 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-11-18 21:10
Regarding bore sizes...
If a person needed to replace a barrel on a clarinet that is missing one...
If the length is the same in millimeters, but the replacement bore size is slightly larger in diameter inside, how does that affect the intonation? Will the whole thing be just off and a big mess, or will it just be lower in pitch or higher??? Not really affecting the intonation of each note but just the pitch?? Or???
What are the ramifications of the affect if the bore size is not the same as original?
And what are the ramifications of all this if the original bore size is not known?
Thanks so kindly.
Also, is it absolutely okay to put a wooden barrel on a plastic clarinet if that is the only acquisition that can be made for it?
And if a barrel is too loose, can cork renewing do it, or are there barrels out there that are made for a different size?
Thanks again.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2011-11-18 21:25
The internal bore dimensions SHOULD be as close to the instrument's original specifications as possible. A larger bore diameter (and same length as original) would play flat ........... in the notes closest to the top of the horn (ie throat notes) and would play havoc on the rest of the clarinet's internal pitch. In short, make sure you let the seller know what YOUR clarinet is first, and let them tell you if they can match it. Just as an example, Buffet "A" clarinet barrels are slightly narrower internally than the "Bb" barrels (although many play the "Bb" on the "A" anyway - small difference).
Most modern French clarinets (at least) have very similar tenon dimensions, so yes, a new cork is probably the fix.
No, there should be no problem putting a wooden barrel (whose dimensions match your plastic clarinet) on your plastic clarinet. The only concern might be one of temperature and humidity if you were to try and play this horn outside at 40 degrees fahrenheit, the barrel could face a cracking hazard.
................Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-11-18 21:44
Thank you so very kindly, Paul...I will pay attention to the pitches all the way down with the tuner and see what happens. Thanks for the heads up.
I definitely do see how clarinets have that variable, wider or smaller bores, and each company, it seems, is or was quite proud of their bore size (s).
Barrels are constantly available on eBay, and now I am seeing that there are so many variables, I just wonder if it has been worth trying to work this out with bottom feeder clarinet eBay purchases. Grin.
I am having a lot of fun, but in the end, I have to ask, does it really work well? That is the question.
And there certainly is a lot of inaccurate things going on in this arena. Perhaps, a lot of info is just gone.
I guess there is no database online for clarinet measurements, are there?
Such as original barrel sizes and all that?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Alseg
Date: 2011-11-19 00:58
To original poster.....some answers:
It might actually cause sharpness in the clarion, flat or normal lower, and The throat tones would be fuzzy. Overall the effect would be a diffusion of sound.
Re-corking might help, unless the socket is abnormally wide. A loose socket can cause squeaks.
Not all of the auctioneers are "bottom feeders." Some notables use the auction site to "put their product out there" as an inexpensive means of advertising. Some are even willing to tinker and customize or substitute a product, hoping for good will....esp. from denizens of this BB.
I sometimes see my own barrels there, esp. when someone switches brands of clarinets and has a surplus of barrels.
It is OK to use a rubber barrel on a wooden clarinet, a wooden barrel on a plastic or rubber clarinet, or any other combination or material, as long as it achieves the response you desire. But never, ever, use an oak barrel on a clarinet. They are for Chardonnay.
Disclaimer....I make and sell barrels.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
Post Edited (2011-11-19 11:12)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Elkwoman46
Date: 2011-11-19 16:26
Dear Dr. Allan Segal,
Oh, no, you misunderstand me, I am not talking about eBay as offering bottom feeders, I am talking about my own, trying to find "cheap" and end up with bottom feeder stuff...at times...grin.
But even more, finding that in the long run, trying to find parts for stuff can have a whole new slant of "not so cheap" when everything is said and done.
For example,
I have no idea what I was thinking, but I bought an apparent no name clarinet with the barrel missing but with a wooden heavy case. When one thinks about it, that was really dumb of me--I mean really, what do I know at this point about this stuff? So I won this clarinet for $13.50 and shipping was ten bucks. The seller spent $17.xx to send it to me, and had told me that it had no name per email. So, he made about six bucks. Well, I come to find out that this actually was plastered with name and serial number, but I suspect he may have missed it because it was engraved into dark wood and one could miss it completely if not looking for it. The seller appeared to be selling stuff out of an attic, old books, etc.
So, then I just recently purchased a real authentic barrel for this antique, per fluke of seeing it posted, and it cost me more than the whole rest of it.
Kind of dumb, huh? And that does not include another barrel that I bought.
Really, what would have I bought, however, if it was just a whole lot of nothing no name parts...a whole lot of nothing, yes? (Per a previous topic I initiated.) But God blessed it.
But now I won another clarinet that has the same missing barrel problem...HA HA HA HA...however, I suspect the pads are in great shape...
Hence, all my questions...Do I have Clarinet OCD?
By the way...I have become so fascinated by clarinets, that I really want to learn how to fix them, re-pad, etc. Just waiting for my synthetic pads from China. Waiting...waiting...
Thank you, also, for your information about barrels. Thanks so kindly.
I have also been asking some of these questions about barrels and various mechanical questions because I keep wondering if there are databases out there or encourage those who know to do so, for future sake...it would be a shame if this information disappeared for people many years from now, who want to still play these instruments that have been gutted from parts for some reason, or just lost parts. I can understand also how a barrel for example could be left at school from a student and never make it back into the case, get lost, no funds to replace it, and there one has a closet instrument for years. Wouldn't it be grand to have diagrams of these antiques with complete measurements for future generations? Think about these instruments made from precious wood that perhaps won't even exist down the road. It is a shame to put these parts into the trash can, yes?
I am going to continue to try for the future, every clarinet instrument that I have to write on a piece of paper (that goes into the case) with everything I know about it. I think this will help. Hence, my questions about barrels. I want to log it in, so that whatever happens, a person will know what size it should have, for example.
So, Dr. Allan Segal...this reminds me of something I was thinking about last night...do you know how to take an accurate measurement of a bore size inside the barrel? Is there a tool? I noticed this is something quite difficult to measure, since both sides of the barrel go in wide first before one gets to the bore measurement. Do you know?
THANK YOU both ever so much for your information. I am learning so much!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
