 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Bennett ★2017
Date: 2010-08-29 18:20
I'm wondering how the mfrs grade reeds for hardness. I'm assuming that simply measuring the profile isn't sufficient as the nature of the cane must also be a factor. Do different makes/models of reeds have different thickness profiles, independent of hardness, e.g., one thins out more slowly than another, or one has a precipitous thinning as it reaches the tip?
Or am I wrong? Do the the reed copying/micrometer gauge machines pretty much guarantee that if you find a good reed, you can clone it at home?
If the mfrs measure flexibility before stamping on a hardness number, do they do it when the reed is wet or dry? Do they do it to every reed or just a statistically valid sample?
And more broadly, why do we like one brand of reed over another? I've tried many brands and keep coming back to V12's. What is the magic ingredient? I'm not asking why I like V12 - rather what is in the different makes and models that causes them to be different?
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Author: kdk
Date: 2010-08-29 19:25
Others here who are more involved in the manufacturing process will have more specific answers. Everything I've read about Vandoren has said that they grade their reeds for hardness *after* the reeds are fully cut - that all of the reeds within a specific model are cut to the same dimensions and then tested for flexibility. So the primary - if not the only - thing that would be involved (assuming that the above is true and the cutters are accurate) would be the stiffness of the cane itself, which is why adjusting reeds to duplicate only a few points of measurement (or even, like a Reed Du-all, actually cloning the entire shape) is often unreliable.
I can't see how they could measure only a sample - it seems as though they'd have to grade each reed individually if they're all coming out of the same cutting machines. I imagine this process is also somehow automated.
Various reed models are cut using different profiles - there are any number of parameters that can be different from one profile to another - how thick the cane is at various points along the taper from the center spine toward each edge and from the tip toward the shoulders, how thick the tip itself is, whether the reed is "double-cut" or "single-cut" - as well as how the cane itself is chosen. I'm sure there are other potential differences as well. You are partial to the way V12s are cut, which is probably different from the way others you've tried are shaped.
Karl
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2010-08-29 19:33
I think you'll find this interesting regarding how companies grade the hardness of their reeds. There are different ways it can be done.
http://reed-help.com/research/strength/
I'm not sure about "cloning" reeds. I tried it years ago, using a "perfect" reed as my guide. I carefully measured all of the dimensions with my PerfectaReed, and carefully adjusted an imperfect reed so that the dimensions of both reeds matched. It didn't work because each reed has its own unique characteristics. Micrometer gauge devices do have their place, but they are not the magic solution.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-08-29 21:19
It is my belief that the reeds are always dry when they are cut and stay that way. If they were to get wet the tips would be somewhat warped when you opened the box. It is also my belief that the strength of each reed is determined by how thick the cutting machine is set so a #4 is thicker at all points than a #3 for example. That's the reason why some reeds in a box are softer and others are harder then the average reed. That reason is because the cutting machine does not take into consideration the density of the cane, only the thickness of the cane. Imagine if one side of the reed was as dense as tin and the other side is as dense a paper. They would both be cut the same thickness but one side would be harder than the other. That may be an exaggeration but you get the point.
The reasons why one brand is different than another is both the quality or type of cane that's used, where it is grown and aged as well as how they taper the reed at different points. The later is why each major manufacture has "different" cuts. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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