 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Augustus
Date: 2001-06-28 03:07
I have recently found an old metal clarinet and bought it really really cheap. At first, I wanted to fix it up and make it sound great, but I found a better idea. A friend of mine used to make lamps out of bad clarinets. I have an idea of how to do it (stick a bulb near where the mouthpiece should be then put a lamp shade over it) but is there some sort of tutorial on how to make a great clarinet lamp?
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Author: Jim
Date: 2001-06-28 03:31
Get thee to a lamp parts store, stained glass supply store (they often sell lamp parts) electrical supply house, decent hardware store, or a home center. (Assuming you will orient the horn vertically, bell down,) minimum you will need a base, (purchased in metal, or fabricated from wood, or improvise from found objects,) a washer to cap the mouthpiece end, a piece of threaded lamp pipe (1/4 I.P.) longer than the base, horn and base of a socket combined (buy it long and cut with a hacksaw) assorted nuts and washers (1/4 I.P.) a cordset and socket, felt or rubber stick on feet for the base and a shade (clip on type is easiest, or have them sell you a lamp harp and finial.) Get the sales person to show you how these parts go together. Its really fairly easy! Remember, never work on any lamp or electrical equip. unless it is UNPLUGGED! Good luck, post a picture!
(I'm going to have to get myself an unplayable horn and make my own lamp!)
Actually, the Bflat is a little long for a table lamp, I'll bet an Eflat soprano would be perfect.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-06-28 05:37
If a clarinet can be made playable with reasonable effort, it doesn't deserve to be turned into a lamp.
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Author: Cass
Date: 2001-06-28 12:31
I agree with Dee. Those clarinet lamps give me the creeps. My husband saw one for sale and he asked me if I wanted one for Christmas. I was soooo glad he didn't just get me one as a surprise because I would have hated it. I would have been thinking about a kid with no clarinet and that instrument going to waste.
People reading this can use computers, have some money to spend and they think carefully about what is the best clarinet to buy and all the options. For a lot of kids it is just a question of getting any clarinet at all. The "junk" somebody makes a lamp out of could give music to a student who can't get something new or high quality used. That's why I took my old Artley and gave it to my son's school when music stores refused to take it as a trade in.
I thought about just giving it to Salvation Army and then I thought no, somebody is going to make one of those ugly lamps if I do that. The band teacher was glad to get it even though it is basically no good. He needs a loan clarinet for students with a clarinet in the repair shop or stolen and he repads old clarinets in his spare time that the school can sell for just enough so the child won't be humiliated by taking a charity. The money of $30 or $35 repays the teacher's cost for pads and corks and the money if he bought the clarinet. He buys cast off instruments at flea markets. Half his band has these old trumpets and clarinets he scrounged. They sound good too, considering the age of the kids.
I wanted my son to start on a better clarinet than my old one and I'm glad I have the means to do that. Maybe a lot of people wouldn't want that old Artley. Frankly I don't! But I wanted it when I was 10 years old. If we didn't already have it in the family I wouldn't be playing clarinet today. So think about donating an old clarinet to a student or a school district where they don't have a lot of money.
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Author: J. Exner
Date: 2001-06-28 12:41
My husband has made lamps out of several old metal clarinets and out of half of one old Bundy Mazzeo (you're right--the whole thing is too tall!) Recently, he made a lamp out of an old Wurlitzer Alto Sax. Believe me, these instruments are much better off as lamps!
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-06-28 14:03
To keep dead instruments that are no worth servicing alive is to set up some poor kid to give up learning, thinking himself a failure when it was actually the instrument that failed him. So why not turn those ones into lamp stands.
I have a number here that I have even paid a little for just to altruistically get them out of circulation. Nobody seems to ever trash the junk - it just keeps on turning up, for either more rejection by a repairer, or as an enticement for him to lose money on a resuscitation attempt. And every time these are sold anther buyer becomes a sucker.
