 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2007-08-25 08:40
High winds or a tornado took down the telco's switch completely for the last 14 hours, so no connectivity.
No problems in my general location, but lots of wind damage caused by a tornadeo close by.
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Author: Mrs_gekko
Date: 2007-08-25 13:52
Hey Mark
We have been having bad storms here also, high winds, tornadoes and flooding. Hope you and yours are safe.
Donna
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2007-08-25 13:58
Hi Mark - RITE, several bad storms, a bit like Okla in the springtime, and it is still a threat in summer. I knew right away where Howell is, but had to look up Fenton, S of Flint. I think that now more people will believe that global warming is both a fact and a serious threat, Perhaps ?? Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2007-08-25 14:06
There will be an up coming "summit" in Georgia to discuss whether Global Warming is fact or fiction. Apparently the state of Georgia doesn't want to spend "unecessary" money towards environmental programs that have been burdening the state budgets of northern states.
Many of us down here believe the Earth is flat too.
.........Paul Aviles
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-08-25 14:24
> Many of us down here believe the Earth is flat too.
Move into the alps, they're far from being flat. ![[tongue]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie6.gif)
Jokes aside, I'm often worried what environmental debts we leave to our children. More than what we've inherited from our parents, I fear.
--
Ben
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2007-08-25 14:59
America's unwillingness to see recognize the environmental disaster that is staring us in the face is the one reason that I'm glad I can claim dual citizenship...
Too bad Ireland's on the same planet!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: OmarHo
Date: 2007-08-25 15:20
We're starting to recognize global warming in Canada, and have been taking preventative measures such as trying to charge people who idle in their cars for more than 3 minutes. However, I think people need to be more aware and willing to cut down on their green house gas contributions, because using the "well how is my car alone contributing?" ideology is pretty selfish. Also, many people associate green house gases with cars, that's not true! Did you know one lawnmowers or a john deer's pollute the same as a dozen cars? I fear that the message will only kick into people when it's too late...
Speaking of storms, at this rate, the hurricanes will become more severe because the rising temperatures in the oceans give fuel for hurricanes and storms.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-08-25 16:52
> I think people need to be more aware and willing to cut down on their green
> house gas contributions
So, no more black beans for you. Or just once a month.
First thing I'd do is to finally charge tax on aircraft kerosene. Good-bye <50$ trips from Zurich to Mallorca. Flying is just too cheap - why go by train if it is double or three times the price than CheapCharter or whatever the aviation companies' names?
--
Ben
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2007-08-25 17:13
Hey Ben...it's not cheap in the states!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Ski
Date: 2007-08-26 03:32
Omar,
I'm not sure who to believe re global warming. Enlighten me! And not with examples of what kinds of things pollute and what doesn't (that's obvious); rather, enlighten me with some non-junk scientific studies that prove the point.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-08-26 08:19
The paradox is... can we maitain a certain standard of living WITHOUT creating all that pollution. Some pollution is senseless, but think of hospitals and the amount of 1-time-use tools, tubes, and plastics. Or schools- on my first week of teaching I was shocked and a little guilty at the hundreds of photocopies I had to make for handouts. The kids do it for homework and then it becomes trash in 24 hours.
There are a lot of pollutants that, sadly, seem to be unavoiadable without changing the standard of living.
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Author: Ski
Date: 2007-08-26 09:04
Here's another paradox...
I live in a rural area and have to drive (round trip) 24 miles to the dump to dispose of my trash and (separated) recyclables. Regarding paper, it seems that paper waste accumulates much faster in my household than other kinds of garbage (thank you USPS for actually sponsoring the proliferation of junk mail).
Now, being a rural-ite I'm legally allowed to have a burn barrel on my property (to dispose of waste wood, leaves) but it's illegal to burn paper/cardboard.
So on to the paradox. Is it better (for the environment) for me to drive to the dump more often to dispose of paper waste? Or do I burn it (despite the illegality of it)? Well...
