 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-01-13 11:19
Can a Major 9th chord be written in symbol form as eg. C∆9 instead of CMaj9 (just as a Major 7th is often written as C∆7 or C∆) if space is at a premium?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2014-01-13 13:14)
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2014-01-13 11:57
Referring to Margaret Brandman's two volume book set "The Contemporary Chord Workbook" the correct symbol for the Dominant 7th in the key of C major for example is C7.
The symbols for the chords of a 9th/11th/13th built on the Dominant 7th , these are written as C9, C11, C13.
For the major 7th it is CMaj7.
For the major 9th it is CMaj9. (and CMaj11 and CMaj13)
Brandman's books are very practical 'work' books that take you through all the possible chords and their 'functions' up to the 13ths.
However I don't see any reason why you couldn't , just write the major chord symbols (once again using C major for example) as CM7, CM9, CM11, and CM13. This would be a nice way to abbreviate these.
The minor symbol would therefore become Cm7 ect instead of Cmin7 ect.
Skyfacer
Post Edited (2014-01-13 17:38)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-01-13 13:13
The problem with writing CM9 is the person's handwriting which could be misinterpreted as Cm9 if it's messy or misread as m9 if lighting or eyesight (or both) isn't good - ∆9 shouldn't have that problem depending on the size of the triangle (could be misread as °7 if written too small or not formed properly).
I have just found a couple of sources that say the triangle is used for the Major 9th chord, one of which is here (the other is Jamey Aebersold):
http://www.phillfestmusic.com/decipheringchords.pdf
It's been years since I did Jazz harmony and can't remember if ∆9 was ever used or not - ∆7 is a definite, but I was unsure about ∆9.
Has to be said I've already used it (in Sibelius) as space is a bit limited.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: kilo
Date: 2014-01-13 17:29
C∆9 is used pretty widely; as is C∆ for a CMaj7 — the 7 after the ∆ is redundant. A while back I noticed that the dominant 7th chord was being symbolized with an "x" — instead of C7 it would be Cx, which I thought was a good idea but it doesn't seem to have caught on. As far as CM9 vs Cm9, yes, this can be tricky to read in some fonts. C-9 is often used instead.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-01-13 18:05
I was taught to use the - for minor in chords such as C-9b5 instead of Cm9b5 or Cmi9b5.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2014-01-13 13:39
Chris....stop worrying! Duke Ellington and Wynton Marsalis aren't gonna come in with a red marker and put a giant L on your forehead. I promise. "I was taught to..." doesn't matter much in jazz. Use what works, and what makes sense, man. Trust yourself.
:)
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2014-01-13 19:09
HAHAHA! I realise there are loads of ways to write chord symbols (I would write them according to what I was copying them from and they varied from person to person), but just wanted to be sure that what I've written isn't wrong.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2014-01-13 21:05
Can a Major 9th chord be written in symbol form as eg. C∆9 instead of CMaj9 (just as a Major 7th is often written as C∆7 or C∆) if space is at a premium?
Chris.
Of course it can, and even if space is not at a premium. Don't get snowed by stuffy convention, Chris.
Bruno.
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Author: John Morton
Date: 2014-01-13 17:22
I have spent many hours trying to optimize my chord libraries in Finale. Here are my longwinded conclusions:
For simple harmony I often use long but explicit abbreviations, e.g. Cmaj7, Cmin7, Cdim, Caug, Cmin7b5. All players recognize those promptly.
As Chris writes, the problems occur when it's crowded, in the modern jazz repertoire. First priority goes to quick recognition, which rules out m and M. (Sadly those are very similar in the widely used Siegler "jazz font".)
The "-" is widely recognized for minor, and uses the same space as an "m". It means the minor 3rd if it follows the chord root symbol. Unfortunately it is often used (as superscript) in extended chords to mean a "lowered" or "flatted" tone. Whoever does that probably uses "+" for "raised". Which in turn can be confused with "add" (meaning add that tone to the chord, not add the tone and raise it). This is where I get out of my depth.
When I sight read I acknowledge what immediately follows the root symbol - if there's more, that's for further rehearsal. And really, I think most of it is for the piano player! That said, here's what I use when it's tight:
no symbol (default) for major triad
- for minor
triangle for major 7th (the added "7" is redundant, but some say necessary)
triangle 9 for major 9th
a small circle (or lower case o) for diminished
+ for augmented
slashed circle for half-diminished (m7b5)
# or b for raised or lowered, as superscript in an extended chord
When there are 4 extended chords in one measure, I stagger the symbols so they overlap, e.g. 1st chord high, 2nd low, 3rd high, 4th low.
John, with a touch of OCD
Post Edited (2014-01-13 17:28)
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Author: Barry Vincent
Date: 2014-01-13 22:39
* Corrected an error in my typing above.
Maj, NOT Mag.
Skyfacer
Post Edited (2014-01-13 17:41)
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