Any other suggestion for what to do with them? The parts are usually rather useless. Who wants another Lark F/C key!
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Author: David
Date: 2001-06-28 15:15
I see both points of veiw for the lamps. If a clarinet is just beyond hope, lamps are good ideas. But if it cost more to make the lamp then it does to get the clarinet fixed, then by all means turn it in for repairs!! Most people who buy the clarinet lamps are (gasp) interested in clarinets. They may already have a clarinet that they play. They should be encouraged to play that instrument. It might give them more psychological encouragement to have a lamp with a clarinet as a post. Who knows? Humans think funny.
I agree with what you're saying, Gordon. Some instruments do better good on display then actually being played. But you might be able to experiment with your other old clarinets, swapping parts that can be swapped, tightening things that can be tightened, and you might be able to salvage one halfway decent clarinet out of four really bad ones. honestly, who needs FOUR clarinet lamps? It would definitely be fun and kill some time.
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Author: ron b
Date: 2001-06-28 15:46
Anyone -
I've seen some instrument lamps, clarinet, trumpet, slide trumpet. I could understand it, *maybe*, if the horn was a really bad off Lark, Parrot, Rhythm etc., eh... to the point of being absolutely dead. But, often they're not :( Some of those, aome name brand instruments too, would have a few more years of playability, good playability, left in them. Instead, they're impaled onto a lamp base, plugged into a wall socket. Clever idea : (uh... right). Lamp shades on musical instruments remind me of once a year cartoon drunks on New Year's Eve. 'Cute', I mumble with a sigh thinking of the kid I know whose parents can't afford an instrument. If you had seen the light in that young person's eyes when they gave her a restored Vito you'd understand my feelings about this subject.
- ron b -
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Author: William
Date: 2001-06-28 16:11
Have you ever seen the look on a young persons face who would love to be playing in the high school band but cannot because neither he/she or their parents cannot afford to purchase the instrument needed? I have--TOO MANY TIMES. One of the biggest "drop out" factors affecting student going from my middle school (where no kids hands were ever left empty--we had a large supply of instruments for rent, or for free, depending upon home circumstances) to our high school, was not the demanding curriculum or class scheduling, but the lack of instruments available for use It always bothers me when I go to our local art fair and see this one "artists" display of lamps, book ends, flower pots, etc made from musical instruments that most probably could have been repaired and placed in the hands of one of these young musicians, hands left empty by poverty. I am also dismayed to see instruments hanging on the wall for display purposes (like a Hard Rock Cafes and other resturants) or to learn of instruments sitting idle in someones closet collecting dust instead of making music. . Many people, knowing that I am a former educator, will often ask me what an instrument "is worth," and my response is always, donate it to your local school and take it as a charitable write-off on your income tax form (which can be almost double what they would get actually selling it in the newspaper, garage sale or as a lamp!!!). MAKE A DONATION AND MAKE A DIFFERENCE in some young persons life. Good Clarineting!!!! (or whatever instrument you can give)
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Author: connie
Date: 2001-06-28 21:19
You guys are really hard on innocent posters, sometimes. The guy wants to make a lamp, let him. I bought a trashy plastic cracked DEFINITELY unplayable horn, and made my own lamp. Personally, I like the black w/silver keys better than the metal lamps.
Augustus...I got a Lamp Kit at Lowe's for about $6. This had the cord, the switch, and some different sized connector things that fit into the barrel. It was intended to be used to make a lamp out of a bottle. I bought an unfinished wood plaque at Michael's and painted it black. I drilled a "tunnel" from the edge to about the middle of it, so the cord could come out of the middle of the base, and then I drilled a hole slightly off-center of the base down to the tunnel. I drilled a 3/8" hole in the center, and glued a 3/8" dowel into the hole. The clarinet sits on the base with the dowel extending almost up to the register key...this gives it stability. The lamp socket sits on top of the barrel, with the cord running down thru the clarinet, thru the off-center hole, thru the tunnel, out the side of the base. I bought a lampshade from KMart, but it's too small, and I want to get a bigger one. But the whole project, including clarinet, cost me less than $30. It is a little tall, but it sits on top of my piano and seems ok there.
