 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: SJ
Date: 2002-08-18 03:20
What's all the fuss about the old Kasper mouthpieces? Granted it's a good playing piece,but $300 to $500 bucks on e-bay? I still have two in my parts drawer. Looks like it's E-bay time.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: GBK
Date: 2002-08-18 14:51
(psst)--- They're also V-E-R-Y O-V-E-R P-R-I-C-E-D...GBK
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: GBK
Date: 2002-08-18 15:24
Actually it's the right temporal lobe that's the most important factor in producing a beautiful sound. (way before any mouthpiece, ligature, reed or clarinet)
If your brain doesn't have a good conception of a beautiful sound, all the Kaspar mouthpieces in the world won't do a thing for you...GBK
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2002-08-18 20:44
How, exactly, do you get the clarinet stuck into there?
I have met some serious players that were too dense to make the 'Street Smarts' TV show, and they sounded terrific.
For some things, analytic approaches are detrimental.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: John Gibson
Date: 2002-08-18 22:36
you know....I can't tell you how much I've spent on MPCs....and when I get to the bottom line...the best is the first one I bought when I re-started my playing after 30 some years....a Selmer #3 crystal. Maybe psychological. Don't know. BUT...can tell you, I will never spend more than $100 for a mouthpiece. Kasper or not.
Bought an ancient wooden Buffet with wooden Cap(100 years old?) for $30 and it plays better than any of the dozen or so MPCs purchased in the last 2 years of my re-starting, including Selmer, Vandoren, Portnoy, Genusa, Hite, you name 'em. Found that the Selmer crystal
and the wooden buffet are what work for me. Both combined cost less than $200. Kaspar is a legend to contend with, and may have made a good MPC, but....get real!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ed
Date: 2002-08-19 02:51
I think a lot can be attributed to the fact that people always want what you can't get. Note- I am not saying anything about the quality of these, or other vintage mouthpieces. I agree, some of the prices are insane for a mouthpiece that most people buy sight unseen. You can find crazy bidding on some of the vintage sax mouthpieces as well. I recently saw a NY Meyer alto mouthpiece go for around $2500. Some of these may be great, but there is a lot of great stuff out there. I think that unfortunately, many players think that if they get the perfect mouthpiece, they will sound like player xxxx, or maybe that the horn will play itself. Then, they get into the search for the holy grail.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: HAT
Date: 2002-08-19 12:16
Normally, I don't bother to post on the Kaspar threads, but I recently played two untouched Chicago Kaspars that were the best mouthpieces I have ever played. One in particular I would have paid big big money for on the spot (but it wasn't for sale).
Those of you who know me know that I am not an old mouthpiece person. I have played dozens of Kaspars (only ever owned one and sold it) and never much cared for any of them until these particular ones. There are a LOT of terrible Kaspar mouthpieces out there. Plus more than a few that have been ruined by refacing 'artists,' some of whom even sign their names to these mouthpieces.
I know folks that have paid upwards of $1,000 for H. Chedville mouthpieces. And some of them sound great on them. And I couldn't play them at all. I still haven't played a Ched that worked for me.
There is something unique about a great Kaspar and a Morre reed, but I think you pretty much have to listen to old Marcellus records to appreciate it these days. Listening to great clarinet playing and practicing is probably the only consistent way to develop a great sound. Relying on equipment is wishful thinking.
David Hattner, NYC
www.northbranchrecords.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: David Dow
Date: 2002-08-19 14:06
I own two older Cicero Kaspars which are 13 facings. both of them are now at the anique level in terms of look. Although I have thought of selling them they have more sentimental value as I started playing clarinet on this particuolar facing. Currently, I am using two models, a B40 for Band music --
and my James Kanter A facing which is in orchestra. Every so often we hear the thought that one will sound like Marcellus or blah blah if they play only on a Kaspar. frankly, this is just totally convoluted thinking. Sometimes younger players(not always) tend to become obcessed with the notion theyhave to play the exact equipment that their favorite artist uses. Problems cna arise as a result of embouchure or maybe they just aren't suited to a particular design.
Quite a few years ago a student of mine became totally nuts over Marcellus(which is good) but had to have a Kaspar. Everything in the whole world to him was crap except for a Kaspar. finally he bought one used and then proceeded to play on it! Well the wretched noise this out of whack facing made was terrible. I told him No don't play but get it refaced> ie it squeeked< he proceeded to use it --and now he works in a computer firm selling software. NOt so bad, but quite different. IN spite of my insistence on getting work done and changing mouthpieces he did not listen.
There are also many fine mouthpieces out there these days. Among them Smith and Pynes as well as Gennusa's and Portnoy's.. I personally have found Kanter's work just as fine(over kaspar) and think of more recent models Viotto mouthpieces are exceptional. Harold wright could really play the Chedeville's yet I too found myself not too happy with the overall feel of these. Of course, Mr. Wright(my teacher) had his refaced somewhat and this done by a very reliable expert. Given all this discussion I am sure that Mr. Wright and Marcellus would say "Practice " and stop this endless nonsense. But, if there are some nice Kaspars that work well, proceed and if it works well then don't mess up a good thing! Sincerely D. Dow Symphony NB
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Mark S.
