 The Doublers BBoard
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Author: Joseph Tomasso
Date: 2011-11-30 05:19
Any other professional "doublers" struggle with the decision to switch primary instruments?
I started out as a classical saxophonist who became very interested in clarinet after becoming really worried about my future as a classical saxophonist. Then I ended up in a multi-woodwind program for my MM where I focused on oboe to both help me build a private studio, but also make me a more attractive professor for a college/university some day.
Many years later I'm just getting back into top-tier competetive playing. I won two international competitions last year, which is awesome, but I'm finding it very hard to balance the "doubler" life with the "international soloist" standards i'm putting myself under. I'm also getting much more serious about pursuing an orchestral career on oboe and clarinet. Very difficult to do with all these saxophone things I have going on. I'd still consider myself a classical saxophonist, but not sure how much longer I plan to keep that up, even after being so successful.
Ultimately, it is my decision to be a woodwind specialist, and I'm very happy I have built the skill set, but sometimes it feels like I've taken on more than I can handle. Wouldn't life just be easier if I only played the oboe?
Comments on your experiences would be helpful
and for the record, I practice 2 hours of saxophone a day, 2 hours of clarinet, 2 hours of oboe, and try to get in a full hour of reed making. I am holding my private studio at 50 students and will take no new students without the loss of one first. Flute and bassoon are officially off the practice list for the last 2 months but I would like to eventually find 30 minutes a day to get my flute playing back... it use to be pretty strong until I decided I loved the oboe!
Bachelor of Music, Sax/Clarinet Performance (2005, 06)
Master of Music, Multiple Woodwind Performance (2008)
Master of Music, Oboe Performance (2013)
Gainesville Chamber Orchestra (Clarinet)
University of Florida 2010-2011(Visiting Lecturer in Woodwi
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Author: oboesax
Date: 2011-12-01 14:01
OK, I'll take a shot at this. You gave me some helpful insight and suggestions regarding my daughter on another thread.
I'm not a doubler or an oboe player, but I've been around oboe most of my life. My brother played oboe/EH for the Met on contract for many years and was an oboe professor in his 20's. He studied with all the big names back then (25-35 years ago) including Ray Still, John Mack and Elaine Duvas. My daughter is a pretty good 16-year old oboe player who studies with the principal oboe player of a major U.S. symphony orchestra.
To weigh your abilities on oboe vs. all your other abilities (which appear considerable) you need to get the opinion of a top U.S. oboe player. You mentioned you studied with some players in the Chicago Symphony; surely they have given you an idea of how you rank compared to other oboe players. After my daughter's first lesson with this principal oboe player he gave me an evaluation of her playing. You are not likely to find such a person on a doubler's board.
Oboe is different than saxophone (not that I'm a saxophonist either, I'm a flutist). Symphony orchestras want their players to be young. For the first 10 years of his auditions (between ages 17 and 27) my brother was invited to every audition he applied to and made the finals over 50 times. He made the finals for the San Francisco Symphony 1st oboe slot seven times, but was never selected for the permanent position. After around age 27, he started getting invited to auditions less often, and getting eliminated sooner, after the preliminary round. One orchestra even asked him, when he was around age 35, why he wanted the job since he was apparently very successful with his own business. Another major orchestra flat out told him he was too old.
Most doublers don't play the oboe well, by oboe orchestral standards. During my daughter's lesson with the top oboe doubler in our nearest major city, he had her play the oboe for him. He told her she was better on oboe than any other doubler he'd heard, including himself. But that's because she started playing oboe when she was 9; it sounds like her primary instrument (which it is, along with sax).
You might find better reception applying for oboe slots in smaller orchestras. Then you have to weigh that against what you already have.
Out of curiousity, which international competitions did you win?
Post Edited (2011-12-02 22:34)
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Author: Joseph Tomasso
Date: 2011-12-02 18:38
Thanks for your input.
The problem I'm having is that every teacher I work with wants me to focus on their one specific instrument. It is quite a compliment to get pulled in every direction, but it makes listening to my heart very difficult.
My current mentor has the idea that 'You already double very well. You can pick up anything and play it at a high level. That is not going to change if you take two years to really hone your craft." I know it sounds great in theory, but I'm a little worried about walking away from everything else for that long. Being a "doubler" is one part working harder than anyone else and one part being in the right place. I'd hate to have one of those perfect opportunities come up 6 months into storing the saxophone and miss out. What if i put the oboe down for a few months to focus on clarinet and a faculty position for oboe/saxophone opens up somewhere? It could be too late to get in my top shape. A lot of "what if" going on here...