If I lost you with my directions, email me and I'll try to answer any questions.
Gordon,
This particular clarinet is one that would only make some poor kid suicidal. It is
WAY past its useful life (if it ever had one) as an instrument for making music.
connie
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-06-28 23:29
Everyone concedes that something drastically broken is not a candidate for restoration but I've seen some very good clarinets that have been made into lamps and that is depressing.
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Author: jim lande
Date: 2001-06-29 01:22
Wood or plastic clarinets would work better than a metal clarinet because silver
plating tarnishes very quickly. Lacquer would help.
How to make one: put a light bulb on the end and then stick it where the sun don't
shine. (Well, you don't need a lamp where the sun does shine.)
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Author: Leanne
Date: 2001-06-29 05:07
The repair tech in town's house is kind of creepy. Not only does he have the clarinet lamp, he has a french horn lawn ornament. I get the same feeling when I walk into a cemetary. But maybe it's worse, because I wonder...could those instruments be any good? I don't really have that thought of "are these people still alive?" in a cemetary. That would be scary, but anyway, it's the same kind of thing.
A friend found a clarinet in the dumpster a few years back. I thought it would make a nice lamp when she had me look at it. Turns out, it works! It's not the world's greatest machinery, but with someone with her goals (playing strictly for fun) it works for her. Everytime I see one of those lamps, I think of that.
Not that I have anything against the lamps, they do look nice, but it's too bad that the clarinets are, in essence, being wasted.
On the other hand, maybe we have found a use for all of those Chinese clarinets that end up on Ebay.
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Author: willie
Date: 2001-06-29 06:42
I think an instrument that can be salvaged should be. A couple years ago we had 63 kids sign up for beginners band. After two months, half dropped out because the school had no instruments for them to use and their parents couldn't afford one. I started collecting old collecting old clarinets, flutes, cornets, etc. and fixed them up. most of the kids who got these are still in band and doing well. A couple were returned to me and I passed them on to some of the "new bunch", but only after the local music stores have had a chance to sell or rent one of the newer models. Not all schools have the money for a big band program, but just a few miles away you will find a school with a half dozen new Prestige basses complete with Bay necks and mouthpieces. So if you have an old instrument that may be salvagable, I suggest finding a school that needs it. There are plenty out there.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-06-29 08:41
I have enough bits to make many lamps.
They are very, very close to useless as spare parts. This is because apart from a very few models, all keys and other metal parts on clarinets are mendable; replacements are not needed. It is really only the pivot screws that may have a use, and these accumulate faster than they are used.
Mny instrumnets are definitely not worth repairing, although to the average player this would never be VISUALLY apparent. So why get so emotional about clarinets that are as dead as write-off motor vehicle. Just because a kid gets sad seeing the vehicles there in heaps it does not mean that they should not have been put there. At least as lamps they may inspire somebody to play.
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Author: Cass
Date: 2001-06-29 12:34
The child can't play the lamp. I don't see much inspiring about that. The way I look at it, it is best to give a child a good student clarinet. No argument about that. But if the child has no instrument at all, then there is a 100 percent chance that child is discouraged. He or she has no chance at all of learning an instrument. A worn out old clarinet at least gives a child a chance to prove to the parents that this is a serious interest. Lots of parents start out saying music is a frill and they can't afford it. If a child has talent the band director can sometimes convince the parents later that it really is worthwhile saving up for a better instrument. Or later on the student can get a job and pay for it.
