 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: tonyscarr
Date: 2013-01-16 19:36
What impact do you think practicing beginning jazz clarinet is likely to have on my classical playing?
Tony Scarr
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Author: GBK
Date: 2013-01-16 20:25
It increases your ability to make money playing clarinet by about 1000%.
...GBK
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Author: Paula S
Date: 2013-01-16 20:47
Relaxes your embouchure, does wonders for your Brahms............. everyone should try it....... best thing I ever did ;-)
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Author: Buster
Date: 2013-01-16 21:43
Come on guys, there is far more to playing jazz than merely adding vibrato, bends, glissandi and what not; and listening to skilled jazz musicians will bear out a key fact glossed over by many- these tonal modulations are only effective when used in a manner that reflects the text, if there is any; or is "hand in hand" with the relationship between the melodic line and harmonic progression.
The ability to manipulate the sound to achieve these "affects" that are typical in jazz can indeed help your Brahms and Mozart; I can't see any harm coming from gaining flexibility in your approach to the clarinet!.... though learning all these "techniques" only to not use them outside of the laboratory setting may be one of the most beneficial results that comes to light.
Practicing improvisation, which is a sorely misunderstood pursuit, will most definitely help your ability to more clearly understand the structure of classical compositions. You learn to "hear" how your part in a larger-scale work interacts with other voices, the harmonic context, and the large-scale structure itself. And you can approach score study with an even keener eye.
-Jason
Post Edited (2013-01-16 21:54)
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2013-01-17 17:58
I think jazz would be good for your classical playing.
Frankly, I'd be more worried about what Artie Shaw called the 'arbitrary' rules of classical clarinet playing obstructing your jazz.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: Buster
Date: 2013-01-19 00:26
(You stirring the pot next to my woodshed now E? How'd you find it so easily? I thought I was holed up in a much more secluded spot.)
-Jason
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Author: Paula S
Date: 2013-01-19 18:39
You two boys crack me up! Have major respect for both of you. I am not sure you realise how much you have taught me :-)
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2013-01-19 22:46
Hi Jason, Could you elaborate on this a bit? " Practicing improvisation, which is a sorely misunderstood pursuit". How is it misunderstood?
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: Buster
Date: 2013-01-19 23:54
Arnoldstang wrote:
> Hi Jason, Could you elaborate on this a bit? " Practicing
> improvisation, which is a sorely misunderstood pursuit". How
> is it misunderstood?
>
Absolutely! But I am a bit short on time at the moment... give me a day or so to gather my thoughts and respond with a bit more clarity.
I see that that was a bit of a bold statement, and does need some explanation on my end; but I think the subject is worth exploring.
Those delving into jazz and "classical" music alike can hopefully benefit as I have from exploring both arenas myself.
-Jason
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Author: brycon
Date: 2013-01-20 03:43
Quote:
Absolutely! But I am a bit short on time at the moment... give me a day or so to gather my thoughts and respond with a bit more clarity.
I see that that was a bit of a bold statement, and does need some explanation on my end; but I think the subject is worth exploring.
Those delving into jazz and "classical" music alike can hopefully benefit as I have from exploring both arenas myself.
Looking forward to this. I was going to make some comments, but will definitely wait to hear your offering.
I felt your thoughts on tonal inflections were spot on. I have had so many saxophone students (and a few clarinet students) come to lessons wanting to learn jazz, usually under the impression that it consists of little more than heavy-handedly throwing scoops and bends onto some music. However, if they would approach their practicing of jazz with more care, I think that the acquired skills could greatly improve their classical playing.
Developing a solid swing-feel; placing notes within the front, center, or back of a beat; being able to place stronger beats on two/four or one/three; being able to hear/imagine chord progressions while playing melodic lines are all necessary skills for a jazz musician that could nonetheless improve one's classical playing (they should really be considered necessary skills for a classical musician too).
This is, of course, to say nothing of improvisation (which I am looking forward to discussing).
To bring this back to the OP, the sort of practicing that allows one to acquire these skills is time consuming. So if by practicing you mean reading through some jazz etudes or fake books, I think your classical playing would not necessarily be improved or harmed, but if by practicing you mean months or years of listening, transcribing, and earnest practicing, I think your classical playing could be greatly improved.
