 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: WhitePlainsDave
Date: 2016-03-24 03:21
A poster recently asked a question on transposing that took a turn into the realm of clefs (e.g. treble, tenor, alto, etc.).
Of the instruments out there, it would be fair to say that clarinet--lets say your basic soprano clarinet--has a pretty extensive range, right?
Certainly advanced cello players have to know at least a few clefs: base, tenor, alto, maybe some treble).
Why has clarinet music been written in one clef, with notes that go, compared to other instruments, pretty far below and above the basic 5 line musical staff.
Why weren't clef changes introduced in soprano clarinet music? Might they have kept the notes closer to the 5 line musical staff?
It's just a curiosity thing. Don't get me wrong, treble is my strong clef because this one clef reading for clarinets is what I'm use to. I'm not wishing any convention change.
Post Edited (2016-03-24 03:21)
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Author: kdk
Date: 2016-03-25 02:52
WhitePlainsDave wrote:
> Why has clarinet music been written in one clef, with notes
> that go, compared to other instruments, pretty far below and
> above the basic 5 line musical staff.
>
My violist wife often wishes they'd just use leger lines and stick to alto clef in her parts.
> Why weren't clef changes introduced in soprano clarinet music?
> Might they have kept the notes closer to the 5 line musical
> staff?
Below a certain point, say 3 or maybe 4 leger lines, it isn't so difficult to keep track of them. String instruments go well beyond. For those occasional spots where we go higher than F6 or G6 for any length of time, there's always the octava sign. Bass clarinet parts sometimes change clef, and when they do you're not totally sure at first which octave the treble clef parts are intended to be played in.
Maybe we've been spared clef changes because our normal range in Classical and Romantic music didn't go far enough above the staff to justify it. Twentieth century composers who insist on extending beyond G6 or A7 came to the party too late to affect the prevailing convention.
Karl
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Author: kdk
Date: 2016-03-25 03:00
I actually don't understand why cello parts go through 4 clefs, anyway. The range begins at C2 and by the time you get up to F4 or so, you might just as well use treble (G) clef and forget the C clefs. Viola mostly sticks to alto and treble clefs. The range starts with C3 and by the time you leave the staff you're already at C5, more than halfway up the treble staff.
I think a lot of the clef tradition in string parts has to do with the original assignment of those clefs to vocal parts - where the four clefs were literally assigned to the treble, alto, tenor and bass parts. Transferring the tradition to the four violin-based string instruments (never mind that the bass is a viol, not a violin) probably made more sense in the 17th and 18th centuries than it does to us.
Karl
Post Edited (2016-03-25 03:01)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2016-03-25 07:13
Richard Strauss gets fancy with clefs for bass clarinet parts, starting in bass clef and moving to tenor clef for the higher material.
As for the clef suggestion, perhaps that is more a European tradition. They seem to get a lot more training than we do and clefs are not a problem for them. Remember there are as many C-clefs as you need in addition to alto, tenor, bass.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: concertmaster3
Date: 2016-03-25 09:07
I honestly wish we read more clefs.
Cello actually makes a lot of sense for using tenor clef. One, because of the range, you could easily switch between upper and lower registers by using the tenor clef. Two, the open strings are in similar lines in tenor clef. Open A in tenor is now where open D was in bass. That reason alone makes more sense for cello to use tenor clef over bassoon. I came to this realization much later in life (last year) after teaching one of my cello students to read tenor clef, after already learning it through bassoon first!
I, unlike many clarinet players, prefer reading bass clarinet in bass clef, especially with the low C extension. It just makes more sense...less ledger lines, and when it gets high enough, switch clefs again.
Ron Ford
Woodwind Specialist
Performer/Teacher/Arranger
http://www.RonFordMusic.com
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Author: dorjepismo ★2017
Date: 2016-03-26 18:42
A few Mozart clarinet parts use bass clef, written an octave lower than it sounds. There's a piece with three clarinets, one of which was written in bass clef, that caused Oskar Kroll to express the opinion that it was written for an early bass clarinet, but that view was debunked in an article in the "Groves Dictionary." Sorry I can't remember the piece, but I don't have either Kroll or Groves handy. He might have done that in one of the "Tito" arias written for Stadler, and there's a fragment in the "Neue Mozart Ausgabe" that does that.
Post Edited (2016-03-26 18:44)
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Author: gsurosey
Date: 2016-04-04 01:59
Are there links to bass clarinet parts using tenor clef? My interest is piqued having read bassoon parts on bass clarinet using bass and tenor clefs. Of course, my brain gets all messed up getting a bass clarinet part in bass clef and having to remember not to read it in C.
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Rachel
Clarinet Stash:
Bb/A: Buffet R13
Eb: Bundy
Bass: Royal Global Max
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Author: rmk54
Date: 2016-04-04 16:20
Are there links to bass clarinet parts using tenor clef?Are there links to bass clarinet parts using tenor clef?
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IIRC one of the Honegger symphonies (No.2?) uses tenor clef in the bass clarinet, at least in the score.
As a point of information, cello *never* uses alto clef (pace WPD).
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Author: gsurosey
Date: 2016-04-04 16:42
Should've asked this as part of my previous post, but I assume any tenor clef parts would be in C? I hope so, because that would really mess with my head if not.
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Rachel
Clarinet Stash:
Bb/A: Buffet R13
Eb: Bundy
Bass: Royal Global Max
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Author: kdk
Date: 2016-04-04 16:55
Bass clef parts are in Bb - but only a step higher than sounding pitch, not a ninth as in treble clef parts. I would assume tenor clef wouldn't change the transposition - written C would still sound Bb.
Karl
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Author: Caroline Smale
Date: 2016-04-04 18:49
All clefs are naturally in C. It's only when writing for transposing instruments that the publishers can provide transposed parts and these would be clearly marked on the printed parts with the specified pitch.
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