I can hear the results for myself in the grade school band. Those kids half of them are playing cast offs, but they sound as good as bands from rich school districts. They have an inspiring teacher. He would rather have all his kids playing the best, who wouldn't? But he makes do and the kids make do and they do all right. We have had kids from there who started on junk instruments go on to play professionally. Too bad they had to start out on junk, but I think it's patronizing to say if they can't do any better than that then they should have nothing. Let them decide and I bet you, they will jump at the chance to play. Kids are not as easy to discourage with a poor instrument as some people think. The old used Artley I inherited from my aunt never discouraged me even though I stepped up to better quality the minute I could manage it. If we're serious about music then a poor instrument doesn't discourage us, it inspires us to work harder and get a better one.
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Author: David
Date: 2001-06-29 17:53
That's what I don't get. Define "beyond hope". Not very many people can just determine whether a clarinet is worth making a lamp out of by playing it or looking at it. Not many repair shops can do that either. It's all in perspective. I agree that it's sad taking a brand-new name-brand clarnet and fixin it up as a lamp, yes, but the old ones that are literally not playable? I have an old wooden clarnet like that. It needs entirely new padwork, the wood is cracked in more than one place, almost literally slplitting the thing in half inside, and most of the keys are visibly bent and without any spring mechanism. It would probably cost less to MAKE a new clarinet than to repair everything on it. The best thing that we can do for it is put it on display as a "monument". I think of it as paying a dead clarinet it's respects with a proper burial. But why bury a living infant?
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Author: Bob Curtis
Date: 2001-06-30 15:37
Question for all -- What would you tell a young beginning student who came to you and told you that his aunt gave him a clarinet which was owned by his departed great-uncle and she wanted him to learn how to play it? You look at the case and it doesn't lool like anything you have ever seen before. You open the case and you discover an old Albert system clarinet, which probably no instruction books are written for anymore. Upon further examination you also discover that some of the keys are missing and trying to find parts are going to be like looking for chickens teeth. You tell him to get it fixed anyway so that he will have a "good instrument" on which to learn to play?
Not this guy!! I have tried to do this twice in my life and swore that I would never do it again! Any beginner, I don't care who he/she is, needs a good, respectable instrument (not necessarily the most expensive) to start on, one on which they can LEARN EASILY without the frustration of not being able to get the sounds out because or the INSTRUMENT!!! Yes, many instruments can be brought back to life, but let's be practical. Some are just not worth saving because of the quality of the instrument to start off with, and some bacause they have outlived their time (Albert system, for instance, in the US and many other countries). Rather than junk them, they could be put to a practical and perhaps made into a conversational piece in which the owner might use them to inject a historical lesson upon the uninitiated. Think about it!
That is exactly the advise I gave the young man and his parents mentioned above. They did not know what they had, nor what it would cost, nor the worry and trouble he would have in TRYING to learn to play the instrument even if we could get it repaired. I explained the situation very carefully to them and they agreed wholeheartedly with me. We made arrangements with a music company to rent a new instrument for him for his first year in band.
Bob Curtis
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-06-30 20:50
Bob, you did exactly the right thing. This is really quite a different circumstance than we had been discussing up to this point. Such an instrument should be displayed or something like that. I might even concede that this one could be made into a lamp although clarinet lamps are rather ugly since they are too thin for their height and the keys make the lamp stem look too "busy."
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Author: Augustus
Date: 2001-07-01 05:22
geez! some replies! well, my clarinet tutor tells me i should just use this clarinet as a baseball bat instead. I am doing it a favor by making it a lamp.
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Author: Augustus
Date: 2001-07-01 05:26
btw, this clarinet that i'm making a lamp out of is beyond repair. dents in the bell (it's metal), missing keys, etc.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-07-01 10:50
It is a common scenario. It LOOKS like an OK clarinet. All pads are stuffed! It can sort of play (if one can already play the clarinet) from first space F to throat Bb. To make it play the other notes needs a full repad. After the repad its value will be less than the cost of the repad. To encourage the repair is an irresponsible. It is waste of money which should be put towards an instrument that plays or is worth making playable. It is a lamp clarinet, or a baseball bat. Those who think all clarinets are worth keeping going seem to have no idea how bad a clarinet can be.