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2013-01-21 14:58
Paula--
A while back I promised to try and post a sample of what a Selmer CT sounds like--I forget the thread, but since this thread is related to jazz clarinet, thought I would post the link here.
https://soundcloud.com/#marlborough-man/dr-livingstone-i-presume
I don't have good recording equipment, and I've had a lot of trouble blowing out mics...this is a transcription of Artie Shaw's live version of the solo from "Dr. Livingstone, I Presume"--it's one of those solos I use as a "test" solo on any clarinet I try to play. I made it on a small hand held digital recorder, placed in another room, so as not to blow out the mic...despite all that, it at least gives some idea of a CT's flexibility, "hold" and power.
To relate this to the OP a bit more seriously than my earlier post...depending on how far you take jazz clarinet, and what you want to accomplish, it could very well force a choice between your classical technique and jazz technique. To play the way I do on "Dr. Livingstone" made it impossible (for me) to play a standard classical set-up, at least the American style setup.
Having said that, there are so many ways to approach both jazz and classical, you don't have to be bothered by "one style". For me, Artie's approach to the horn was my path. Not for everyone, though--and many great jazz players have gone different directions.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
Post Edited (2013-01-21 15:22)
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Author: Paula S
Date: 2013-01-21 23:40
Wow thanks Eric, I really love your sound on that CT :-)
I also love having a go at jazz even though I am a humble amateur. I have been playing the Artie Shaw for about 7 months now as well as the Gershwin Preludes. If you remember my first mission after reuniting myself with the clarinet was to get to grips with altissimo. I listened to people who made it seem a breeze and obviously Artie Shaw was way up there.
I played in my bedroom and sent my husband outside in my summer holiday and squealed and sqawked away until it began to sound half decent ![[happy]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smiley12.gif)
I can't quite believe it but I can get all the notes in the Artie Shaw including a clear alt C at the end on my Bb clarinet. Jazz just relaxes me and helps me 'feel' my way up there. I do my own home-made versions of glisses and slurs but I will make an effort to learn how to do them properly soon ;-)
You will either laugh or cry but I have also played the Artie Shaw on the Clarineo and Eb clarinet and made my poor husband transpose/improvise the piano part up . On the clarineo I can get the alt C most of the time and on the Eb quite often. It is an absolute hoot! It makes it feel much easier on the Bb when I go back to it ;-)
I can't imagine playing some of the classical pieces such as the Brahms, Ireland etc............ now without having experienced some of the flexibility that you can gain from just having a go at jazz.
I have tried to record some of my playing but as you say it is quite dlifficult to record some of the altissimo notes. Hopefully once I have solved the technical issues I may get brave enough to post an example. ;-) Anyone who plays clarinet must have a go at jazz!!!!
Post Edited (2013-01-21 23:50)
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2013-01-22 00:05
"You will either laugh or cry but I have also played the Artie Shaw on the Clarineo and Eb clarinet and made my poor husband transpose/improvise the piano part up"
That's pretty extreme, Paula! Your husband's one rare dude. My wife digs my playing, but I'm not sure she'd be down with me playing it on eefer. I don't intend to try it, either!
The craziest experience I ever had with the Shaw Concerto was when I was about fifteen years old. I thought I was such a hotshot playing that piece--until I took it in to Jerome Callet's trumpet studio in NYC. Jerry is a unique guy--he's pretty well known in the brass world as a maker of custom trumpets and an altissimo trumpet guru--well, he used to talk to me about clarinet embouchure, and encourage me to develop my own ideas (looking back, Jerry was a greater influence on my playing than any clarinet teacher).
That day, he pulled out a Bb trumpet and played along with me--the entire Shaw Concerto, note for note, glissandi and all, in unison. I've never heard anything like it before, and doubt I ever will again.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2013-01-22 00:45
Eric, I employ what I believe is a basic technique from Callet in my flute embouchure. I just took the TCE(Tongue Controlled Embouchure) and applied it to flute. It works for me. Unfortunately it doesn't transfer to clarinet.
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: MarlboroughMan
Date: 2013-01-22 02:49
Very cool John! I knew he was interested in flute embouchure as well--sax too. For me, Callet was important in that he encouraged me to seriously and methodically study Artie Shaw in particular -- and to resist arbitrary limitations on the instrument, especially in terms of range, volume, and flexibility.
Eric
******************************
The Jazz Clarinet
http://thejazzclarinet.blogspot.com/
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