 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-02-15 19:46
I was wondering if a moenigg or chadash barrel, which were designed with R13's in mind, would have a similar pleasing effect on an E-13. I don't know if there would be a different "worse" effect due to it not being an R13 or not. Thanks.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-02-15 20:12
Although not an E13, I know a number of clarinetists who have changed the stock barrel on an E11 to a Chadash barrel and have had good results narrowing the 12ths and focusing the throat register. One player in particular is using a Chadash barrel on his E11 C clarinet and said the difference was substantial.
You could always call or visit Guy Chadash to try a number of barrels for yourself...GBK
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2004-02-16 00:10
Yes indeed they work on the E13 Also, it may also depend on the exit bore and inside shape of the mouthpiece.
Oddly, those designed for the R13 A-instrument can sometimes interchange with the Bb...in fact I have one 64mm that works on a Selmer as well. My barrels dont fit Noblet instruments very well.
Your mileage may vary. Ya gots to kiss a lot of toads to find a prince.
(Disclaimer...I make barrels, but do not sell them on woodwind.org. I sell an occaisional piece on an auction site )
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Author: SVSorna05
Date: 2004-02-16 01:23
I use a moenig barrel on my E&S which might as well be an E13 and have had great results not only in intonation but its made notes in my upper register much cleaner and projects nicely... good luck
-Dain
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-02-16 04:27
Well, SVSorna05, technically I have an E & S as well. So if a moenigg works with you, then chances are it'll be sufficient for me as well. I just know that the E & S was somewhat of a precursor and overall pretty equivalent to the E13.
Good idea GBK. When I get some time off (spring break?) I'll take a trip there and see if I can schedule some time to try his barrels.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2004-02-16 10:51
Those Buffet's must be great horns if you need to buy another barrel just to narrow the 12th and focus the throat registers. I would have thought that these issues may have been thought out during the design and manufacture processes.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2004-02-16 13:46
Well, they were,Mark but it was north of the equator.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-02-16 17:26
Mark Pinner said:
> Those Buffet's must be great horns if you need to buy
> another barrel just to narrow the 12th and focus
> the throat registers. I would have thought that these
> issues may have been thought out during the
> design and manufacture processes
That's a fairly simplisitic thought for, as you well know, over the past decade Buffet has addressed some of these tuning issues by making changes in that direction.
The vintage R13's from the 1960's and early 70's (the years that are favored by a number of players) had a wonderful ringing, flexible sound but suffered from 12ths which tended to be wide, and weak resonance in the throat and bell tones. This was further exacerbated by the fact that many players at that time preferred a Kaspar style mouthpiece. Thus, to narrow the tuning parameters a reverse cone taper Moennig style barrel often helped.
In later years Buffet (in the R13 model) did make a few subtle changes to attempt to rectify tuning issues. Clark Fobes even surmises that the bore of the R13 may have been slightly changed in the early 80's. However, with the R13 as the flagship model, one can understand Buffet's reluctance to make any major changes - hence spawning the RC and Festival models.
Thus, if a Moennig or Chadash barrel helps to bring relief to a few tuning and resonance issues so be it. Personally, I use the original issued stock barrel on one of my favorite R13 Buffets (96xxx) and the tuning, resonance, and sound of that particular clarinet is superior. I have yet to find another clarinet (although I have many fine ones) exactly like it. Perhaps I got lucky, perhaps there are many others like this one.
The construction of clarinets (of all makes and models) is primarily about making compromises. No clarinet plays perfectly in tune. That is where the player and his inherent musicality comes in.
Play the clarinet - don't let it play you...GBK
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Author: calvinc
Date: 2004-02-16 17:35
Anyone know where to get chadash barrels at a reasonable price? :D Thanks!
-Calvin
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Author: Liquorice
Date: 2004-02-16 18:00
I've tried a Chadash barrel on a Prestige RC. It didn't work at all. They are clearly only intended for the R13 model.
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2004-02-16 20:53
My R13 Bb, the instrument on which I test the barrels that I make, was purchased for me from Moennig in 1962. For years I never understood why the barrel looked older than the rest of the instrument.
Later on I figured out the reason....It was NOT the original cylindrical barrel, but was one of Moennig's own stock, and the bore taper was very subtle. There was a display case full of barrels just inside the entrance to the shop (at the top of steep narrow stairs)
My present teacher (amazing how much I didnt learn when I knew it all in the 60's) tells me that in France, the R13 is considered a student horn, and that advanced players select Festivals or RCs.
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Author: SVSorna05
Date: 2004-02-17 00:01
Alexi, I have a '69 E&S which I like very much, i had a post several months earlier inquiring what size barrell this model had as it seemed that there was confusion between 65mm n 66mm. I found (I believe this was a player problem instead of a horn problem) but my long C and notes in that register had a tendancy to go flat. I bought the 65 mm Moennig and the tuning probolems have disappeared in that range + I have a way more even, projecting sound. I am curious as to what you decide to purchase. thanx
-Dain
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2004-02-17 01:00
Well, SVS, technically my horn should be very similar to yours. I have a 1970 E&S which I also like very much. And upon snooping in the case I found (underneat the velvet and foam padding) the original purchase receipt from 1970 stating that my uncle paid 300 dollars for it. So I'd say it was a VERY worthy purchase.
Eventually I'll get around to visiting a major distributor of clarinet items. I'll likely look at the chadash barrels since I now have a wonderful Greg Smith mouthpiece and he states that his mouthpieces tune well with the chadash barrels. I may try out other ones as well. Right now I'm using a Bartolai barrel. An obscure barrel, but for 50 dollars I think it was well worth it and it definitely helps me to control my instrument as well as softens the harshness it once had. (I can't say anything about tuning since I didn't have a tuner at the time. But I know overally my instrument has good intonation). I'm interested in checking out some other barrels to see if it will make it even better in tune or perhaps have a good effect on tone or projection. It may, it may not. We'll see when the time comes.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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