Even a B&H Regent (which play great when working properly) in good condition but with a 2 or 3 broken, non-mendable, muck-metal keys is not worth working on unless cheap replacement keys are freely and cheaply available. In my experience the ones that break easily are now almost impossible to find, and the attempt may be very expensive in time. I have adapted Yamaha keys and regretted it when the instrument soon comes back with another broken key.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-07-01 12:04
An out of production clarinet with missing or broken keys would be one of those not worth trying to repair regardless of whether it is metal, plastic, wood, beginner, pro or whatever. This is the first time that Augustus has indicated what type of problems that this instrument has.
Actually by your definition, no used beginner's clarinet of any kind would ever be worth giving a complete overhaul as its value will be less than the cost of that overhaul, at least in this country. Although a new instrument would cost more than the used one, it isn't that much more. So should all beginner horns go on the trash heap if they get to the point of needing a complete overhaul?
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Author: Joseph O'Kelly
Date: 2001-07-01 16:30
Wouln't those beginer clarinets that need a complete overhaul be great to learn how to repair instruments on? A set of pads is only $15 at the woodwind and brasswind.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-07-02 12:32
That could frequently be the financial reality, Dee, but in practice, here where expertise seems cheaper to buy, I condemn very few instruments. They are Chinese with extremely soft key metal and need repadding, or the Regents (or their close relations) with broken muck-metal keys, or instruments that are so badly made, or so worn, that pivots are extremely sloppy to the extent that a cure would probably involve filling &/or extending the ends of pivot parts with silver and redrilling, often combined with correction of a huge range of other mechanical deficiencies, rusted pivots etc.
Now that we know the clarinet is metal I am reminded of the metal G-Clarinets common in Turkey. They keys are muck-metal, the key cups do not align with tone holes (and the keys will break if this is corrected, the tone hole soldering fails, the keys wobble a millimetre or more on their pivots, .........
I learnt my lesson once. Never again! Definitely lamp stand material.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2001-07-02 12:52
Gordon (NZ) wrote:
>
> Now that we know the clarinet is metal ...
Although Augustus' horn does sound beyond redemption, do not condemn metal clarinets out of hand just because of the Turkish G clarinets. There were some fine quality metal ones made by the major makers. I have a very nice Noblet metal instrument. Although needing new pads, it does play in its current condition and is very well made, quality material and construction throughout. This was probably an intermediate level clarinet. There were many sturdy, adequate student grade clarinets available at one time here in the US. Some of these student ones, although not financially worth restoring, are of decent enough quality and in good enough condition that they are worth it just for the fun of it and to have a piece of functioning clarinet history. The few pro ones made, especially the double wall, solid silver Haynes, were reputed to be excellent and are now quite valuable and well worth restoring.
My point is that each instrument must be evaluated on a case by case basis on whether to fix it or not.
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Author: David
Date: 2001-07-02 17:23
It's kind of funny how this topic went from the simple question of how to make a lamp to a full-fledged debate of whether that making of the lamp is ethical. I think that everyone on this site would make excellent politicians and lawyers. At least everyone in office would be able to at least play the clarinet a little.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2001-07-03 13:21
I hope you were not inferring that I was implying that all metal clarinets are as bad as a Turkish G-clarinet. No way.
Bye the way it is common indeed (in my limited experience) to have soldering parting on the tone holes of metal clarinets.
This can be a difficult problem to fix because the heat needed to remove and resolder one tone hole is quite likely to to be the final straw for corrosion getting the better of the joints for the neighbouting tone holes.
A single skin metal clarinet bends (flexes) very easily, and this bending is very hard on the soldering of the tone holes.
A metal clarinet thus affected with multiple leaks from compromised soldering can quite easily be not worth repairing
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