 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Lynda
Date: 2002-07-26 06:46
Is a Yamaha 640 considered a "Professional" level clarinet, as the advertising says?
Is the 640 being replaced by the 650?
Can anyone tell me what the difference between the 2 is?
Do you know of any music stores in the SF Bay Area that carry these instruments?
Thanks, Lynda
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Author: Ed
Date: 2002-07-26 13:08
check to see if the yamaha web site has any info
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2002-07-26 13:54
There are so many Yamaha web sites and it can be very difficult to find the information one wants.
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-07-26 22:21
Do you mean a model 64? I don't think there is a 640. The 650 does appear to replace the 64. At the Woodwind & Brasswind, the 64 is $100 less than the 650 "while supplies last." Woodwind and Brasswind lists the 64 and the 650 among their professional instruments but they also include the Selmer Prologue, Leblanc Esprit and Buffet E13 in this category (ususally describing them as "entry-level" professional models -- I guess they have decided that "entry-level" professional sounds better than "high-end" intermediate lol). If price is any indication, though, I think "high-end intermediate" might be a more accurate designation and I think that is how most professional clarinetists would regard them. Most all of these instruments sell in the $1,100 - $1,200 range. I also note that (except for the E13) WW&BW discloses all their prices while they generally do not disclose prices for the higher-end instruments (i.e., those starting around $1,600 - $1,700 and up). This would be another indication that the instruments are considered more like intermediates. IMO, the true Yamaha professional models are the V-Series Custom Clarinets.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Vytas
Date: 2002-07-27 02:14
Yamaha clarinets:
Series 2X or 2XX = Standard
Series 3X = Standard/Intermediate
Series 5X = Intermediate
Series 6X or 6XX = Professional Standard
Series 7X = Professional hand crafted
Series 8X = Professional/Custom made
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-07-27 17:58
Vytas,
I know that Yamaha calls the 650 a professional model. That does't necessarily mean that it is comparable to clarinets that most experienced clarinetists (with no vested interest) would classify as "professional" (i.e., acceptable for use in any professional setting, including a major symphony orchestra). Under that criterion, I believe that most professional clarinetists would classify the R13 or an equivalent model from Buffet or any of its competitors as the minimum standard. The 650 may be a fine instrument that will serve most amateurs and clarinet doublers all their lives. I don't know of any serious high-profile professional clarinetists who use the 650, however. They may exist and, if you can provide a reasonable list of such individuals, or even a list of Yamaha artists/clinicians who use this model as their primary instrument, you can convince me that I am wrong in my assessment.
It seems clear from its price point that Yamaha intends this instrument to compete with the E13 and other similar instruments. Buffet has indicated in the past that the primary difference between the E13 and the R13 is that the R13 receives more individual attention and hand finishing. That sounds alot to me like the difference between "standard" and "hand crafted." Yamaha's referring to the instrument as "professional" sounds like a marketing department call to me. It allows someone who can only afford a $1,200 instrument to have a "professional" model. I find it interesting that Buffet (Boosey?) now chooses to identify the E13 as a "student" model perhaps feeling that parents who can afford it will want to purchase the best student model available for their child. (I don't have sales figures but I suspect Buffet sells alot more student wooden clarinets than Yamaha.)
So, Lynda, you have two points of view. Vytas', which appears to be based on what Yamaha chooses to call the model and mine, based on the location of the model in Yamaha's product line. If you're selling, go with Yamaha's designation. You won't be lying to prospective buyers and "professional" sounds better than "high-end intermediate." If you're buying, though, you might want to consider what I have said. This model is not intended to compete directly with the R13 (though, to satisfy political correctness, I must now add the qualifier that instruments are individuals and occasionally a particularly good 650 (64) may outplay a particularly bad CSV (or CS or 72 or R13).
But Vytas, if you believe so strongly in accepting manufacturers' designations of their models, rather than looking at where the models fit in the maker's product line, why did you advertise the Evette & Schaeffer you recently sold on eBay as "a high-end intermediate model comparable to the E13 clarinet now" when the classification for the E13 and the Evette & Schaeffer at the Boosey & Hawkes website is "student model"? Not to mention that the current E13 has a quite different bore and key design than your possibly 70+ year old E&S. Surely not to induce buyers to pay a little more. Right?
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2002-07-27 18:44
A correction to my previous message. I just visited a site with more detailed information about the 650. That site indicated that the 650 receives a considerable amount of hand finishing, including hand-undercut tone holes. That may be a change from the older 64. It doesn't change my overall assessment, however.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: Vytas
Date: 2002-07-28 16:48
Jack wrote:
>I think "high-end intermediate" might be a more accurate....<
>I just visited a site with more detailed information about the 650....<
>It doesn't change my overall assessment, however.<
I would avoid assessments like this without even seeing, trying the instrument first. Right Jack?
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Author: Jim S.
Date: 2002-07-29 22:13
I think Vytas is sensitive about generalization regarding used instruments (whether or not they are overly broad) because he sells them.
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