 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ben1948
Date: 2017-10-10 23:25
I'm playing somewhere in the intermediate level 3 years into beginning to play clarinet at age 66. I take regular lessons, and my teacher says I'd currently be a mid-chair player in an average high school band/orchestra. I play in a church orchestra, and a woodwind quartet/quintet with players from that orchestra--and I love it. I currently play with a Ridenour Lyrique Bb clarinet, with an M13 mouthpiece and a Rovner versa ligature, all else stock. I currently use Legere European Signature 3.75 reeds, which I love, except for all too frequent splits in the tips, which I just posted a separate question about.
I have found that I really like playing jazz and I'm down to the last song in the "Jazz Conception for Saxophone" by Lennie Niehaus which is the second volume of 2 volumes labeled "Basic". I'll be starting a volume labeled "Intermediate" shortly. It is a considerably longer book than the first two. My teacher, Martin Langford, thought these books would work well for clarinet and has been pleased that they do. I'm slowly working my way through the mammoth Klose book for classical.
Do y'all have any opinions about whether I should have different mouthpieces and reed strengths for my classical and jazz play? I've read a great many posts about mouthpieces here and elsewhere, but they have mostly confused me. I would love to see answers posted which reflect what you would recommend for players like me if you were teaching them. Price is not an issue for me if it would actually help make me a better player (yeah, yeah, yeah, I know regular practice and good teaching will do more than anything else! I do practice daily, and take weekly 1 hour lessons).
Ben Withers - began clarinet 2014 at age 66
benjamin.f.withers@gmail.com
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2017-10-11 01:36
There seems to be this misconception that a special 'jazz' mouthpiece is needed to play Jazz. Not really. All you need is a good mouthpiece , say a B40 Lyre or B45, then match a suitable reed to it. Usually a softer type reed , say a 2,5 reed and go for it. A softer type of reed seems to be more suitable for Jazz. Vandoren do make a 'Jazz' mouthpiece (5JB) but I personally found it practically useless for the way I play Jazz. I think Jazz is mostly a feeling from within you.
Skyfacer
Post Edited (2017-10-11 04:51)
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Author: Tony F
Date: 2017-10-11 03:26
I don't believe that you need a different mouthpiece to play jazz. I use the same mouthpiece for everything. I make it sound the way I want it to sound.
Tony F.
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Author: Bob Bernardo
Date: 2017-10-11 14:20
The M13 is not a jazz mouthpiece. Try the B45. or a Selmer HS*
The M13 isn't open enough, nor flexible. You can try the BD5. It way be too open though. Too resistant.
The B45 might be an all around really good mouthpiece.
Designer of - Vintage 1940 Cicero Mouthpieces and the La Vecchia mouthpieces
Yamaha Artist 2015
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Author: sax panther
Date: 2017-10-11 15:24
I don't use a different mouthpiece to play jazz, but if I'm required to do lots of bends/glissing, I do find switching to a slightly softer reed makes it easier for me.
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Author: KenJarczyk
Date: 2017-10-11 22:00
Hello Ben!
It’s always great to hear about anyone wanting to play, regardless of age! I’m already proud of you for advancing quickly.
You have a pretty good clarinet, as I do like Ridenour clarinets. I use my Ridenour Libertas Bb and Ridenour A clarinets quite often, depending on the venue. I also play the Ridenour C in many situations. Very good quality instruments. I also have several other brands of clarinet that I also love to use.
I also have converted to Legere Euro-Cut reeds, on Bb, A, Eb and C.
Anyone who follows my posts would probably already know my extreme dislike of mass-produced mouthpieces, such as D’Addario, Vandoren, etc. I know they serve a good function, and as beginner mouthpieces, they will help steer a player in the direction of where to go. Beyond that, I council against them.
I’m a woodwind player, starting on clarinet 56 years ago, adding all the saxes and flutes as time progressed. Also do an acceptable job on easy oboe stuff, mostly in theater pits. I’ve toured the globe in many groups, many shows, bands and orchestras. I’m not trying to impress any with that, but I believe I do have some type of pedigree in my advice whether here in a forum, or in a studio teaching.
All that to say, one doesn’t really need a dedicated “legit” and a “jazz” mouthpiece. But — it helps to have them if you can afford it, and can flip your brain between genres. In an orchestral setting, my sound concept is different than in a theater pit, or a Concert Band/Wind Ensemble, and definitely different than fronting a Jazz group, or playing in a Jazz group, or Klezmer, for that matter.
