 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-05-21 21:44
Dee, David or anybody -
I got a "Buffet" on eBay that seems to be by another maker. Have you ever seen an old Buffet trademark that has the dashed oval, inside of which is "BUFFET" curved across the top, "A" in the middle and "PARIS" curved across the bottom? There's a lyre above the top of the oval and a 5-pointed star below in outline form (no pentagon in the middle). No "Crampon" and no "Auguste." It has a 1-piece body. The serial number is stamped on the back of the single joint at the top, 6115, in larger numbers than is usual for this age. The keys are definitely not the genuine Buffet forging and look crude.
Any ideas?
Ken Shaw
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Author: Rob
Date: 2001-05-21 23:04
I have a similar 1-piece Buffet with a similar imprint. Mine does not have a complete oval. I don;t know if my information will be of any help, but here it is.
From top to bottom, mine appears as follows:
Lyre symbol
BUFFET (slightly curved as in the top of an oval)
A PARIS
GASTONE BINI
PISA
5- Pointed Star symbol
Naturally, I had the same concern as you, that it may be some kind of copy. Additionally, mine does not have any kind of serial number anywhere on the clarinet. I purchased this clarinet in the original case which had printed on the plush lining inside;
Premiatta Ditta
Gastone Bini
Lung Arno Mediceo N. 19
Pisa
Since my Italian is not very good, as best I could figure out, this clarinet was made by Buffet for Gastone Bini, a dealer, in much the same way that they made clainets for Carl Fischer. I figured it was some kind of stencil arrangement. However, unlike what you describe, the keywork on mine is really quite nice, the key action still very good and responsive. I contacted B & H via email numerous times and finally, after about 6 months of annoying them I received a response from them stating that they did indeed manufacture the clarinet in 1926 and that it was a professional grade horn.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2001-05-22 00:29
The mark is attributable to Jean Louis Buffet during the 2nd quarter of the 19th c.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-05-22 13:40
Rob -
Thanks for the info. The instrument I got doesn't have Gastone Bini or any other name on it. I looked it over carefully last night, and it's absolutely not a "real" Buffet Crampon/Auguste Buffet. The keywork isn't even close to the same design, and the workmanship is nowhere near the same standard. While the pads are not "tight," the instrument is playable and is basically student-grade.
Mark -
Thank you, too. The instrument definitely doesn't come from the second quarter of the 19th century. I can't imagine it being earlier than 1900, and the second quarter of the 20th century seems most likely. What else does Langwill say about Jean Louis Buffet?
In this case, old is bad. Live and learn.
Ken Shaw
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Author: willie
Date: 2001-05-23 02:41
During my career in the Coast Guard I've had to open and inspect a lot of cargo containers and crates to seize conterfeit products like designer clothes, fake Rolexs, illegal species and such. I never thought of conterfeit clarinets though. You may have something valuable as to what it is, not what its supposed to be.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 2001-05-23 14:59
Willie -
According to what Mark posted (presumably from Langwill), Jean Louis Buffet was a genuine maker, not a counterfeiter. Just a not particularly good maker.
It occurred to me that it might be a counterfeit, but a counterfeiter would try to match the genuine trademark perfectly, which this one does not, and the keywork is not even close.
I can't imagine the instrument is worth much, if but if anyone is interested I'll list it in the Classifieds. !!!!! R@RE !!!!!! VINT@GE J.L. BUFFET @ P@RIS CL@RIONETTE -- NOT @ BUFFETT CROMPTON, BUT @ R@RE COLLECTERZ YTEM DONT MIS YURE CH@NCE TO OWN THIS M@GNIFICENT PE@CE BID E@RLY AND OFTEN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ken Shaw
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Author: willie
Date: 2001-05-23 16:54
I agree. I have an old oboe that is marked CG Conn and has some American font numbers preceding some European font numbers on it. Nowhere on it does it say made in France. Just the old Conn logo and the Conn brass insert in the bell. It has unusual keywork so I showed it to some techs and a couple oboist and they were puzzled also. One of the oboist later emailed me some pictures of one just like it on eBay made by Henry Farney(sp) made in the early 30s. It is well made and a beautiful tone (not when i play it) . I often wonder if Conn had any of their top of the line clarinets made in France in the same manner.
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