If I recycle it, that means gas consumption and the CO2 emissions from my car to/from the dump. But there's no guarantee that the paper will be recycled, because batches of recycled paper are often tainted (plastics, etc.). When that happens, the batch gets rejected and landfilled or burned anyway. So while the potential of saving trees is there, there's no guarantee it'll happen because there's no guarantee that the paper will actually be recycled.
If I burn my paper, despite it being illegal, that'll emit CO2 as well, and the potential of saving trees falls to zero, but there's no gas consumption involved. There's also no possibility of the waste paper ending up in a landfill either.
So there's no way to actually quantify which disposal method is better or worse for the environment. It's all a crap shoot.
Post Edited (2007-08-26 09:05)
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-08-26 09:59
Well... you could NOT burn your branches, leaves, and paper and compost it with food garbage. It'll surely rot. But, unless you have a large amount of extra space to put your pile of garbage whilst you wait for it to become soil, you will have a sanitation problem.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-08-26 10:49
How many others live in the same area? Wouldn't it be more economical to have a lorry make a collecting tour once a month? Might even create a job or two...
Heck, the school bus could haul a trailer on the first Monday every month, or USPS could collect their own trash...
--
Ben
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-08-26 11:14
I think that's called 'recyclable paper day', which it seems Ski does not have. But having the USPS pick it up is a good idea; they already have to use the gas to deliver the mail everyday anyway.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2007-08-26 13:52
Back about Post #9-10, Ski asked about "references" re: Global Warming". IMHO, one of the best discussions [lengthy] was in a Natl. Geographic, Sept. 2004. Working in our public library's bookstore, we recieve many N G's, and that's where mine came from, inexpensively. For reading, not owning, all libraries have [should have] N G collections, as it is one of our most reliable/authentic magazines available. There is more info available to internet surfers [right here], much of which appears quite reliable, and untouched by advertising. I have yet to read Al Gore's book, but applaud his efforts to "wake us up" to G W's threat to our planet's future. "Nuff said for now. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-08-26 14:11
I don't think it's a lack of knowledge that prevents us from acting sensibly. It's a question of priorities, and if some programme is finally kicking in, the next elections are already lurking round the corner, and "bread and circuses" gets more attention than the lone tree-hugger who - gasp! - walks or pedals to work instead of taking the car for a three-mile ride.
From now on I'll compost my reeds.
--
Ben
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Author: Dee
Date: 2007-08-26 14:56
Let me say that I believe in recycling and conservation. However I also believe in being practical. For example, take all the paper items in the mail, etc. If you live in a small house, you may not have the space to save this stuff up for a trip to the recycle center but instead need to take care of this stuff on a daily or weekly basis. If that center is 24 miles away, that's an issue.
The extent to which man is responsible for global warming must be treated with caution as it is actually undetermined. If you look at the earth's history, there is a whole series of warm spells and cool spells even before man could have been a contributor.
Currently the sun is radiating at a significantly higher level than it was during the "Little Ice Age". Enough so that the earth should actually be hotter than it is. But other effects come into play. Warmer means more evaporation means more water vapor means more radiation reflected back into space instead of heating the earth. No doubt there are other factors too. The system is extremely complex.
During that Little Ice Age (circa 1350 to 1850) periodically there were "nor'easter" type storms that, for Europe, were as destructive as hurricanes are to the tropics. Famines due to crop failures from cold, damp years were a regular feature of European life.
In contrast, during the preceding Medieval Warm Spell, good quality wine grapes were grown well into northern England and were such a threat to French wines that the French king banned their importation to France. That ceased shortly after the start of the Little Ice Age as the grapes were no longer suitable for wine making. In addition, thriving settlements were established in Greenland with regular trade routes to Europe during the warm spell. When the Medieval Warm Spell ended, the ice closed off the routes for too much of the year and crops failed in Greenland. Within a generation after the Little Ice Age started in that area, the settlers were dead or gone.
We do NOT know enough yet to model climate change nor man's contribution to it. We don't even know if increased CO2 levels are caused by the warming or if the warming is caused by increased CO2 levels. Of if they are intricately related in some other way. There may be a third factor that drives both.
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