 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-03-22 00:47
Buffet's effort to retake the crown for most expensive mass produced clarinet?
edit: I suspect this is Buffet's response to the Backun and MOBA clarinets.
Post Edited (2012-03-22 00:50)
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-22 01:05
Anyone know where to find the specific specs on the horn?
**=misinformed bullsh*t
**Looks crazy from what I can see from the quick shot: they added an articulated L3, aux C#/G#, what looks like a bis key, a plateau key on R2, an elongated Eb/Bb, a wrap around octave key, put the left hand posts for L1, 2, and 3 on the left side, switched up some tone holes on the right hand, and did some interesting ergonomics on top of that. And, it looks as though there is no metal ring for the left thumb (but that is very difficult to see). Interesting...**
**My bad, thank you for pointing that out. I took a screen shot that I saw on Saxontheweb as truth w/o thinking. I couldn't see the rollers on the keys (how I normally spot Olhers as I've never seen one in person). I guess I should check more carefully in the future.
Post Edited (2012-03-22 05:10)
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-03-22 02:07
mvjohnso wrote:
> Anyone know where to find the specific specs on the horn?
> Looks crazy from what I can see from the quick shot: they added
> an articulated L3, aux C#/G#, what looks like a bis key, a
> plateau key on R2, an elongated Eb/Bb, a wrap around octave
> key, put the left hand posts for L1, 2, and 3 on the left side,
> switched up some tone holes on the right hand, and did some
> interesting ergonomics on top of that. And, it looks as though
> there is no metal ring for the left thumb (but that is very
> difficult to see). Interesting...
>
I think you are talking about the shot at the beginning which shows several Oehler clarinets. From what little we see of it the "Divine" looks like a fairly standard boehm clarinet.
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2012-03-22 02:12
I can only imagine what those will sell for! They look amazing....but I guess I'll wait for the reviews from folks who try them before I start salivating.
In the meantime, I'll enjoy my vintage horns....(the ones that altogether didn't cost me what one of those would set me back!)
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Author: TJTG
Date: 2012-03-22 04:17
Poor tosca folk. They'll just need a better horn... again.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2012-03-22 06:07
Discuss what? Its name? I was going to come to the Musikmesse again but at the last minute couldn't...
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-03-22 06:10
Alright, place your bets folks. Considering that the Backun MOBA clarinet lists for $8000-$8500 I'm going to guess that this new Buffet is going to cost a cool $9000. Kind of a scary thought as that is rapidly approaching Wurlitzer / Schwenk & Seggelke territory.
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Author: oca
Date: 2012-03-22 06:22
I hope there will be some specifications on this clarinet and objective analysis.
Otherwise, I'm wary of a wave of Divine vs R13 threads in the near future.
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-22 06:57
Hey Vegeta what does the scouter say about the price of the Divine. It's over 9000!!!!!! *crushes scouter in outrage about price*
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-03-22 13:24
mvjohnso wrote:
> Hey Vegeta what does the scouter say about the price of the
> Divine. It's over 9000!!!!!! *crushes scouter in outrage about
> price*
Not sure how many people here are going to get the obscure 80's cartoon reference.
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Author: Joe Bloke
Date: 2012-03-22 17:42
I think Buffet correctly perceives that, the biggest threat to their kingdom is Backun Musical. So, firing back at Backun's high end custom with this instrument (Divine).
At this years NAMM show, Backun rolled out the prototype for their upcoming "Protege" model, which is apparently designed to go after the R13 market. The horn is supposed to be released early this summer. Rumor is, the introductory models will, initially, be priced below that of the R13. I'm guessing if you upscale the barrel and bell (Backun products of course), you'll be right at the R13 price.
Game on and it should be interesting to see if Backun can take significant market share away from Buffet. Good luck with that!
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2012-03-22 19:26
Au contraire, the new Buffet clarinet will be introduced at their warehouse and headquarters in ++Florida ++and it will be promoted as an instrument more towards the "pop" rather than classical player. It was initially called the "Jacques," later renamed the "James, "but last I heard, it is now called the........
Jimmy Buffet.
A cocktail party featuring Margaritas is planned for the roll-out.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: GBK
Date: 2012-03-22 20:42
Alseg wrote:
> Au contraire, the new Buffet clarinet will be introduced at
> their warehouse and headquarters in ++Florida ++and it will be
> promoted as an instrument more towards the "pop" rather than
> classical player. It was initially called the "Jacques," later
> renamed the "James, "but last I heard, it is now called
> the........
> Jimmy Buffet.
> A cocktail party featuring Margaritas is planned for the
> roll-out.
You almost had me after the first sentence.
...GBK
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-03-22 20:47
Alseg wrote:
> Au contraire, the new Buffet clarinet will be introduced at
> their warehouse and headquarters in ++Florida ++and it will be
> promoted as an instrument more towards the "pop" rather than
> classical player. It was initially called the "Jacques," later
> renamed the "James, "but last I heard, it is now called
> the........
