 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: saxman52
Date: 2006-08-24 20:05
I've been playing bass clarinet in my school's Symphonic Band, although I am primarily a saxophonist, and I get very frustrated with the clarion and (to some extent) the altissimo registers. Anything about a clarion G is very difficult to articulate and responds poorly except when going chromatically. Last year I studied clarinet (and bass clarinet) with the local clarinet professor and bass clarinetist in the West Shore Symphony. She said that her bass clarinet embouchure was more like a saxophone embouchure and that that was what many bass clarinetists use but that some also use a modified clarinet embouchure. I've tried both, and neither really seems to make a difference (that I've noticed at least). My clarinet teacher moved at the beginning of the summer and I haven't found another teacher yet, but I really have no idea what to do to be able to play better in these registers. The bass clarinet I'm using is the school's Yamaha YCL221, which does not have a double register vent as far as I'm aware, which I'm told makes playing in the clarion and altissimo registers much more difficult. I'm also using a Selmer C* and Vandoren 3's. Any advice would be much appreciated.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BelgianClarinet
Date: 2006-08-24 20:20
I'm studing Bass now for 2 years, and found out that it is a different kind of breath. It's a fantastic instrument, fun to play, but it is not 'a big clarinet'.
My teacher tells me everytime that her teacher (a famous Belgian Bass play : Jan Guns) started the first lesson by telling her : "please realize, this is a different instrument"
I also find it hard to get the same 'food feel' or 'good grip' on the bass, that (I think) i have on the Bb. It is clear though, that the best way to get better is to practise ;-)
From what I read on the board the setup seems to be classic (I don't use C*, but E, but on the Bboard the C* seems to be a standard). On the reeds 3 makes sense, but I start to like the 'Java' Sax Tenor version (not the bass clarinet reeds). I've been told by a local teacher who played over 30 years bass in the Antwerp Philharmonic Orchestra, that the late Horak once adviced him to.
Anyhow it's worth a try since reeds are very personal.
My teacher (and Jan Guns) play a japanese mouthpiece, I think its called Nagamatsu, but sofar nobody on the board seems to have an opinion on that brand and that's quite exceptional ;-)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bassbuddy
Date: 2006-08-24 20:34
Wow, we have a lot in common.
I've been playing bass for about 6 years and I use 3 Vandorens too. I play in my school's Symphonic Band.
Here's some things I find helpful:
1) Only some reeds will allow you to play in the upper register. You can go through your reeds and see which ones work and/or fiddle with the ones that aren't quite there.
2) I learned to play high notes by playing the note without the register key, then adding it. Usually, you have to increase the air flow, and make sure that the corners of your mouth are firm but DO NOT BITE. That was my main problem.
3) I know this is kind of a bad thing to do, but my bass clarinet is very old and sometimes I need to grip the keys harder to make the sound come out. That could be your problem too.
Good Luck, and don't give up! It's a beautiful instrument once you get the hang of it.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2006-08-24 20:42
Saxman, When I was doing school clinics on bass clarinet a great number of the instruments used were the Yamaha/Vito like yours. In a great majority of cases when the students had difficulty playing above clarion G the culprit was the adjustment of the throat Bb vent, which operates off of the register key and is activated when the thumb plate is open. Make sure that when you try to play in the second register that only one of the two pads that can be actuated by the register key is open. If the lower of the two is not firmly seated you will experience just the difficulty you have described. There is, fortunately, an adjustment screw that will easily let you eliminate this problem.