Date: 2002-08-19 15:03
I've got several Kaspars myself (Cicero and Ann Arbor) and yes, they are wonderful, but there is a real danger in relying on them. They are so completely unique, meaning no two are quite the same and nobody has succeeded in copying the design/rubber combo, that staking your career on one is to risk disaster if anything happens to it. I'm sure everyone on this board can cite at least one instance of a one-of-a-kind getting broken at the most inopportune moment. You tune your setup and playing to this treasure, and then it is gone. There are plenty of kick-ass mouthpieces being made new that anyone can buy, and more importantly, replace.
I would say the same thing about the old Cheds as well -- two got me through college. Play "like butter", but same story.
I will close by saying that the truly great clarinetists can make absolute crap sound great. The "magical" mouthpieces, barrels and horns just take the last barrier to truly effortless playing away. HAT's right, it ain't the gear.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Daniel
Date: 2002-08-19 21:24
Kaspar's may be overpriced. I got mine from my teacher for $450, could sell it for $600-$800. But I'm one of the people who is wiling to pay that kind of money for a great vintage mouthpiece. Sure, Greg, Clark, Dan Johnston, Iggy, Ralph, and the others that escape me right now, all make fine mouthpieces. And you'll always find people will swear by any of there work. I even own several of their mouthpieces. Used one of Clark's earlier custom blank models (before he switched to Zinner) for a couple years. And used one of Greg's Eb mouthpieces for 3 or 4 years. But once i found Kaspars that i liked and once i could afford them, i quickly switched. Not that Greg and Clark don't make good mouthpieces. They just don't work as well for me s a good vintage piece.
I agree with Mark S. in the regard that no one has been able to duplicate the Kaspar whatever it is. Whether it be the blanks, the bore, or the facing. As or replacing vintage mouthpieces. I think Kaspar and Chedeville mouthpieces are in fair abundance (my teacher owns ... well.. i'm not sure how many he owns now.... used to be around 6 or so, but then again, he deals Kaspars and plays them exclusively). Sure there are dogs (as every mouthpiece maker makes dogs). But they're usually repairable by a good refacing job.
Gear may not a great clarinetist make, but it sure makes it easier playing gear that works for you, rather than playing something you can't work with.
Daniel
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: HAT
Date: 2002-08-19 23:52
The main thing about these old pieces is getting one that you can play in tune. Even with the amazing ones I tried this summer I had some questions about in terms of keeping the low register down at soft volumes.
Now, if you play in a band you don't have to play soft and exposed in the low register. But if you play chamber music or orchestral music, you do, often.
I just recorded some duets with a flutist which required some microscopically soft low register playing. If I had had the wrong equipment, I would have been totally screwed. I can't imagine changing equipment week to week based on what I have on the schedule, so I need one setup that does everything.
That's the main reason I would never buy an expensive antique like a Kaspar on ebay. The chance that it would work in an extremely sensitive situation is too remote. Of course, this would apply to all mouthpieces on ebay, not just old ones.
Incidentally, Marcellus never helped too many people find Kaspars. . never loaned his out as far as I know. In fact, when I was in school he was playing quite often on a Gigliotti P (I played a wonderful P34 through 3 1/2 years of studying with him and he liked that mouthpiece very much). Guess how he sounded on it?
David Hattner, NYC
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2002-08-20 12:38
There are three entirely different issues at work here;
Will playing with the same stick as Gretzky make you a goal scorer?
No... skating every night for twenty years does that.
Will skating every night for twenty years pave the way to the NHL?
No... that takes commitment and love for your game.
Is it worthwhile to pursue the best gear?
Only if it makes the game easier without bankruptcy filings.
********
How much time (money is congealed time) is this worth?
Does having the gizmo build your confidence?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: David Dow
Date: 2002-08-20 14:30
Totally in accord with SB above on the statements made. The realization that there are plenty of fine mouthpieces out there both used and new really makes life alot easier than going out and trying to find some old Kaspar that is green and may be in rough shape.
Greg Smith makes a heck of a fine copy of the 13 facing and the ones I have tried are superb and have the hold in the sound typical of Kaspar's work. This is a tribute to some of the great work going on out there. We live in the time when nostagia buffs are the norm and anyone who is recent or current things are considered out of step..look at movies--Austin Powers, the 70s show and all this. Then add this into the makeup of music and everyone wants to be in Chicago or Cleveland (in their mind in the year of 62)
or something akin to this. Nowadays we have better overall craftsmanship when you consider all the junk that was out there in the old days.
I tell you I grew up in the 70s and I defintely think we had fine music and stuff but a Kaspar or a vintage mouthpiece is not going to make me any better. The Vandoren M15 is a great mouthpiece and if someone trys them they will be surprised how good they are for the price. Individuality in playing is what music is all about, and when people's mind are vacant in musical thought they resort to downright copying their favorite artist. This is a total dead end becuase a musician who is professional must work within the context of the situation they play in. when I play Beethoven 6 in orchestra I don't stop the conductor and say"Hey this is wrong, Szell doesn't ritard here, " Or "Look on trhe record at home with Reiner I don't hear as much oboe in the texture". These recordings are part of a musical legacy that belongs to us all. And yes Solti and Barenboim and Haitink are just as great for different reasons. The same goes for individual artists.
Kaspar's are quite nice and play well but again we can't go back in time and expect because we play on something from that time it will magically rub off on us. If you find a good Kaspar great, but the mouthpiece is not the battle. The imagination of your own playing is where you must succeed in music.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