> Jimmy Buffet.
> A cocktail party featuring Margaritas is planned for the
> roll-out.
>
This post just made my day.
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2012-03-22 20:56
If the new Buffet is used in the Academy of Saint Martin in the Fields by the son of their most notable conductor (Sir Neville Marriner) would it be called the ........wait for it.......the Andy Devine.?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9pPFCjRPvM&feature=related
Twang your magic twanger , Froggy.
.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: mvjohnso
Date: 2012-03-22 21:04
@SteveG_CT DBZ is never obscure, especially on the interwebz where meme upon meme upon meme have been inspired by those two simple lines. Also, Napa says "What 9000?" I apologize to anyone over 30 as the interwebz made me do it.
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Author: S.H.J.
Date: 2012-03-26 03:26
Well, judging by the pictures coming out of Frankfurt, it looks like the "Divine" model is ringless and features a low F/E correction key. Still haven't seen any close-up pictures, but it looks pretty much like Buffet's response to the Backun clarinets.
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Author: CocoboloKid
Date: 2012-04-02 19:51
Looks like they're going for Buffet Elite, The Sequel.
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Author: bethmhil
Date: 2012-04-02 21:02
That's what I was thinking. Why did Buffet do away with the Elite?
BMH
Illinois State University, BME and BM Performance
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-04-02 21:20
"Synthetic cork on tenon, no lubrification necessary" - Wonder how well that'll last?
"Metal O-ring pins" - Errrmm... what?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: nosqueaks
Date: 2012-04-02 21:28
Reading the description on the web site, this appears to be an RC bore design with Tosca scale and low F correction. Carbon fiber rings like on the Elite reduce weight but the body thickness looks to be standard, not thinned-
Also, cork pads on upper joint standard-
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Author: SteveG_CT
Date: 2012-04-02 23:11
Chris P wrote:
> "Metal O-ring pins" - Errrmm... what?
>
My guess would be that they have replaced the nylon pins in the left pinky keys with steel ones and have installed o-rings in the sockets to dampen the resulting noise.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2012-04-02 23:20
Gold plated option..........now that's an improvement I can endorse.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2012-04-03 00:50
Is this really the sequel to the Elite? I could be wrong, but somehow, I don't think so.
I never played an Elite, but I remember when it was introduced with great fanfare.
If I remember the advertising correctly, Buffet claimed the company was out to design a completely different instrument. I seem to remember that it was thin-walled and lightweight. For some types of playing, it was probably a great choice, but I don't think it ever really caught on. Perhaps it lacked the dark sound quality so many players favor.
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Author: CocoboloKid
Date: 2012-04-03 02:38
I don't really believe it's intended to in any way be related to the Elite (in fact, I'm quite certain Buffet would like to forget about that entirely), I was really just saying (with a bit of tongue in cheek) this isn't the first time Buffet has tried a clarinet design with carbon-fiber joint rings for a sleek ringless look. Perhaps it will work out better for them this time...the thin-wall Elite concept clearly did not. It was also a different time, and I think clarinet buyers then were, in general, an extremely traditionalist group of people who would never have entertained the idea of a clarinet that looked at all "different". The advent of the Age Of Backun has changed all that, and now who gives a fig about metal rings anyway? (I know I certainly don't!)
Plus, the Elite had gold-plated posts. :P (Frankly, I'd love to see that in the Divine!)
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Author: donald
Date: 2012-04-03 05:54
I have heard at least 2 players (one Italian, one Austrian) play really beautifully on the Buffet Elite... only played one once myself and not for long enough to form an opinion, but obviously it was not a complete loss as an instrument! dn
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Author: Phurster
Date: 2012-04-03 11:32
I think the thin body scared a few people with the Elite. Anyway it says on the Web site the Divine is evolved from the RC. Notice the lack of silver rings on the barrel, perhaps the design is influenced by Backun or the Selmer Privilege. It looks great i must say.
Chris.
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Author: RunnerSean
Date: 2012-04-03 16:10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LD-zfa9eNaw&feature=results_main&playnext=1&list=PL44ECC43C400F9D5B
Varga Gabor, a Hungarian clarinetist, also plays on an Elite other than this clarinet that he is seen posing with.
Sean
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Author: The_Clarinetist
Date: 2012-04-03 17:50
If the tosca is based (in terms of bore) on the R13 and the divine is based on the RC I can not motivate any considerable price difference between the tosca and divine as the R13 and RC are priced similarly. In my opinion some minor modifications will not make this new horn as creative as the backuns or wurlitzers et al. However, I was a little surprised they did not mention anything about the alleged tosca bass clarinet...
