 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-02-21 06:14
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I'm having problems with my bass (again). It's a 70's Selmer USA bass with a single register key and no register on the neck. After a fresh repad and adjustment, overall the instrument plays much better than before. Notes sing, and new springs and adjusted keys make sure everything plays smoothly and doesn't require too much pressure.
Except for two notes. Two cursed, little damned notes.
D4.
I can play open G (duh), I can play F4, I can play E4, I can play C4, and all of their register-key counterparts (even A5, which I'm pretty proud of, being the noob that I am), but I can't play D. It sounds "airy" and warbles around a bit. If I'm not careful, or try to hold the note for more than a few seconds, it degenerates into a squeak. After some adjustment with some keys and much use of my trusty leak light, I've gotten to the point where I can, with much practice and not using a reed harder than a Rico Royal 2, hold the note, but it sounds like utter crap.
E is beautiful; it resonates with the whole instrument, is loud, clear, and pleasant. C is the same. In fact, almost every note down to Eb (the Selmer's lowest, duh again) is LOUD and CLEAR. Every note I know fingerings to above E (not many, but still) is sweet and not-to-shrill. But damned if I can't get that D to sound like anything but blowing over the top of an old whiskey bottle.
Does anybody have a CLUE as to what's going on? When I got the instrument (thank you anonymous auction site) it was in pretty bad shape, and I can't remember if it ever played well anymore -- I don't know if it could play ANYTHING when I got it. Also, I can play every other note with a 2.5 or a 3 Rico Royal reed, D4 squeaks unless I move down to a 2 (which I've only got three left).
Edit: whoops, accidentally included pictures of the two necks. If it helps anything, the problem is pretty much the same on both equally. I thought my old, copper neck was the problem, so I went-a-pawning for another one and found the improved angle one.
Post Edited (2009-02-21 06:18)
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-02-21 07:44
Attachment: 20-02-09_2305.jpg (196k)
I am the tech. In an earlier thread I made ( http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=294506&t=292995 ) you can see that there are NO techs around here. I'm more than confident (even if not really competent, being a bit genki counts for a lot) that I can get it working, unless it's an inherent "problem note." This is the first and only bass clarinet I have touched, apart from my designated "parts" clarinet at a local pawn shop, so I don't really know what to do. I can't find any real problems with a leak light, and a vacuum/blow test doesn't reveal much.
I've repadded 3 soprano clarinets, all to great success, even though one was a 19-teen's HP clarinet. My (old) main clarinet I play is one I did myself, but this bass is just confusing me. I mean, everything else plays JUST FINE, except D4 and it's register-keyed equivalent.
Disclaimer: I am not an actual musician, I'm just good with my hands. My day job is repairing/making/adjusting/selling glasses (optician/lab tech), so I can do things like solder, electroplate, etc, and have all the necessary springs/tools available.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2009-02-21 08:09
Fingering a D on the bass, it will close two holes - the one under your LH middle finger and the one under your LH ring finger. I think the felt under the ring finger touch piece is too thick or too thing, one of the pads involved will not close completely unless another finger comes to help.
Run a leak light through your instrument.
--
Ben
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-02-21 08:18
I can press down on both of those pads individually (underneath those fingerplate/felt contraptions) but it doesn't get any better. The leak light, sadly, reveals nothing. Maybe tomorrow I'll repad both of those (those are the only two I haven't repadded as I ran out of the correct sizes, I have the correct ones now). One of them, the top one, was "sticky" and made a noise as the pad lifted up, but I didn't see any leaks. I ran a dollar bill with some talc on it to see if it would alleviate the stickiness, but to no avail.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2009-02-21 08:54
For the two pads Ben mentioned, have you tried a feeler with a light touch, in addition to a leak light? If not, try it: Press the D key lightly and check each pad with the feeler (you can use rolling papers).
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2009-02-21 09:11
Hmm, in your initial post you said it sounded airy - this might point to the "C" pad (the one that is closed when you finger a C), it might not be open enough when you play a D.
Airyness often arises when the first open pad further below the instrument doesn't open enough, and you hear the air rush by the pad. So...check the opening of the pad, play around with playing a D and slowly close the tonehole below and see what happens.
--
Ben
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-02-21 09:16
Thank you, I'll check with the feeler, but especially with the vent heights suggestion. This whole time (about two days total) I've been obsessed with trying to figure out if there's any leaks, but I've never thought of venting, even after adjusting the top register hole's height to make high notes sound better.
I think I've got a cellopaper feeler somewhere around here, too.
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-02-21 22:37
EEH by golly miss molly, you solved it. It was the vent height (or lack hereof) of the first "big" pad, the one for C. It wasn't high enough because I used some thicker pads when I redid it, so I raised the key and everything is fine.
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Author: blazian
Date: 2009-02-22 00:38
Huh. I'm gone a day and miss a whole thread! I've had this problem as well recently.The original pad was alot thinner apparently. To fix the venting, are you supposed to bend the key up slightly or thin out the pad or what?
- Martin
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Author: Geirskogul
Date: 2009-02-22 01:57
I bent they key that needed venting (the big "C" pad) up a bit. Take the key/rod assembly off, grab with fiber-jaw (or other non-abrasive) pliers, click you heels three times, and bend. When you put the key back on you're going to have to reseat the pad, probably, but that's what your butane torch is for.
With that keycup, be sure to NOT bend the actual key your finger touches in relation to the rod; bend ONLY the keycup. If you bend the key itself, you'll mess up how it seats under the D4 pad. Also, I wouldn't advise bending it totally while it's on the instrument, as I've fsked up a post that way on another (albeit an ancient 1912 soprano). Sometimes the shear stress is too much for old metal / plastic to handle.
I ended up bending three keys total to achieve the sound I wanted. Fixing just D4's C venting made E sound a bit weird, so I fixed E's D ventings, too. Those were a pain because I had to readjust the key plateaus that sit over them, but it was worth it in the end.
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