they have to hide?
If they have a store--why won't anyone coming into their store buy the item?
If they say they know nothing--The instrument doesn't work.
If it doesn't have a case and it's a vintage instrument--expect frozen rods.
'Gold plate' is often brass.
'Looks to be in tact', or other odd useage of the English language should make you wonder.
A repair that you can't take back to the repairman for adjustment will probably require another repairmans attention.
If it's a player you are getting it form you are more likely to get something that plays, but it also might play differently than what you are used to, so you have to give it a chance.
If it's a clarinet and you didn't try it before you buy it, don't expect it to be something it isn't--You are gambling.
If they complain about deadbeats, and have a lot of extra rules in their ebay listing-- they have probably had problems with buyers because of the way they operate (and you won't see it in the feedback).
If they type in all caps-- they don't care about making sure people understand the details of their offer; they are lazy; uneducated; or just hate to type--Better ask.
If they found it in an attic--Someone else didn't care about it and maybe you shouldn't either.
Retired people who like the instruments and are good at repair might have a higher price--but you'll get your monies worth. Even still you shouldn't expect perfect because everyone is different and you didn't try it first and the seller might not know anything about your taste.
If you don't like something it is much easier to re-sell it on ebay than return it--Unless the seller invites returns, and then you'll still lose the shipping charge and make for a bad deal for both of you. Some sellers can't handle returns, you have to remember it's not a store but an auction. There are a lot of handicapped people that use ebay to survive and they are good people that shouldn't be burdened if you can just as easily 'return' the item by listing it on ebay yourself for someone else to buy (and the seller already set you up with a box to ship it in).
If you got a super good deal--You might be buying stolen property (There's a lot of it on ebay).
If you try to get something for nothing--you are more likely to get nothing for something.
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Author: Vytas
Date: 2004-03-15 22:20
Taxijazz,
I think, you're painting very distorted eBay picture.
Despite coupe of bad deals my experiences were pleasant.
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Author: rebel clarinetist
Date: 2004-03-16 00:01
I have bought several items on Ebay and have been very satisfied. I am currently searching for an Eb alto clarinet and a wooden Buffet R13. I bought my plastic Buffet R13 from Ebay and am very happy with it. The sellers I have dealt with on Ebay so far have been very honest with me and I with them. I ALWAYS CHECK the seller's feedback and if my gut tells me that something's "fishy",I simply don't bid. I WILL NOT HESITATE in leaving negative feedback. As for you,Taxijazz, your comment"people pull stuff that they never would,if they met me in person" tells me EXACTLY HOW you act on Ebay,and one of these days your attitude's going to get you in real trouble. Not to mention the fact,of what's already been said about you on the list. I SERIOUSLY doubt I'll be dealing with you. And if you don't like it,wellTOUGH!!!!!
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