Selmer C* and Vandoren 3 reed ought to be just fine. Make sure that you are using lots of air and not pinching with your jaw!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2006-08-25 03:05
To add a bit to Larry's great advice, altissimo response on single-register-vent instruments such as the Yammie 221 and its near-twin the Vito is about the same as on double-vent instruments (the double vent really only affects the clarion register). Bass clarinet is actually pretty easy to play in the altissimo, especially when you get into really high stuff (above the G) where it's much easier than soprano clarinet. Larry's last sentence, though, says it all!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: saxman52
Date: 2006-08-26 19:08
Thanks for the advice! I checked the register key, and it doesn't have that problem. Then I tried playing the bass clarinet a bit more and for whatever reason it is much less squeaky in the upper clarion now and I can get into the altissimo easily, but only chromatically. It's still hard to "just play" notes like C and A, but I can play them if I approach them. I think the problem is really just me at this point, not the instrument as I had suspected. Now that I know it's almost definitely my fault, I can shut up and practice.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-08-26 22:04
For the altissimo register, do you roll your LH finger 1 to uncover the perforation in the top fingerplate (half-hole) instead of lifting as you'd do on a Bb clarinet?
I haven't seen this mentioned at all, and this is important to bass clarinet (and alto and basset horn) - otherwise makers would have been wasting their time in making and fitting this if no-one uses it or knows what it' for, and half-holing stabilises the pitch.
So, for your lower altissimo, the fingerings are as Bb clarinet with the exception of keeping LH 1 down, but uncovering the small hole in the middle (½ - 'half-hole').
C# - ½ xx|xxo
D - ½ xx|xooEb
Eb - ½ xx|xo,oEb
E - ½ xx|oooEb
F - ½ xxG#|oooEb
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2006-08-26 22:04)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2006-08-28 04:11
Just in response to what Chris posted, although he also has the same model bass clarinet that I have, I found that the altisimo C# speaks better without the half hole. D and up is better with the half hole (at least until G#). Also I don't need the pinky Eb/Ab finger in the altisimo like on a soprano clarinet. So best to try both ways.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: saxman52
Date: 2006-08-28 04:45
Chris P, yes, I have heard about the half-holing and it helps a lot. I agree with clarnibass about the altissimo C# though; it seems to work better without the half-holing.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chetclarinet
Date: 2006-08-28 23:28
I have enjoyed playing the bass clarinet for nearly 40 years! I have found that if the air focus is in the middle of the mouth, not as far front as the clarinet, not as far back as the saxophone, successful upper register response is improved. Be sure to check where the lower lip is on the reed--if it is pushing on the reed above where the reed is away from the mouthpiece, response is also a problem. Frankly, I also anchor tongue a bit, with the tip of my tongue resting on the bottom lip that is inserted into my mouth. This allows more air to pass through, encourages a larger amount of reed in the mouth and allows the front middle of the tongure to touch slightly below the tip of the reed. Also, I am careful to maintain an arched, somewhat clarinet embouchure like angle of entry to assist in upper register playing. Play the lowest f, and e, and make sure there is a light buzz or reed vibration in the sound. If the light buzz is there, you can hear the twelfth and the sixth above the low f---third and fifth partials---in the sound of the f. THis effect helps to focus the low register. There is a very slight voicing effect when adding the register key to the fundamental notes--like going from aeee to eeeea, or moving the air slightly back in the mouth and keeping the tongue a bit lower than the b flat clarinet. --just some thoughts.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Don Berger
Date: 2006-08-29 00:29
Very interesting thots, Chet, I'll try some similar analysis to my B C playing. I know I "shift" around to get an improved clarion, but have little alt. playing in comm. band music, mainly chal. Will try hearing the overtones of F and E at home, they are otherwise drowned out, I guess. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: moeboy
Date: 2006-08-29 03:05
The tip i was given by a bass clarinet teacher in a five minute lesson on bass ( soprano main instrument, bass for symphonic band ) was to close your eyes while playing a low g. Have someone depress the register key for you at first keeping that very same embachure ( spelling ) for the clarion and altissimo. Then gradually depress the register key yourself, keeping the same embachure. It takes a little to get used to, and i have no idea as to if this is any right way to do it, but it works now that i am used to it. Just a tip, i know the altissimo was mean to me also when i first started playing bass.
Best of luck!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