As far as auditions and age, my experience has not really been the same. I have been a finalist in several oboe and clarinet auditions in the last 3 years despite being a 'saxophonist'... all going to people who were 10, if not 20 years older than I was. The most recent being the Winston Salem principal oboe audition. Perhaps with the rising competition, lower number of positions due to orchestra closures, and the fact that musicians seem to be staying in orchestras longer and longer, I don't feel like a lot of us under 30 are given a fair shot for the big jobs. Maybe I see it differently because I keep getting the runner-up and never the winner! Of course I should practice more to solve that.
It is not so much a question of my ability at this point but a question of my desire and willingness to drop my current "lifestyle" if you will. I try not to tell people I'm a doubler until I have after started playing in a lesson. Never once have i been accused of sounding like one so I must be doing something right. In fact, several have tried to recruit me into degree programs... i suppose I just have to make that decision.
I won two competitions in Italy last summer with the Associazione Musicale Giovinale. They host competitions throughout the country with age categories from 10-30 (i think 10-12, 12-14, 14-18, 19-30 or something like that). At 27 I was pretty much in the middle of the contestants with age and was very fortunate to win both a virtuoso competition and a separate soloists competition. Both on saxophone (and only the second person in the history of the organization to win multiple competitions the same calendar year).
Hopefully this post doesn't make me come off as terribly arrogant. My success is based solely on putting hours and hours into the practice room and seeking out the advice of the best players (and of course following it religiously). I'm happy to share a few recordings so I can be humbled by my less than perfect ability to play. I'm just your average musician... with an above average ability to buy many horns.
Oboe
http://youtu.be/lvUG_3GpMlI
http://youtu.be/T1f2pUirVBI
Clarinet
http://youtu.be/NV-VLfgrZQA
and of course my "real instrument" if you will
Saxophone
http://youtu.be/1dK12ZUnbhg
each with their faults of course
oh, and a flute video form me in 09 before I "quit" playing the flute. Sort of sad but I had to if I wanted to improve on the oboe.
http://youtu.be/BAwtZlYQKNM
Bachelor of Music, Sax/Clarinet Performance (2005, 06)
Master of Music, Multiple Woodwind Performance (2008)
Master of Music, Oboe Performance (2013)
Gainesville Chamber Orchestra (Clarinet)
University of Florida 2010-2011(Visiting Lecturer in Woodwi
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Author: oboesax
Date: 2011-12-03 03:57
Because you're very talented, you have an interesting dilemma. Before I read your post, I had no idea that there were people capable of auditioning for orchestras on more than one instrument and placing as high as runner up!. I listened to your oboe playing and you certainly sound like an oboe player.
Regarding your comment about orchestras hiring older oboe players, it may be a trend or it may be what you've observed with your own auditions. My daughter's teacher (the principal oboe player) is your age. The orchestra just hired an assistant principal oboe who just got out of school and is even younger than the principal.
Perhaps every generation thinks that auditions are getting harder, that more musicians are staying in the orchestra and that there are fewer jobs. i know that my brother 30 years ago used to say that. There was a trend then to start hiring more women, so it seemed to him that every time he got runner-up it was a woman who beat him. Yet, male oboe players were also being hired. But I think you are correct that it is harder today due to the economy and other factors you mentioned.
Will more practicing get you the job instead of runner up? Maybe. I tend to think that the few that end up in the final 3 or so have all passed the qualification tests, and that other factors are considered. My brother got runner up so many times in the top US orchestra auditions that we figured the orchestras either didn't like his personality, or thought he was too much of a soloist. Would he have gotten one of those jobs had he practiced more? I don't think so. He was obviously good enough to get them, or he wouldn't have been runner up so many times. In your case though, you would have more time to practice oboe if you dropped your other instruments.
I think it's interesting that you don't tell teachers giving you a lesson that you play other instruments. We learned this "lesson" as well. About 6 months ago we were looking for a new oboe teacher, and went to the principal oboe in the local opera orchestra. My daughter didn't tell him about the saxophone until the 2nd or 3rd lesson. he was stunned and finally said he couldn't tell at all. But he kept talking about it at the lessons, which was annoying, so my daughter didn't continue studying with him. And several of the instructors in her youth orchestra gave her a really hard time last year when she auditioned on both oboe and bassoon.
Maybe you can get a job in a European orchestra?
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