For Jazz/Klezmer only settings, I use a Grabner K14 with Legere Euro 3.0.
For pretty much everything I else I’m on a Fobes San Francisco 10K-2L with the Legere Euro 3-1/4 or 3-1/2. (Eb on Fobes or Behn SONO, or Grabner with Euro 3-1/2 or 3-3/4)
Somehow, for Jazz only use, the mouthpieces such as my Grabner K14 really brings out the type of sound needed to truly fulfill that genre. Is it necessary? A lot of folks would probably say no, but proper tools help to make a proper product!
Ken Jarczyk
Woodwinds Specialist
Eb, C, Bb, A & Bass Clarinets
Soprano, Alto, Tenor & Baritone Saxophones
Flute, Alto Flute, Piccolo
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Author: Fuzzy
Date: 2017-10-11 22:17
I'm on the fence on this one. I don't think a jazz mouthpiece in an of itself will be much help...unless you already play jazz fairly well. Then, trying new mouthpieces ("jazz" and "non-jazz" alike) might open a new door for you.
For me, gear in general is dubious. If I think I "need" some piece of gear in order to sound the way I want to sound, surely there are hundreds of people out there (more talented than me) who could pick up my existing gear and produce the sound I think the new gear would give me.
So...personally, I'd just try to obtain the sound I'm looking for using my existing gear, and once I've achieved it - or have come very close to it - then, I'd try a few different gear items to see if any of them make that sound easier for me to produce.
I know everyone approaches these things differently, and comes to different conclusions - but the above is what I've found to be true for me...in instrumental music as well as sports.
Whatever you decide to do, best of luck and have fun!
Fuzzy
;^)>>>
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Author: Matt74
Date: 2017-10-15 01:19
When I was given Lennie Niehaus, like virtually everything I was given, I diddn’t have a clue how it should sound. (Speaking only for myself.) It’s not that I diddn’t listen. It’s just that there are a lot of styles out there.
Hollywood Saxophone Quartet
https://youtu.be/8Tvjted13qw
Lennie Niehaus
https://youtu.be/BYNUG2vr3Cc
Start by making sense of the sound of these and the written music, and figuring how you like your clarinet to sound, inflections and all. Knowing what sound you like will give you a better idea of what mouthpice you might want, if any. For playing in a group you will want something loud.
I like this video. It’s about saxophone embouchure, but it makes a good point.
https://youtu.be/5Oc0VzGBPxY
- Matthew Simington
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Author: NetG
Date: 2017-10-15 01:31
I love my Portnoy BP 02 with a 3 1/2 Mitchell Lurie for jazz stuff...for classical I keep the same mp but switch to a Vandoren reed...usually the 3's but sometimes 2 1/2's. .. I have been using a Yamaha 250 for almost everything jazz oriented lately...but my Buffet E12f is a blast to play jazz on too..hope this helps!
Post Edited (2017-10-15 01:35)
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2017-10-15 03:46
If anybody's interested, the three volumes of "Jazz Conception for Saxophone" now come with attached CDs of a jazz sax player (not Niehaus) performing the etudes in modern jazz style.
Post Edited (2017-10-15 03:47)
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Author: brycon
Date: 2017-10-15 06:48
Jazz Conception is Jim Snidero's book. The accompanying CD has always been Jim's (very fine) playing, as far as I know.
Post Edited (2017-10-15 06:49)
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Author: seabreeze
Date: 2017-10-16 01:21
Brycon,
Two different jazz etude books by two different authors have somehow gotten conflated in this post. Jazz Conception is one book, written, as you say, by Jim Snidero. It was published in 1986 in a single volume for alto or baritone sax.
The second book, referenced by the original poster, is entitled Jazz Conception for Saxophone, written by Lennie Niehaus and published in 1964. It is segmented into three progressively difficult volumes at beginner, intermediate, and advanced levels. The Niehaus books now are bundled with CD recorded performances of all the etudes played by Brian Scanlon, accompanied by a rhythm section. I believe when the Niehaus books were originally published there was no easy way to hear a recording of them performed by a jazz pro, so come uncertainty about the intended performance style might have been a problem for students. With the Scanlon CDs, that problem has been alleviated.
Post Edited (2017-10-16 07:44)
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