 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: bumpkin
Date: 2004-01-31 22:59
i am SOO confused about Leblanc clarinets. i have read a few of the older posts on this board. whats the difference between an infinite, an eternite and a Noblet model 45?? i got my new A clarinet for $1200, is that too much? it says Noblet and Eternite on it...they said that it would normally sell for like $4000 (my eyes popped out of my head at the price difference) but they got a deal or something, so they are selling it for less....a lot less. ive tried it and everything and it works beautifully. if it IS an eternite, is that better than the model 45? i see that A model 45's are about $900.
Post Edited (2004-01-31 23:44)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Bradley
Date: 2004-01-31 23:31
The Eternite is supposed to be a better model than the Noblet 45. The Eternite is listed as model 1142 in most catalogs that still have it.
Bradley
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Douglas
Date: 2004-02-01 02:53
About six years ago I went to the Leblanc factory in Kenosha to pick out an Eternite Bb after learning they would be discontinuing that model and I was offered a price I couldn't refuse. I tried about a dozen of the Eternites and picked out an especially nice one. What surprised me was that some of the Eternities were marked with the Noblet trademark, while most had the usual Leblanc trademark. They were all the same clarinet. I figured Lelbanc was discontinuing the model because they had too many "top" level models: The Opus, the Concerto, the Infinite as well and were obviously having trouble knowing where to place the Eternite in their marketing plans. The literature at the time stated that the Eternite model was identical to the Concerto except it had the jump keys and some of the other Leblanc type mechanisms. You most likely have a very nice A clarinet which is acoustically identical to the Concerto model.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Douglas
Date: 2004-02-01 03:01
Here's a follow-up to the comments I just made. The Leblanc catalog I got at the time I bought the Eternite stated: "The Eternite model offers the Concerto acoustic design but with the famous Leblanc mechanism, featuring in-line "Jump" trill keys. The patented trill key design provides a direct up-and-down movement between the tone hole and pad cup, which ensures positive seating of the pad and a clear tone." The specifications given are identical to the Concerto model except for the mechanism. The Eternite model is listed as 1142 and 1142A and was the same list price as the Concerto.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bumpkin
Date: 2004-02-01 04:56
sounds like i got a deal!
Does the fact that this model is discontinued have anything to do with the price? does it become more valuable with time (i mean in the near future) or is it still too soon to tell, since it was only discontinued a few years ago? i was trying to compare prices on ebay (not the best source, i know) but i i didnt find any, of the same model. do you know of any other credible sources i can compare prices to? i already tried ww&bw.
thanks
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Dee
Date: 2004-02-01 12:17
Are the words Noblet and Eternite on different sections of the clarinet? If so, then you have mixed parts. If they are on the same section of the clarinet, I'm really puzzled for as far as I know, the Eternite was never marked Noblet.
Secondly almost no clarinets increase in value with time. They lose value. The good ones (like Leblanc, Selmer, Buffet, Yamaha) lose it slower than others.
The Eternite could be purchased from any of the major mail order and internet dealers such as Woodwind & Brasswind for around $1200 to $1500 when it was still in production.
You bought yours for quite a reasonable price but you could have got that price at any time by comparison shopping.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Dee
Date: 2004-02-01 12:18
OOPS! I didn't see the post about the one person's factory visit and markings on the instrument so scratch that paragraph.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-02-01 12:22
Douglas reported, "The Eternite model offers.....the patented trill key design...which ensures positive seating of the pad and a clear tone."
Can anybody tell me how this affects tone? I'm feeling silly not knowing.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Douglas
Date: 2004-02-01 13:28
The advertising from Leblanc about their jump keys is just that: advertising. The only plus I've ever seen about the jump keys is that by putting the tone holes closer to the top of the instrument, there is less likelihood of having water in the tone holes. Ridenour, when he designed the Concerto and Opus models, moved the side keys back to the traditional placement, probably to make the instrument look more like the Selmers & Buffets on the market. Ridenour, when he designed the TR-147, placed the side keys in the traditional style, then later moved them to the "jump" placement, so he, at least, felt there was some merit in that placement. Leblanc has produced some good instruments, but their marketing style has always been somewhat extreme....I'll never forget an ad, years ago, that had ballerinas dancing on the keys of one of their Leblanc clarinets!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: bumpkin
Date: 2004-02-01 14:56
i just looked, and i saw that the barrel and the bell say "noblet eternite" on them and the two joints say "leblanc eternite". does this mean theyre mixed parts???
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: CrazyCanuck
Date: 2004-02-01 23:19
I have a Noblet eternite Bb.... I was told by the tech I bought it from that Leblanc was having trouble with where to place this model in their lineup (as previously mentioned above.)
Some of them have Leblanc Eternite, and some have Noblet Eternite... they are the same clarinet. I heard a rumour that the Leblanc ones had silver-plated keys (mine has nickel.)
Anybody who has a leblanc model have silver keys?? When mine was insured, replacement value was for a Concerto/or the new Symphonie.
Long story short, I love my clarinet, and it kicks ass over my friends with Buffet's.
Nick
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: JMcAulay
Date: 2004-02-02 04:16
Douglas asserts: "Ridenour, when he
designed the Concerto and Opus models, moved the side keys back to the traditional placement, probably to make the instrument look more like the Selmers & Buffets on the market."
Morales had nothing to do with that?
Anyway, the idea that the Leblanc design that had been in use for around 50 years was revised just to make it look like some other company's Clarinet seems utterly specious. "Gee, Marge, I was gonna buy one o' them R13s, or mebbe a new Selmer, but lookie here! That new Leblanc looks just like 'em now! Oh, boy, now I can get me a pair o' them things!"
Advertising, of course, is in itself weird. For those who watched the commercials in the Super Bowl game today: if Budweiser can sell beer by displaying horse flatulence, maybe anything's possible.
Regards,
John
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Douglas
Date: 2004-02-02 13:42
JMcAulay, you've made me curious...just what part do you think Morales had in designing the Opus/Concerto models? And if the removal of the jump style side keys wasn't for appearance, then just what was the intention? You seem to object to the ideas I've presented, but not given any other reasons for the change. Ridenour has stated that he tried to take the best from the Buffet R-13 and Selmer models and eliminate their problems in creating the Opus/Concerto models. Sounds like partial imitation at least.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-02-02 15:49
Douglas wrote "....The only plus I've ever seen about the jump keys is that by putting the tone holes closer to the top of the instrument, there is less likelihood of having water in the tone holes..."
It also means that the pads open vertically off the tone holes. That should theoretically make the pads last longer by eliminating an element of RUBBING action as the pads leave or approach the tone holes.
However a downside is that if one wants to increase the venting for any of these keys, one is very likely faced with keys hitting eachother - a rather frustrating exercise, requiring a range of modifications.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Don Berger
Date: 2004-02-02 17:00
Since the posts by Douglas, Gordon and John discuss the "jump" trill keys to some degree, this seems like a good thread in which to record Leblanc's patent # describing and CLAIMING them [Claims 9 and 10; long since expired, but still unique to LeB!]. It is US 1,926,489 issued in 1933 to Leon L and advertised ever since, I guess. Also described and claimed are some "octave" [properly "register"] and Bb tonehole keying structures which I've seen on bass and alto cls as late as the 1970's. This pat may be viewed [prob not copyable] on "www.uspto.gov", maybe only by making a search "clarinet AND Leblanc" and on some of the retrieved pats, clicking on the # listed under References Cited. I regard L's innovations highly and will be interested if they are still included on 21st century cls. TKS, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