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Author: John Peacock
Date: 2012-04-05 19:35
The description on the Buffet site says:
"The Divine is made of grenadilla wood with specific upper joint Green Line tone-hole slots eliminating air leaks on tone-holes most prone to crack."
- an admission that even for top-of-the-top-of the-line instruments, you can't get wood of the quality that would have once been considered necessary for the best instruments? I've certainly seen a lot of head-shaking in my local repair shop about the number of Tosca joints they've had to replace in recent years.
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2012-04-05 22:19
They say the name "conjures such qualities as beauty, splendour, and awe; a level of perfection. It is a word of high praise with connotations of purity and light, with a touch of femininity."
Hmmm. I wonder if the tone is also "more youthful," as Leblanc used to claim.
Actually, I'm waiting for a Swiss watch type jeweled movement. Then people can enthuse about the warm reddish tone with ruby bearings, brilliant crystalline sound for diamonds, and the very obvious differences when the diamonds are set in silver, gold or platinum.
Next it will be a case with intechangeable linings of red, purple and blue velvet. Only blue will create "the sweetest clarinet ever made."
Let's hear it for the Placebo Effect.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2012-04-05 22:26
I wonder what the single case for the "Divine" is like. Will it be as shameful as the faux carbon fibre Tosca single case?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Buster
Date: 2012-04-05 22:44
Does anybody else picture an entirely different thing when the name "Divine" is invoked?
Let's just hope this thing doesn't come in Smell-O-Vision.....
-Jason
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Author: Randall
Date: 2012-04-05 23:22
It was: "pluck your magic twanger Froggy" and I recall Andy D. as 'Jingles' on Wild Bill Hickock. Are we showing our age???
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Author: bmcgar ★2017
Date: 2012-04-06 06:04
Ken, me too.
For some reason, that frog creeped me out bigtime.
B.
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Author: Franklin Liao
Date: 2012-04-06 10:46
If my memory serves me, Backun's a Buffet dealer as well. Although it is undeniable that Backun is a serious competitor with his line of instruments, the argument that he's why Buffet rolled out the Divine does require some second thought.
If anything, the Antigua Backun would be most threatening and destabilizing for the its entry-intermediate market segment. This price range threatens Ridenour's Lyrique, the E11 and the Cadenza/Wooden Bliss.
In the high-end sector, we have other cottage clarinets that would compete against the Backun MoBa, from the established workshops such as that of Wurlitzer, Rossi, Stephen Fox et al. Reviving the idea of the Elite on the part of Buffet to steal Yamaha's thunder with some excitement seem more plausible.
About the Protege... if summer release date does fall through, it would cause some tremor in the 'affordable professional' market. I can easily imagine this line of instrument being disruptive to the R13/RC, the Symphonie, YCL-CSG series, maybe even the CSG-II.
Whatever it may be, exciting time is ahead.
EDIT: I need to add that Buffet's century-old reputation is quite cemented and it is very hard for me to see E11 seeing very sudden market erosion from a global perspective. Yamaha's YCL-450 is also rather established, so that the Backun wave of the New and the Old World are only ripples across the global pond. The three conglomerates behind the 3 main brands of Clarinet still command much stronger reach (Conn-selmer with Selmer and Steinway the parent, Yamaha being Yamaha the ACME) after all.
The battle for additional recognition in China remains to be seen. It would veer away from the topic to dwell about this matter of breakthrough.
Post Edited (2012-04-06 11:33)
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2012-04-06 12:12
"No, Froggy, I'm not giving you this new reed. The last time I gave you a new reed for your nice new Devine clarinet, you chewed that reed up and spit it all over the insides of your clarinet case and I had to clean up the mess."
"Aw, but I need a new reed. I really really really need it!"
"You need it because you used your old reed to pick your nose, and then you chewed up that reed, too, and you spit it in your clarinet case, and I had to clean it all out. So no more reeds for you."
"Aw, pleeeeeeeeze! I'll put the reed on my clarinet and I'll play it nicely. I promise!"
"Well ... Froggy, I'm not sure I can trust you. If I give you this nice new reed, will you be good and use it properly? And not abuse it?"
"Oooh, yes! I'll use it properly! Honest! I promise! I'll be good! I'll be very very very very good!"
"Well ... all right. If you absolutely promise to be good. Here's a new reed."
"Oooooh, thank you! Thank you! See, I'm being good. I take the reed, and I put it in my mouth just long enough to moisten it, and I ... CHEW IT ALL UP AND --" Pfft! Pfft! Pfft! -- "SPIT IT AND SPIT IT AND SPIT IT!!!"
"FROGGY!!!"
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
Post Edited (2012-04-06 12:13)
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Author: GBK
Date: 2012-04-06 13:13
[ OK kids ... we've had enough off-topic fun. If there is anything relevant to add, email us and we'll reopen the thread - GBK ]
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